Steyn poised for national selection
8 Oct 2006
Luke Watson still won’t make the Springbok squad for the Ireland and English tests, but the national selectors will blood several in-form Currie Cup players.
The form of Pierre Spies gives White an escape not to pick Watson, although Spies has been devastating as a No 8 in the Absa Currie Cup and not as an open-side option. Watson, consistently, has been the best open-side flanker in the country, through the Super 14 and the Currie Cup. He was very good playing in a beaten pack in Western Province’s semi-final defeat and newspaper reports that played off his performance against that of Spies were outrageous. One played openside flank in a pack whose tight five got murdered. The other played No 8 in a pack that marched relentlessly to a final.
Most independent observers would laud the possibility of Watson playing as open-sider, Spies playing at No 8 and Juan Smith completing the loose-trio. For those who still argue that Watson misses out because there are better, don’t kid yourself. Watson misses out because White does not rate him and never will.
White this weekend told the Sunday newspapers, English and Afrikaans, that for the first time his focus was on winning the World Cup and not the next test. Let’s hope the national coach can maintain this supposed belief on tour. He mentioned a similar thing prior to the Tri Nations. Then the Boks got hammered by France and White feared for his job. His reaction was to stick with the same players who failed him the year before.
Injuries forced him to introduce younger players and Spies was one of those to benefit with two outstanding home tests against New Zealand and Australia. But before we get too carried away, look at the impact of Spies at No 8 in his test debut. Yeah, there was no impact because there was nothing happening among the tight five.
To beat Ireland and to get at least one win out of two against England will require a tight five that is dominant and not just competitive. The loosies in the northern hemisphere will only ever be as good as their tight five. And White and his selectors will have to think carefully about who goes and stays in that department.
Rudolf Straeuli also opted for a young tight five in 2002 to play France, Scotland and England. Deon Carstens, Bakkies Botha and Wessel Roux were all the stars of the domestic competition. They got smashed by teams, whose tight five were well versed in technique.
It will require a mix and match in selection if White is to succeed where all Bok teams have failed since 1997.
Taking younger loose-forwards and backs is to be applauded, but the wiser and more battle-hardened souls are the non negotiables among the pack.
Speculation, based on White having a banter with the Sunday newspapers, include the selection of Francois Steyn as a utility back, potentially Brad Barritt and Jaco Pretorius as a second string midfield combination and the injection of youth in Hilton Lobberts and Kabamba Floors. Chiliboy Ralepelle will again tour, despite the Bulls selectors rating him third, at best, in their current senior set-up – a rating I fully agree with when you consider the quality of Botha and replacement hooker Strauss.
White will not select overseas-based players like Cobus Visagie, although there is a very strong case to be made for Visagie, given he has given all the English props a torrid time in the last two seasons, while French-based Shaun Sowerby would be a ‘horses for courses’ selection.
White will continue to pick John Smit as his first choice hooker and captain, but Os du Randt and Percy Montgomery will be rested. There is also talk that White will ‘rest’ his best outside back in the last two tests in Breyton Paulse. Just why only the selectors would know because Paulse has played very few matches this year and has ended his overseas commitments with Clermont two months ago.
With Montgomery out, White can choose between Bevin Fortuin, JP Pietersen and Steyn, but it seems Johan Roets is very much in the Watson mould. Regardless of what he does, he won’t make the team.
Of the contracted Boks who SARU will be paying until the end of 2007, Hanyani Shimange, Eddie Andrews, Jaco van der Westhuyzen, Marius Joubert and De Wet Barry are unlikely to tour, while a decision has to be made on Jacques Cronje and Victor Matfield.
Joe van Niekerk, who has not had any rugby since the away leg of the Tri Nations, is also unclear about his tour involvement. Van Niekerk hurt his neck in August and it would be wiser to give him an additional month to make a complete recovery.
White’s biggest selection headache comes at lock. Matfield is the best contesting lineout in the world and Bakkies Botha is the best foil in a partnership to Matfield. Without Botha and Matfield, the likes of Johann Muller, Albert van den Berg and Danie Rossouw aren’t as imposing a prospect.
If you look at the two teams that will contest the Currie Cup final, the majority of the players are unlikely to feature in the touring squad. Of the Free Staters, Fortuin is the only probable backline inclusion, with Floors and Jannie du Plessis candidates among the pack. Among the Bulls, Ndungane and Wynand Olivier will probably tour, while Spies, Lobberts, Rossouw and Gary Botha should be in the national squad of 30. That’s less that 10 players out of the 30 coming from the two teams who have dominated the domestic competition.
652 Comments
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9 Oct 2006, 08:21 am
There’s a couple of things I noticed.
1.) The Bulls continously are offside in the backline.
2.) If you study the game you’ll see the Bulls fall off their feet over the ball so many times that there’s no fair contest. SA refs don’t blow for it but it is a rule strictly applied in SUPER 14
9 Oct 2006, 08:23 am
Carla Jane
Are you serious? You seriously should take the flaps off your eyes. Just to show how good Luke can be… Just close your eyes and think of Luke Playing Openside for the Bulls…
9 Oct 2006, 08:24 am
Keo Watson’s arrogance made him loose a lot of support including me, how many turnover did he make on Saturday , he’s playing way to loose thes days , he always standing at flyhalve , imagine having him and Victor together ???
No way WP can keep him, there are other loosies pushing as well Lobberts, Kabamba, Kuun their personalities are much better than Luke’s as well
9 Oct 2006, 08:25 am
Floors may be short, but he redeems himself by playing with suicidal guts. Luke has no redeeeming qualities as a player, he is short, slow, without the instinctive nous of great opensiders, without the strength to compete effectively on the ground…
Wannenburg may not be the greatest fetcher, but at least he offers something in the lineouts.
Van Niekerk may not be as strong as an ox, but at least he has pace and competes in lineouts.
Britz may be slow, but he puts himself in the right place at the right time.
Luke is, at best, our 5th choice opensider…
9 Oct 2006, 08:25 am
Martin
thanks man..did i\laugh when i saw that wp chucking his shirt away
9 Oct 2006, 08:26 am
Hou op om oor watson te huil kyk liewers na Hougard want hy is baas.
9 Oct 2006, 08:26 am
Student, you must be a 1st year student… there is no chance that Luke would even make the bench in Pta.
9 Oct 2006, 08:28 am
Student jy’s suur boet, jou span het weereens verloor toe dit moes tel , ja dis nou 3 verloor in ‘n ry.
Bulls is noe 5 de jaar in ‘n ry in cc final met al hulle spanne , word wakker staan op, gee eer en betoon respek want die “Baas” het nou net verby gegaan
9 Oct 2006, 08:28 am
Well done to the Bulls and Cheetahs.Shot to their supporters that sticked with their teams.
Its going to be a cracker come Saturday between the two strongest sides in SA.
9 Oct 2006, 08:28 am
Its funny how , in the start of the CC everybody was mad about Watson. Now that Spies is there they hate him. You know why…because he is not a bull. To everybody that said Watson had a bad game, look at the game very closely:
Spies and Watson didn’t have many one on one confrontations but,
Spies bumped watson off once (1 point for him),
Watson bumped spies off once,
TWICE watson stole the ball from spies, the one time he actually ripped the ball out of spies’ hands. The only critizism I have against him is that he tried to do too many on his own, but that usually happens when the rest of the team is not performing.
9 Oct 2006, 08:28 am
Carla Jane
What is this obsession with Lineouts. There are what, 25-30 lineouts in a game? I’d expect my two locks to take 80% of those. and the rest between the 8th man at the back and maybe another loosie. So, why do you need a 120 lineout options? The New Zealanders have only a few options and keep it very simple and kick our asses every time.
9 Oct 2006, 08:29 am
capebull-spot on.
9 Oct 2006, 08:29 am
Luke had a bad game – and don’t blame the rest of the team, after aal they beat the bulls 2 this year. Watson did not bring his game face when it mattered – finish en klaar!
9 Oct 2006, 08:31 am
carla jane, if i’m not mistaken he was playing opposite kuhn and not spies.
also, he made two of wp’s tries…
at the end of the day you cannot judge a player based on one game…
9 Oct 2006, 08:31 am
Keo die Bulls bestuur vir Chilly , wag tot volgende jaar , kyk hoe goed Lobberts bestruur word. Keo soek ‘n slag iets posetief oor die Bulls jou geliefde span Povince het soos die Strompies weereen uit die bus geval.
9 Oct 2006, 08:31 am
McCaw, Smith, Waugh would laugh at us if Watson had to become a Bok…
Not only because he is a poor player, but also because he’d embarras us with the way he looks like he is suffering for some great cause everytime he (surprisingly) tackles someone. His body language reminds me of 9 year-olds who want to show the crowd how tough they are. We’l become the laughing stock of world rugby if Luke had to ever wear the green and gold.
Besides, he has already shown his disrespect for the culture and tradition of Bok rugby with that cover picture of him tearing the Province jersy to reveal a Bok jersey. Cheap publicity! When Bobby did that, he could at least rely on some substance. All Luke can rely on is Keo
9 Oct 2006, 08:32 am
Capebull,
Go back to my first post. I think that just proves my point.
9 Oct 2006, 08:32 am
Carla, are you CJ…
9 Oct 2006, 08:34 am
Carla Jane
In interviews with Mccaw, Smith, Waught and Collins, seperately, each of them said they can’t see why Luke is out of the Bok team and Mccaw even went as far to say that Luke was the best opensider opponent of the SA teams.
9 Oct 2006, 08:35 am
Student, you are obviously failing your 1st year courses?
There is no obsession with lineouts, but it does help to have a player that offers something other than just the basic requirements. Luke offers neither the basics nor the extras. Every other opensider in the country offers his team something, Luke just offers a bad, childish attitude.
9 Oct 2006, 08:35 am
Student
Did McCaw play against Watson in the S14?
9 Oct 2006, 08:36 am
Daai ou op tv wat sy wp jersey wegegooi het … hehehe hoop hy kry in blou een) Dis dieselfde soos wat wp die game wegegooi het.
Hougard het julle naas stukkend geskop. Liefling se spel soos gewoonlik was bobaas. Kom mnr white maak oop jou oogies Hougard is S.A se no10
9 Oct 2006, 08:36 am
If I were McCaw and Smith I’d say the same thing… are you really that ignorant?
Why would they say that? Because they are scared of the alternatives. Do you think because they are being interviewed that they suddenly stop thinking about world cups and tri nations?
9 Oct 2006, 08:38 am
halfgk , Feite is :
Watson moes sy kant skoon hou en net jol. Kyk hoe het Nick the Mallet vir Andre Venter hanteer , al wat Venter gedoen het was om stil te bly en te jol.
Skinstad en Mallet het saam geval.
Wat maak Luke hy kritiseer heeldag en aldag vir Jake. Intussen is daar talle jong spelers wat net jol en ewewskielik is Luke nie meer so ver voor as wat hy dink nie.
As hy die game stats ontleed sal jy sien dat Luke in S14 omtrent die 5 de beste flank was, die volgende was voor hom.
Spies, Botes, P3, Juan, Schalk, en Vickus.
Luke leef nou op persepsies nie meer op feite nie.
9 Oct 2006, 08:38 am
Carla Jane
Are you some weird kind of idiot? Why would Mccaw be afraid of SA when he and Dan Carter single-handedly destroyed SA ON LOFTUS VERSFELD with a ton of Bulls in the team? Are you saying Richie Mccaw is scared of the Bulls?! hahahahaha
9 Oct 2006, 08:39 am
Province needs another opensider and another captain if they are to ever go beyond the semis. Luke is just not up to the task and I’m sure its only a matter of time before we see what his team mates think of his attitude… let’s just hope its his WP team mates and not his Bok team mates, we can’t afford another embarrassment b4 RWC 2007
9 Oct 2006, 08:42 am
If you read Keo’s articles only, it doesn’t make you a rugby student, it just makes you a Watson fan… any real student of the game would see the weaknesses of Watson and not allow the media to influence their judgement.
CapeBul, well put!
9 Oct 2006, 08:43 am
Kerneels,
No Richie was rested for this years S14 game between The Crusaders and the Stormers.
Luke was out-played by Jonny Leo’o that day.
9 Oct 2006, 08:47 am
Cane
I actually knew that – just wanted to prove a point. McCaw didn’t play against Watson, so I don’t think he’d say Watson is the best.
Anyway, everyone keeps saying Waugh, Smith and McCaw said all these things, where did they say it? Student?
9 Oct 2006, 08:47 am
Anyway, seems like the IQ of this room is dropping exponentially…
I’m rather going to pick MY bok squad for the end of year tour.
15.) Bevin Fortuin/JP Pietersen
14.) Jaco Pretorius/Breyton Paulse
13.) Jacque Fourie/Jaco Pretorius
12.) Jean de Villiers/Wynand Olivier
11.) Bryan Habana/Brent Russel
10.) Andre Pretorius/Willem de Waal
9.) Ruan Pienaar/Fourie du Preez
8.) AJ Venter/Pedrie Wannenburg
7.) Pierre Spies/Juan Smith
6.) Luke Watson/Kabamba Floors
5.) Victor Matfield/Albert van den Berg
4.) Danie Rossouw/Johan Muller
3.) CJ van der Linde/BJ Botha
2.) John Smit/Gary Botha
1.) Os du Randt/Deon Carstens
9 Oct 2006, 08:48 am
Watson was statistically the top SA flanker in this years S14 however,
although stats are all about individuals performance and don’t measure intangible benefits to your team,
like attitude or backing up, or being the dummy runner that made the gap that led to the try, or being the second guy at every tackle who slows the play down and prevents the opposition getting a break, etc…
9 Oct 2006, 08:48 am
RugbyStusent,
Lineouts provide the best first phase attacking options around, and the obsession as you call it is not based on winning your own lineouts. You are correct in saying that your locks should win them. But if you can steal or disrupt opposition lineouts, you create very dangerous attacking opportunities. that is where tall loosies in the AJ Venter and Spies mould come into their own and can swing matches. Look at what we did to the Auzzies in Oz last year. We took about 6 of their lineouts in a a row. It crushed their spirit, robbed them of posession and eventually lost them the game.
The obsession is not with Lineouts, its about posession.
And by the way, your petulance is kind of embarrassing.
9 Oct 2006, 08:49 am
RugbyStudent
JP Pieterson is not international material
9 Oct 2006, 08:49 am
RugbyStudent, change your name, son. You are making a fool of yourself and all the real rugby students out there…
When did I say McCaw is scared of the bulls? It will help McCaw if we had to choose a small, slow opensider with an attitude that stinks…
9 Oct 2006, 08:50 am
FFS, Luke is a world class player, yes he was outplayed this Sat, but everybody has an off day!
methinks that he was just to hyped for the game and tried to beat the Bulls single handedly instead of playing with his team….. this will pass with maturity
LW will be an asset to any national team, and if he went to the bulls (remember the bulls made his a huge offer) all of the bulls fan would want him to be in the Bok squad !
Its such a pity that we Saffas are so provincialistic that we cant seem to rate a player on his ability….. but rather for the team he plays!
And I am an avid BULLS FAN !!
9 Oct 2006, 08:50 am
rugby student
Would you REALLY chose Luke at #6 ??
9 Oct 2006, 08:50 am
Rugbystudent we the only team thats beaten the ABs so go smoke it.
Liefling has proven this far every game why he the best no10 this country has seen.
Naas looked like a scarecrow compared to Hougard.
Oh yeah one more thing this year LIEFLING will play in the FINAL so you might as well hand us the cup Now
9 Oct 2006, 08:51 am
Rugby student, why why why why why why would you choose Luke Watson? Explain to us your reason, pleeeeeeease.
9 Oct 2006, 08:52 am
Are you guys telling me that Luke Watson, playing behind a losing pack all year and still plays good rugby is worthless? Are you guys saying that a respected opponent like Richie Mccaw and Phil Waugh will go on TV (Boots and All) and say that Watson is a good player for no reason?
9 Oct 2006, 08:52 am
What’s your IQ, rugby student?
9 Oct 2006, 08:55 am
…and I am a Province fan! but I find it so difficult to support a team that is captained by such a bad attitude who is not worthy of the jersey or the number 6, let alone the captaincy. Drop Luke or send him to the Spears, I want my team back, the team of Carel du Plessis, Morne, Divan, Andrews and Bekker
9 Oct 2006, 08:55 am
carla jane.. hello sweetness!
9 Oct 2006, 08:55 am
My touring team would look like this:
15.Johan Roets
14.Bryton Poulse
13.Jeaque Fourie
12.Jean De Veliers
11.Phillip Burger(a betjie windgat!)
10.Andre Pretorius
9.Fourie Du Preez
8.Piere Spies
7.A.J Venter
6.Luke Watson
5.Ross Skeate
4.Hottie Louw
3.Cobus Visagie
2.John Smit (C)
1.Eddie Andrews
REPLACEMENT XV
15.Geo Aplon
14.Akona Ndunganie
13.Mourie
12.Dries Scholts
11.Bryan Habana
10.Derick Hougaard
9.Ruan Pienaar
8.Diak
7.Lobberts
6.Floors
5.Brits
4.Pieterse
3.B.J Botha
2.Gary Botha
1.Ollie Le Roux
9 Oct 2006, 08:55 am
john … john smit I presume.
That would explain allot.
9 Oct 2006, 08:56 am
Hellooo Ricane
Luke wasn’t outplayed. Stormers won against Crusaders.
And to all the other idiots: All you ever moan about is Luke’s attitude, the way he walks and what he says. Look at his game. Now he is good. With a better tight five he could be devastating.
9 Oct 2006, 08:56 am
Drunkmonkey
We won the All Blacks after they took every last cup from our cabinet and even the one that we handed to ourselves by ‘accident’ (hahaha, still can’t believe Joost).
I hope Jake White doesn’t pick Watson or Floors or any smallish player for the end of year tour. I mean ‘we can only win with the biggest pack in history’ or can we? Where have I heard this before? In SA’s obsession with having 5 lineout forwards, how many games have we won against the top opposition in the last 5 years? With these big okes, how many games have we won overseas?
9 Oct 2006, 08:57 am
carla jane your wp boys you want back are a bit old… If WP had won teh Currie cuo would you still suggest that Luke is a problem? Who else should captain the side????
9 Oct 2006, 08:57 am
Francois Steyn is kak. What do you people see in the guy? He had ONE good game against wp in the rain. He was shocking on saturday. He couldnt handle the pressure. He should play ALOT more rugby before even considering the guy. If they want a guy who can kick the ball, pick de waal or derick. derick is also young(and already a bok, so he doesnt have to give out new caps), so if he is builing for the future, that doesnt qualify the guy over derick in any case. Jake goes on and on about not making the springbok jersey cheap, but then he gives it to undeserving guys, like bosman, tyibilika and now possibly steyn, while leaving guys like ettiene botha and watson in the dark. This doesnt make any sence…
9 Oct 2006, 08:58 am
Rugby Student, you are either illiterate or dumb or both…
We have gone through this already. why do you think Waugh says Watson is a good opensider? C’mon, think a bit, allow both brain cells to work together just for a second.
If we were to let Waugh pick our team for us, I hope they’ll allow John Smit to pick their team, C’mon, grow up. If Waugh’s comments is your reason for wanting to pick Watson, then I’ve had enough of arhuing with you… You have not provided any substance
9 Oct 2006, 08:58 am
Nobody is scared of the Bulls when an international referee handles the game. The Bulls’claim to fame is that they can beat SA opposition when SA refees are officiating. You only have to look at the past season of Super Rugby to realise this.
They won all their games against SA opposition and only 3/9 against international opposition. Surely this tells you something.? They are **** and SA referees feel they owe them something.
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