Steyn poised for national selection
8 Oct 2006
Luke Watson still won’t make the Springbok squad for the Ireland and English tests, but the national selectors will blood several in-form Currie Cup players.
The form of Pierre Spies gives White an escape not to pick Watson, although Spies has been devastating as a No 8 in the Absa Currie Cup and not as an open-side option. Watson, consistently, has been the best open-side flanker in the country, through the Super 14 and the Currie Cup. He was very good playing in a beaten pack in Western Province’s semi-final defeat and newspaper reports that played off his performance against that of Spies were outrageous. One played openside flank in a pack whose tight five got murdered. The other played No 8 in a pack that marched relentlessly to a final.
Most independent observers would laud the possibility of Watson playing as open-sider, Spies playing at No 8 and Juan Smith completing the loose-trio. For those who still argue that Watson misses out because there are better, don’t kid yourself. Watson misses out because White does not rate him and never will.
White this weekend told the Sunday newspapers, English and Afrikaans, that for the first time his focus was on winning the World Cup and not the next test. Let’s hope the national coach can maintain this supposed belief on tour. He mentioned a similar thing prior to the Tri Nations. Then the Boks got hammered by France and White feared for his job. His reaction was to stick with the same players who failed him the year before.
Injuries forced him to introduce younger players and Spies was one of those to benefit with two outstanding home tests against New Zealand and Australia. But before we get too carried away, look at the impact of Spies at No 8 in his test debut. Yeah, there was no impact because there was nothing happening among the tight five.
To beat Ireland and to get at least one win out of two against England will require a tight five that is dominant and not just competitive. The loosies in the northern hemisphere will only ever be as good as their tight five. And White and his selectors will have to think carefully about who goes and stays in that department.
Rudolf Straeuli also opted for a young tight five in 2002 to play France, Scotland and England. Deon Carstens, Bakkies Botha and Wessel Roux were all the stars of the domestic competition. They got smashed by teams, whose tight five were well versed in technique.
It will require a mix and match in selection if White is to succeed where all Bok teams have failed since 1997.
Taking younger loose-forwards and backs is to be applauded, but the wiser and more battle-hardened souls are the non negotiables among the pack.
Speculation, based on White having a banter with the Sunday newspapers, include the selection of Francois Steyn as a utility back, potentially Brad Barritt and Jaco Pretorius as a second string midfield combination and the injection of youth in Hilton Lobberts and Kabamba Floors. Chiliboy Ralepelle will again tour, despite the Bulls selectors rating him third, at best, in their current senior set-up – a rating I fully agree with when you consider the quality of Botha and replacement hooker Strauss.
White will not select overseas-based players like Cobus Visagie, although there is a very strong case to be made for Visagie, given he has given all the English props a torrid time in the last two seasons, while French-based Shaun Sowerby would be a ‘horses for courses’ selection.
White will continue to pick John Smit as his first choice hooker and captain, but Os du Randt and Percy Montgomery will be rested. There is also talk that White will ‘rest’ his best outside back in the last two tests in Breyton Paulse. Just why only the selectors would know because Paulse has played very few matches this year and has ended his overseas commitments with Clermont two months ago.
With Montgomery out, White can choose between Bevin Fortuin, JP Pietersen and Steyn, but it seems Johan Roets is very much in the Watson mould. Regardless of what he does, he won’t make the team.
Of the contracted Boks who SARU will be paying until the end of 2007, Hanyani Shimange, Eddie Andrews, Jaco van der Westhuyzen, Marius Joubert and De Wet Barry are unlikely to tour, while a decision has to be made on Jacques Cronje and Victor Matfield.
Joe van Niekerk, who has not had any rugby since the away leg of the Tri Nations, is also unclear about his tour involvement. Van Niekerk hurt his neck in August and it would be wiser to give him an additional month to make a complete recovery.
White’s biggest selection headache comes at lock. Matfield is the best contesting lineout in the world and Bakkies Botha is the best foil in a partnership to Matfield. Without Botha and Matfield, the likes of Johann Muller, Albert van den Berg and Danie Rossouw aren’t as imposing a prospect.
If you look at the two teams that will contest the Currie Cup final, the majority of the players are unlikely to feature in the touring squad. Of the Free Staters, Fortuin is the only probable backline inclusion, with Floors and Jannie du Plessis candidates among the pack. Among the Bulls, Ndungane and Wynand Olivier will probably tour, while Spies, Lobberts, Rossouw and Gary Botha should be in the national squad of 30. That’s less that 10 players out of the 30 coming from the two teams who have dominated the domestic competition.
652 Comments
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9 Oct 2006, 08:58 am
Luke Watson was geweeg die naweek en is te lig gevind…10 punte wat hy ons gegee het
9 Oct 2006, 08:59 am
Luke is a good player.
He looks very good at openside in SA but would stack up internationally.
SA doesn’t have a very good fetcher, but do you need one?
SA do have very good ball carriers, linebreakers and lineout players at #6,7 & 8… so why not play to your strengths and have 3 big tall linebreakers that support each other.
It worked in your last international game.
9 Oct 2006, 09:01 am
Capebull
I agree with you about Botes and P3 (Botes is another player that can easily become a Bok).
They were brilliant in the S14. But Spies wasn’t that great in the S14. Maybe above average but thats it. He is a great player now though.
Oh, and of the players you mentioned, only 1 is a real fetcher.
9 Oct 2006, 09:02 am
Kobus this morning said that , Wp’s primary source of ball is Kicks on Wp and turnover ball.
What about the first phases, line outs , scrums , Kobus ???
Kobus this morning said that WP lacks in training skills and training facilities behind the Bulls , wie se skuld is dit.
and then please …. Povince played an inexperienced team 11 players first semi’s , well the Bulls had 9 first timers and a new coach.
So stop moaning take the loss soos ‘n man.
What happened the all the Bulls bashers from friday, wpweee,Tony, capeflets ect…
9 Oct 2006, 09:02 am
I’m a little pissed off at the wp boys .. if they were not interested playing in the semies, they sould have stepped aside for the Lions. Some really pathetic ball handeling skills by province really made it allot easier for the bulls than it sould have been.
Well done to the bulls and cheetahs. It is a 50/50 final with the bulls going in as slight favourits I would say. I will however be supporting the cheetahs on the day.
Goooooo Cheetahs.
9 Oct 2006, 09:04 am
Luke is a good provincial Captain, I heard that OS says that if Luke becomes a BOk he will leave.
9 Oct 2006, 09:04 am
Ig
Supa is asking if there is any problems with the site…he can’t get is and he wants to give all the WP supporters gas!!!!!!!!!please help the man
9 Oct 2006, 09:04 am
What about the Bulls last try by Hottie ?
9 Oct 2006, 09:04 am
Veii
Ross Skeate?Hottie louw???
When will you people learn you need some big hard working guys in the enjine room. hottie louw is a bench player with the bulls. van scouwenburg and fondse and pieterse and botha(griekwas) are the guys who should get a look in. also ackerman and muller are already boks and have both been good this season
9 Oct 2006, 09:05 am
halfgk
g’day,
I was actually just looking for a reaction with that comment.
I know the Stormers won but Watson and Leo’o were fairly even;
Both made 3 line breaks and 1 turnover
Leo’o 3 go forwards vs watson 0
Leo’o 6 tackles, watson 10
but Leo’o scored a try.
9 Oct 2006, 09:05 am
Steyn – yup got his mail – trying to get him sorted out !
9 Oct 2006, 09:07 am
Yoda did n’t you read their posts on Friday they chose ” the dentist” for that role.
Like most of Wp he also ended up as big talk little play……….
9 Oct 2006, 09:08 am
This Bull basher is still here… I hope you guys get your asses kicked this sat.
When Luke became captain of my team, I decided to change allegiences until WP becomes respectable again, so I’m a Cheetah lady this weekend!
9 Oct 2006, 09:09 am
again, I think we need a little balance here. Just because the Bulls won on Saturday does not mean that the Entire WP team was worthless. Luke is a great player. Is he as good as the hype surrounding him? i dont think anybody could be. Is he a great player who had an average game? Absolutely.
Even great teams lose games. Brilliant players have off days. And the next day the sun comes up anyway. If the Bulls lost the semi, would that make Spies a poephol? Clearly not.
WP had a great CC season and did very well. It bodes well for their S14 and CC next year. You chaps can keep your heads high, you never gave up and scored some sublime tries.
9 Oct 2006, 09:11 am
Os says he’ll leave if Luke is picked??? Are you serious?
I’ll be wearing a black jersey if Luke is picked.
9 Oct 2006, 09:11 am
Dis Luke se eie skuld, as hy dalk sy bek gehou het die hele jaar dan sou mense hom nie vandag so verskeur nie
9 Oct 2006, 09:12 am
team vs ireland
15. pieterson
14. paulse
13. fourie
12. de villiers
11. habana
10. james
9. pienaar
8. spies
7. smith
6. watson
5. ackerman
4. muller
3. van der linde
2. smith
1. sephaka
16. bj botha
17. gary botha
18. danie roussouw
19. loberts
20. du preez
21. jaco pretorius
22. russel
9 Oct 2006, 09:13 am
will luke even start for the stormers next year with schalk and big joe back? diack, joe and schalk would probably be the best combo with luke on the bench ahead of melck
9 Oct 2006, 09:13 am
JP Pietersen is probably the most overrated rugby player in this country!!!
If you thought PIETER ROSSOUW was bad in giving us all HEART ATTACKS? JP is 10 times worse!!
Gio Aplon, by far the best fullback in the CC this year, is not even mentioned in this article!
Ludicrous!?!
9 Oct 2006, 09:13 am
kemp
pieterson is not international material
9 Oct 2006, 09:13 am
Luke is an average player who had another average game on Sat…
He has never been better than average, unless you believe Keo’s praise singing, in which case Luke is about to walk on water
9 Oct 2006, 09:14 am
Ricane,
I have been watching the Air New Zeeland Cup and i must say i have been overcome with indifference at the quality of the rugby. If you honestly think that there was a vast difference in the level of play, you must surely allow for some tunnel vision.
I saw a lot of 1 & 2 channel bash-em rugby. and some backline moves. almost as an afterthought.
any thoughts?
9 Oct 2006, 09:14 am
Bluebarb , Province was outplayed and experience played a big role.
But yes they did well with a young side this season , and one can just hope for next season.
9 Oct 2006, 09:17 am
i don’t know what everyone has against jp pieterson. he and russell were our most dangerous backs on sat (which isnt much of an achievement). jp is good at drawing 2 defenders and giving a quick pass to create gaps. also notice how well jp manages to stand in the tackle even when he is isolated, he gives the support time to get back
9 Oct 2006, 09:17 am
Luke Watson is only a rumour..
Pierre Spies is for real…!
Pierre Spies for president…!
9 Oct 2006, 09:19 am
Bluebarb,
I normally only read the comments but I must say you are probably the only person on this site thats writing sense. Rugby is bigger than one player and I’m sure Luke knows this so I don’t know why most of you you are on his case everyday. Carla Jane if a captain changes the team you support then you’re obviously not a true supporter.
9 Oct 2006, 09:23 am
And so it continues. KEO are you not gettind a little obsessive? I I were Luke I would be getting a little nervous. What game were you watching on Saturday? Watson would make a pretty reasonable centre but that is where it stops. He made some silly mistakes with one resulting in a try for the Bulls. How can you beat a bulls pack if one of your players spends 80% of the time at outside centre? I stand to be corrected but he didnt turn over 1 ball and he did not put any pressure on Hougie. He doesnt do his job.
Congratulations Bulls and Cheetahs, you are the best two sides at present and deserve to contest the final. Beware the Sharks next year though.
9 Oct 2006, 09:28 am
Kemp, please make taht team wear Blue Hoops not green and gold , the last time I looked we had to pick the best team for Green and Gold.\
Peterson and Barrit are same as Luke.
9 Oct 2006, 09:28 am
Bluebarb, Sup boet
Its just disappointing that the Sharks kicked away all their posession and when we did run in the second half we crossed the advantage line a few times which begs the question what was the game plan?
9 Oct 2006, 09:29 am
Ig, what is your mail addy for the ticket give-away?
9 Oct 2006, 09:29 am
keepin_it_real:
Dont get me wrong! JP’s GOOD! but OVERRATED!!
He’s one of those…always gonna be great currie cup player. period!
and so will Bevan Fortuin, Willem De Waal, Derick Hougaard, Wynand Olivier, JP Nel, Egon Seconds, Hanyani Shimange etc.
We should stop settling for mediocrity!!
and start bringing dynamic players to our national team…
the Aplon’s, the Pierre Spies’ etc
We all know that each and every player has the skills to play at international level…but it’s what’s between their ears is what will keep them there and become a winning team…
9 Oct 2006, 09:30 am
Thats why WP lost there was only one player on the field LUKE , nobody says anything about the other 14, every now and then you Gio
9 Oct 2006, 09:30 am
by the way,
Has anyone considered how Spies and Watson will do playinf for the same team…Spies taking 3 men out with his runs and Watson creating gaps….
9 Oct 2006, 09:31 am
Hef #380 – webmaster at hsm coza
9 Oct 2006, 09:32 am
Can people stop saying “We won this team or that team”. The correct grammar is “We BEAT this team or that team.” You can use the word won in a sentence such as: “We WON the game against New Zealand, or Province etc.”
9 Oct 2006, 09:33 am
Good Morning All – my head still hurts!!! It seems I swallow my words and predictions from Friday – got them both wrong!
Firstly – Well done to the Bulls and all their supporters on this site. It was a great win and no excuses from WP side. Bulls just did everything better on the day and deserve to be in the final.Province will be back next season no doubt.
Secondly – to all the bloggers who have nothing better than to trash Luke – shame on you – I always thought rugga was a 15 man game. Luke had an average game behind a pack that got mauled – why keep faulting his play – at least he keeps trying and introduces more creativity to the game than any other of the loosies out there at the moment. We should be encouraging creativity , not trashing it!
Thirdly – if WP were Kak, what the f… happened to the Sharks – they did not pitch for the game at all!! – very disappointing to say the least – It is a pity the Lions wre not playing instead – they would have done better I’m sure.
9 Oct 2006, 09:33 am
Thanks Ig, sent one through!
9 Oct 2006, 09:33 am
PML
9 Oct 2006, 09:34 am
All Bulls, check my post 230. Just to congratulate all the Bulls again. Well played guys, you deserved your win.
So Supa, Grootblou, Steyn, Bluebarb, GWB, Superbul, Bulla and all the other Bulls fans, well done.
9 Oct 2006, 09:36 am
More Tony
9 Oct 2006, 09:36 am
I agree with valjean, rather consider the possibilities offered by playing Spies and Watson together instead of playing the one of against the other. Add Juan Smith to the mix and you`re looking at one helluva combination.
9 Oct 2006, 09:37 am
the wp forwards always get dominated in big matches. and it always amazes me how after the match wp supporters will be campaigning for their whole forward pack to be given bok blazers
9 Oct 2006, 09:37 am
More Pieterman! Het vir jou email gestuur vanoggend, maar sukkel met my server.
9 Oct 2006, 09:37 am
rugga, I agree with you on Luke there. The man is 22 years old – he’s shown a hell of a lot of maturity even with all the criticism, the Jake White saga etc. The guy plays his heart out every single game and eventhough I’m not a Luke fan, I’ll still gladly pick him in the Bok no 6 jersey just because you know that you’ll never get less than 100% commitment and effort from him. Just my opinion.
9 Oct 2006, 09:37 am
More Tony, pieterman, KIR – how’s your MOnday going?
9 Oct 2006, 09:37 am
Top 10 retarted comments made the past week or so…
10.
JULLE KON SE WAT JUL WIL MA WATSON GAN DIE JAAR DIE KOPPIE OM HOOG HOU!
Comment by skaap : October 2, 2006 @ 9:25 am
9.
Liefling will be the song of mourning at Loftus on Saturday. WP to weather the initial onslaught and then out think, out run, out pass and out score the one dimensional and limited huff puffs from the North. Down go the Smurfs, down, down.
Comment by 3rdday : October 6, 2006 @ 11:26 am
8.
I really can’t see the Bulls taking this one.
Their great improvement is akin to the Boks “comeback†against 1 grossly over-rated team and another game against a team that couldn’t give a damn because they’d already won.
WP’s backline has too much firepower, and the Bulls will be starved for possession all day with Luke showing Spies how it’s done.
What I’m saying, Supa, is that they may thrill your socks off when playing an outfit like the (disinterested) Cheetahs, or the (blowing hot/cold) Sharks, but when they come up against a professional, world-class squad like WP, the illusion gets shattered.
No-one’s blaming them for being sub-standard, it’s just the harsh truth.
Comment by Twig : October 3, 2006 @ 4:29 pm
7.
TSHWANE will be awash with a flood of tears on Saturday night, like sweet dew-drops from heaven. I’m gonna go out and let myself get absolutely soaking wet.
Comment by pierre : October 4, 2006 @ 2:55 pm
6.
Hoekom stry julle mense so baie. Dis ‘n uitgemaakte saak dis ‘n WP Vs Sharks final op Nuweland
Supa julle het Saterdag julle final gespeel. Dis 1 game te ver vir julle. Ons het julle dood gemaak op Nuweland. Se my wat het verander tussen dan en nou.
Comment by capeflatsboy : October 2, 2006 @ 1:20 pm
5.
Luke will prove Saturday that Spies is just a flash in the pan. Easy to be a hero when there is no pressure…..
fact is, province will beat the bulls on Saturday, and pretoria will be their sour old selves blaming the ref, luke watson cheating etc.
Comment by wp_cc_champs_07 : October 5, 2006 @ 3:10 pm
4.
I agree there is no Spies vs Watson fued, mainly because Spies does not even feature. Get real, the guy plays 2 good games, ever, against Cheetahs they only mentioned his name halfway through the 2nd half. He doesnt win balls, he doesnt ruck or maul, he doesnt scrum, what the hell does he do?
Spies isnt worth the ink they waste on him in the papers, he is the same as Jaco VDW and Ndungane, players made great by Die Beeld in Pretoria and not on the field.
Comment by WP-Man : October 2, 2006 @ 8:31 am
3.
Quinny – De Kock was ****… Stop trying to butter us WP okes up! Revenge at Newlands against the Sharks on the 14 Oct…
2006 WP Currie Cup Champs
2007 Stormers Super 14 champs…
Comment by bigg : October 5, 2006 @ 2:07 pm
2.
Biggest maych of their lives?
Please, the bulls don’t even deserve to be in the semis.
This is just a warm up match for the final.
A match against the Valke would have been a better challange.
Comment by Skim : October 3, 2006 @ 4:43 pm
Number one!
300,jurgens,well…you arent a wp speler,thank goodness!
half those ous at moftus wouldnot make the wp B team.we crave creativity down here not stale gunk.
Comment by macdaddy : September 29, 2006 @ 12:25 pm
9 Oct 2006, 09:38 am
kir, there are only a few contenders for higher honours in the Province pack. Luke, Diack and Francois vd Merwe.
9 Oct 2006, 09:39 am
thehef- same old **** different day. lol, how things goin boet?
9 Oct 2006, 09:39 am
can’t believe all these Watsons bashers are so close minded!! Luke had a good game behind a losing pack, if he is so **** how come he can side step the Bulls backline players to set up tries?? Sure he missed a tackle or two but so did Spies and just about everyone else.
you are all full of **** dissing Watson in one breath saying he doesn’t add lineout options (why do you need 5 options anyway I don’t know?? FS didn’t lose out on the weekend with only 2!!!) and then punt Floors who is even smaller than Watson. We are really lucky in this country to have a load of loosie options but nobody does the work that Watson does in stealing and slowing ball.
Loosie options for WC:
- Spies
- Watson
- Burger (still need to see if he will be teh same player after the injury as he will never be able to fly in like he used to)
- Smith
- Big Joe
Come on guys take your glasses off and give the guy his due!
9 Oct 2006, 09:39 am
More Supa, baie geluk ou grote!
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