Henry names uncapped quartet
18 Oct 2009
Graham Henry has announced four uncapped players as well as a coaching re-structuring for the All Blacks’ tour of Europe.
Flyhalf Mike Delany, fullback Ben Smith, wing Zac Guildford and utility back Tamati Ellison have all been included in the 33-man squad, while Joe Rokocoko got the axe. Isaac Ross, Hosea Gear and Aled de Malmanche were also left out.
Piri Weepu (ankle), Isaia Toeava (pelvis), Lelia Masaga (shoulder), Keven Mealamu (chest), Bryn Evans (back), Richard Kahui (shoulder) and Ali Williams (Achilles) were all not considered due to injury.
Meanwhile, under-fire Steve Hansen will no longer look after the forwards, Henry taking over that role. Hansen will be attack coach, while Wayne Smith will look after defence.
New Zealand play Australia in Tokyo, Wales, Italy, England, France and the Barbarians.
New Zealand squad (with caps in brackets): John Afoa (Auckland – 20 Test caps), Anthony Boric (North Harbour – 10), Dan Carter (Canterbury – 62), Jimmy Cowan (Southland – 28), Wyatt Crockett (Canterbury – 1), Mike Delany (Bay of Plenty – 0), Stephen Donald (Waikato – 16), Tom Donnelly (Otago – 1), Jason Eaton (Taranaki – 13), Andy Ellis (Canterbury – 11), Tamati Ellison (Wellington – 0), Corey Flynn (Canterbury – 5), Owen Franks (Canterbury – 6), Zac Guildford (Hawke’s Bay – 0), Andrew Hore (Taranaki – 43), Cory Jane (Wellington – 8), Jerome Kaino (Auckland – 22), Tanerau Latimer (Bay of Plenty – 3), Brendon Leonard (Waikato – 12), Luke McAlister (North Harbour – 28), Richie McCaw (Canterbury – 76, captain), Liam Messam (Waikato – 2), Mils Muliaina (Waikato – 77), Ma’a Nonu (Wellington – 42), Kieran Read (Canterbury – 12), Sitiveni Sivivatu (Waikato – 39), Rodney So’oialo (Wellington – 60), Ben Smith (Otago – 0), Conrad Smith (Wellington – 29), Adam Thomson (Otago – 12), Brad Thorn (Canterbury – 33), Neemia Tialata (Wellington – 37), Tony Woodcock (North Harbour – 58).
97 Comments
18 Oct 2009, 10:56 am
I’m too blue to think about the AB’s. My WP and me are too sore.
18 Oct 2009, 10:59 am
Isaac Ross dropped as he is made the scapegoat lock for the poor AB lineout.
18 Oct 2009, 11:04 am
18 Oct 2009, 11:09 am
#1 The Jinxta: Howzit Jinx. does two sore hearts make it okay? I feel the same mate.
You can be very proud of your team. WP lost but they played with huge heart and they played very well. It was a cracker of a game.
Now good luck to both Bulls and Cheetahs in the final. May the best team win.
18 Oct 2009, 12:50 pm
All we need is Two World Class Locks, a Hooker who can throw straight, with accuracy, and hey……..the WC is Ours.
And I almost forgot ……….a 6’3″ Prop to do a bit of line-out lifting.
18 Oct 2009, 12:55 pm
The blacks will still have a strong starting 15 but there depth will be tested again if there are key injuries as they have a hard tour all in 6 weeks aussie, france ,wales, england and italy and then babaas thats not easy.
I think it shows in the past ten years how eroded the depth of talent in NZ rugby has become, could you imagine Ben Smith, delaney. latimar, boric and donald making the 97 Abs team or the 05-06 team. The problem is hard to fix because you can’t blame players for leaving NZ to the Uk for 4 times the pay. They still produce the best age group players so will always hold onto a good 15-20 players but the rest of them are leaving and finally they can’t plug the gaps anymore. Here is an example in 97 when the blacks were at there brilliant best if Walter little an inside centre got injured they could choose from the following ( excuse spelling ) Alama iremia, Lee stenseness, Scott McLeod, Tony Marsh, Eroni Clark even John Leslie who never got a look in! not a bad lot to choose from, now when they lose a inside centre they have to put an average fly half donald at centre??
I still expect them to win all there games but I wouldn’t rate my chances against France if carter and mccaw were injured and the replacements were delany and latimar no disrespect to them but it’s a different league.
18 Oct 2009, 13:17 pm
#6 west:
Westie,
9.7 out ten on the spelling Champ.
18 Oct 2009, 13:38 pm
Dagg and Gear have also missed out here.
Am I the only person in the country who thinks that Mils is off his game and maybe needs to go the same way as Roko?
Maybe after this tour we will know one way or the other.
Mils, Hore and Nonu are very likely to play in 2011. These are all areas where we are still working out a number 2.
A pitty we did not try something more in the centers. Thank ****** Toeava is injured anyway.
Ellis can think himself lucky because when Canterbury play I really don’t see a big difference between him and Keats (I think that Keats is improving well though)
18 Oct 2009, 13:48 pm
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
“Am I the only person in the country who thinks that Mils is off his game “.
Most likely:
A Team under pressure makes many individuals look less than Supernatural.
The 2nd best FB in the Country is in the Team, so what is your point?
18 Oct 2009, 14:00 pm
#6. Good point made there, the taller your lifters, the higher the locks will rise. Maybe thats why Aus struggled in their lineout this year. This is the basis of Jake White’s argument for tall loose forwards too. Stupid to ignore a short Bulldog like Brussouw though.
Requirements to win a world cup:
1) settled combinations
2) experience
3) a brilliant youngster (Horan, Steyn)
4) a few tester pool games
5) strong captaincy
NZ have two years to 2 years to work on the above.
18 Oct 2009, 14:01 pm
#11 add superb physical conditioning and a drop kicker to the above;)
18 Oct 2009, 14:05 pm
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
I dont think you have any need to try out anything in the centres in Luke McAlister and conrad smith you have to brillent centres throw in nonu and there is no real problems there. From a neutral perspective I cant believe how people in NZ just dont rate Conrad Smith i think he has been your more consistent back over the past two years he has scored some stunning tries and set up countless tries he also is a brillent tackler. The big problems you have is your forwards and especially the lineout fix that and you are nearly there.
From what i have seen of Muliaina he hasnt had a great year but lets put it into perspective who in the Abs has had a great year McCaw hasnt been at his best but you would never drop him??
18 Oct 2009, 14:05 pm
No Gear, Dagg, Maitland??? And the ABs are still short some decent forwards besides McJaw
18 Oct 2009, 14:12 pm
#10 Lions_Soutie:
Have to agree you cant win a world cup with unsettled combinations, look at henry at the 07 world cup he didnt play the same team togeather in pool games once and then comes quarter final time…… . Look how settled the Aussies were in 91-99 Horan and little had been playing togeather since they were 12!!, england 03 and the boks 07 were very settled teams.
18 Oct 2009, 15:09 pm
#9 cane:
Why Smith over Dagg?
18 Oct 2009, 15:44 pm
#15 David:
Dagg is too hot’n'cold. Ive seen him miss too many highballs for my liking, almost as bad as watching Percey.
Cant believe they didnt take Maitland, he’s got way more upside than Guildford.
18 Oct 2009, 17:16 pm
I was quite intrigued by Brad Thorn’s comments that the French tests in NZ this year were far more physical than any of the Tri-Nations games in 2009.
I think the Boks are in for a rude awakening in Paris this November.
18 Oct 2009, 17:43 pm
will the abs beatthe aussies in japan i say ja oh my poor sharkies
18 Oct 2009, 19:24 pm
#17 kwas: I understand now why your nic is Kwas, because you are one
Boks are not playing in Paris!! KWAS!
18 Oct 2009, 20:13 pm
Hey guys. I understand this about the AB’s squad issues, but this is my opinion on our own:
Amidst all of the Springbok glory and success, are a few niggles about our depth or lack there of. Lots of people feel that we don’t have adequate back-up for our dominant starting XV that will tour the Northern hemisphere soon. People seem to think we have a depth “crisis”. I actually disagree. Looking at fullback (now that Steyn has left), I would have to say that Terblanche is the best fullback in the country. I’m all for building towards the world cup, but the Sharks’ fullback is playing such sensational rugby that it seems almost ridiculous to omit him from selection. Yet a great young prospect for fullback could also be Louis Ludik of the Golden Lions. He is much more consistent then Jantjies or Kirchner and is solid under pressure. With our wings the only solid cover I see at the moment is Lionel Mapoe. He has come through with great form in the Currie Cup and it would be interesting to see how he plays against top teams. Another youngster for future years could be the Sharks’ Lwazi Mvovo. As for centers, with Jean out, Olivier should start with Fourie but cover is an issue. The sharks Luzuko Vulindlu is playing well and has center experience, or some people are considering turning Bulls players Frans Hougaard or Gerhard van den Heever into permanent centers. As for fly-half cover, Pienaar is far too much of a gamble to be the world champions’ fly half. At the moment Willem de Waal looks like an option but in years to come, I can really see Sharks youngster Monty Dumond playing an instrumental role in Springbok rugby. We have an embarrassment of riches at scrumhalf cover. Vermaak, Kockott, Adams and even Sarel Pretorius are all excellent. Our loosies are of the best in the world. With Spies, Smith, Burger, Brussow, Kankowski, Rossouw, Deysel, Stegmann, Potgieter, Vermuelen and many others dominating rugby at provincial level. As for second row, Bekker and Rossouw provide good cover for our veteran pair of Bakkies and Victor. Our front row is an issue. No doubt Tendai “Beast” Mtawarira is our best prop, and Bismarck du Plessis our best hooker, but John Smit is not our best tight-head. His captaincy is a blessing, yet there are lots of other strong leaders amongst the Boks (Victor Matfield, Fourie du Preez and others) and maybe Peter de Villiers should worry more about the scrum and put a specialist like Wicus Blaauw (Stormers) or even Wiaan du Preez (Cheetas) in the squad and play Smit as a hooker with Jannie du Plessis as prop. All in all, we really do have the depth we need, we just need to utilize it correctly.
My Bok 22 for end of year tour (remember no Steyn or de Villiers)
1. Beast
2. Smit
3. J. du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfield
6. Brussow
7. Burger
8. Spies
9. F. du Preez
10. M. Steyn
11. Habana
12. Olivier
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. Terblanche
16. B. du Plessis
17. Blaauw/W. du Preez
18. Rossouw
19. Kankowski/Smith (Kankowski has been performing better)
20. Vermaak/Kockott
21. de Waal
22. Vulindlu/Hougaard/van den Heever/Ludik/Mapoe
18 Oct 2009, 20:22 pm
And my end of year tour squad of 36 would be:
Beast, Smit, J. du Plessis, B. du Plessis, Blaauw, W. du Preez, Kuun, Matfield, Botha, Rossouw, Bekker, Brussow, Burger, Spies, Deysel, Kankowski, Smith, D. Potgieter, F. du Preez, Vermaak, Kockott, M. Steyn, de Waal, Riaan Viljoen, Habana, Pietersen, Mvovo, Vulindlu, Mapoe, Olivier, Fourie, Hougaard, van den Heever, Terblanche, Ludik, Joe Pietersen
18 Oct 2009, 21:06 pm
Where’s de jong, Peter Grant, Vermeulen you blerry idiot.
18 Oct 2009, 21:11 pm
Cannot really talk now but from a management/leadership perspective one has to question the change for Henry to take over the forwards department.
Surely as head coach he should oversee things anyway.
Whether it is attack, defence, forwards, backline – ultimately Henry has to answer.
The Kiwi coaches – Henry and Deans not getting it right.
Is life not interesting: everybody thought PdV is out of his depth yet his curve is upward and the other guys are not as untouchable before.
18 Oct 2009, 21:11 pm
Morne steyn got no blood in the veins….just ice….how many more game winning kicks that guy gonna conjure up this season alone!
Dont mind when in the green and gold but yesterday was a bit hard to take….
18 Oct 2009, 21:17 pm
Theres alot of positives to take into the new super14 season………….wp rugby > always the bridesmaid and never the bride.
18 Oct 2009, 21:20 pm
Im glad pdv proved everybody wrong. If he hadn’t coloured coaches would still be regarded as knowing nothing about rugby. It is a open secret Pdv is the Best coach in the World.
18 Oct 2009, 22:37 pm
#17 kwas: I wonder if he would’ve said that when he was lying in a crumpled heap following the Smit hit in Hamilton. I watched the France series, Thorn was immense and easily the best forward on the field, I find it hard to believe he thought it was more physical than the Bok games where the ABs were blown away for the first hour of every match.
18 Oct 2009, 23:20 pm
#12 west:
I rate Smith as number 1.
19 Oct 2009, 02:12 am
#27 Big Hit:He has much bigger hits put on him when he was playing for the bronco’s,we don’t get blown away we just play **** on the odd occasion, oh yes while we are here talking about the best No10 in the proff yrs, DCarter go to your planet rugby BH and tell me how many AB’s are in the team, and they havn’t got to the forwards yet!! And keep your eyes on Cory Jane a Christian Cullen clone if there ever was one, in fact he is better than Cully.
19 Oct 2009, 02:17 am
#16 GrantsBatty: Thats why your not the coach, look at the work Gulli does around the park compared to Matland he is to lazy!!!
19 Oct 2009, 02:58 am
Barbarians are going to slaughter this Kaaiwaai outfit.
19 Oct 2009, 03:28 am
#6 west: Hardly the last ten years( how did you come up with that after how dominate we have been up until the WC)??
Our stocks, so to speak were depleted immediately after the WC, which by my figures are only a couple of years– Carl H,Chris J etc. What we ‘have’ left are still world class players by most standards and on the improve all the time. I have full confidence that we will regain the No1 mantle by the end of 2010 and probably the other titles we let slip momentarily……..I mean in all honesty, who else has ever been able to maintain that spot year after year other than the AB’s?
We get our shooting stars but….
19 Oct 2009, 05:37 am
#31 Predawn: You wish- ‘Slaughter is when a team has been left with a ZERO scoreline, that has never happened to us– how about your team, ever happened to you, even worse when its ats home I believe, nearly as bad when its away… at least once or twice maybe…very embarrassing to get slaughtered like that eh!!
Anyhow I cant see the Babaa’s getting over the AB’s at the mo!
19 Oct 2009, 09:41 am
#33 captain fantail: It is a pipe dream – ABs will be back to their dominating best – worried about Richie though , although still brilliant seems to be carrying an injury , we need Captain Fantastic back to his best
19 Oct 2009, 10:14 am
Big Hit – The French do lift themselves bit time for the ABs and from what i saw it was one helluva 2 test series!!!!
The French came down o SA in 2006 or 07 for a one off test and they literally blew the Boks away!!!
19 Oct 2009, 10:34 am
Is it just me or is there only one (out of form) hooker listed in this AB squad?
19 Oct 2009, 10:50 am
#36 puff: Corey Flynn from the Saders is in
19 Oct 2009, 11:02 am
#37 stew:
Ah yes, I see now. Thanks.
Hasn’t played in a while, has he?
de Malmanche has gotten a raw deal here, I think.
19 Oct 2009, 12:01 pm
#30 CHAZ:
Sorry, knobhead, but anyone who reckons Cory Jane is better than the Best AB Fullback EVER needs to up their medication. Perhaps spelling a players name correctly might deprive you of being a selector in future let alone the obvious cerebral-deficiencies.
#17 kwas:
The Boks are always in for a ‘rude-awakening’ vs France. Check your stats, les Tricolors have monstered the Boks more often than not. Any dickheads who have mocked the ABs for losing to France under a cheating Pom-ref have discovered in 2009 the delights of Barnes whilst turning a blind-eye to their pitiful record vs France.
#23 Sheriff:
Come now. How many players has PdV had to ‘select’/pluck from obscurity ? To whom can you REALLY point at and say “he’s a PdV selection ?” Perhaps Morne Steyn ? well he’s there as a kicker and only drafted in when Pienaars radar went askew, and whom PdV says is better. PdV inherited a RWC squad and when he tried to show how clever he was in the 3rd Lions Test, he got introduced to his own ringpiece. PdV hasnt had to show HIS hand yet, lets see how he goes when Matfield, Smit retire and Frans & JdV arent avail. The Jury remains out; the Bok team delected itslef in 2009 and nothing convinces me that Isaac Washington is not completely crackers.
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
Ellis is the worst RE-selection I can ever remember. I would be more confident if they brought Colin Farrell out of retirement ! Ellis is the PITS.
#27 Big Hit:
oh come on, Smit caught Thorn blind and off-balance. Anyone can look good in that scenario. Talk Smit up for the TH on that AB scrum, yes, but you can hardly make a legend out of tackling the fella when he’s on his backfoot. Typical Pom, making a meal out of nothing. What next, a Victory Lap ?!
#38 puff:
Cant throw straight, period. Same again for Waikato vs Northland on the w/e. They subbed him off. The only thing stopping Flynn from a regular 2 jersey has been his broken arms.
19 Oct 2009, 12:56 pm
#39 GrantsBatty:
Flynn
Mealamu
de Malmanche
Hore
In what order to you rate them?
19 Oct 2009, 13:04 pm
Gee, I rate Zac Guilford. He is class. He will be top try scorer in next year’s S14 with the saders
19 Oct 2009, 13:51 pm
#40 puff:
Mealamu
Flynn
Hore
Demalmanche
None of them are brilliant throwers tho. And that order would change if Flynn stayed fit because he’s the best thrower of the 4 listed and only Mealamus experience makes him 1st. If Demalmanche could throw as straight as he could carry, he’d be no 1.
Also, if the ABs had decent lineout props, then even Hore would have looked half-decent this year. The Worlds best lineout prop, nay the best scrummaging prop too – Carl Hayman – would make them all look good/better, altho Demalmanche is beyond that. Matfield has been the lineout King for 3 years now but he never dominated ABs when Ali Williams was supported by Hayman; fact.
19 Oct 2009, 14:09 pm
I have been trying to watch as much NZ rugby as possible in the last month or two and there are a couple of players that have stood out for me,namely Maitland and kruden (spelling?).As far as I can understand from speaking to a few Kiwis most seem to think Kruden isnt the real deal and is too inconsistant but surely he is a better long term option than Donald?.
Anyone that thinks Cory Jane is better than Cullen is smoking something……the fact that most rugby supporters would have Cullen in their all time world 15 (regardless what country you are in) and most wouldnt even have Jane in their current 15 (except maybe us Saffa’s now that Steyns gone) should tell you something.
The AB’S pack issues can be solved by the addition of 2 players- a fit Ali Williams and bring back Hayman…sorted!
19 Oct 2009, 18:53 pm
#39 GrantsBatty: Listen tosspot if I was talking to you I would of pulled your chain, knowing both these players personally I can tell you that CJ has far more strings to his bow than Cully ever did, and having watched them both play their way through the grades , CJ will have better future than Cully ever did, so either crawl back into ya hole and with a nic like that it should be hole the way GB turned out!!!!
19 Oct 2009, 18:54 pm
#43 bok4eva: Listen tosspot if I was talking to you I would of pulled your chain, knowing both these players personally I can tell you that CJ has far more strings to his bow than Cully ever did, and having watched them both play their way through the grades , CJ will have better future than Cully ever did, so either crawl back into ya hole and with a nic like that it should be hole the way GB turned out!!!!
19 Oct 2009, 19:05 pm
#22 Wezwp:
Wow someone change Chaz’s tampon
19 Oct 2009, 19:06 pm
#46 rugbywriter:
Sorry I meant WEZWP
20 Oct 2009, 00:08 am
howzit
wonder how hika elliot missed out to flynn when it was pretty clear in their recent match up who out played the other.
good to see messam recalled. he is the future without doubt.
surprised with eaton getting another callup. ABs need to pull in a replacement for thorn and then find depth to cover that position too.
ellis’ selection is also surprising, but i guess coaches feel there is nobody else.
biggest joke though is how the coaches are ‘switching’ roles around. what a coverup. if they werent collaborating with each other across their ‘specialties’ over the last 5 years then they dont deserve to be there. such a massive slap in the face to AB supporters saying they are going to make things a bit mre interesting for themselves. major cop out!
never the less, ABs should walk this end of year tour again. they might hit a speed bump in france, but the french already proved they can upset the ABs in their backyard. dont think they will get up again for them this year.
20 Oct 2009, 00:12 am
#48 Tomsta: Hello Tommy. Truly this is pathetic for the All Blacks.
And if De Melmanche is not better than Hore I dunno. It just makes Henry look pretty spiteful and out of touch.
I do not give him long. Stupid selections and a stupid cover up for Hansen et al.
20 Oct 2009, 00:23 am
#49 SodaJoe: howzit mate
de malmanche cant throw so i understand his dropping, but you would think they would work on him extra hard because of his field play. alas they go to hore who is not contributing much anymore, and flynn who is not robust enough for #2.
also funny how henry gave toeavo and rococcoco seasons to find form where as guys like messam, ross get shunted back and forwards.
mate, hansen is a forwards coach. how will he cope with coaching backs when he cant even fix his lineout.
cant believe smith takes over defence when he is supposed to be specailist attack coach. thought henry was the defence coordinator before. its just a whole lot of cr@p really. cant believe NZ take this sitting down.
play this scenario in the bok camp. no frigging way.
20 Oct 2009, 00:38 am
#44 CHAZ:
‘if I was talking to you…..”. You replied to my msg you ******** !
All youve proven is that by professing to ‘know’ both these players that you presume some form of vicarious expertise distinguishes you from anyone else here as having the superior opinion to others. Smallminded little man with talent-envy no bigger in reality than a guppy-****.
20 Oct 2009, 06:57 am
#34 stew: I think he could be tiring, slowly but surely like all of us!!
#39 GrantsBatty: First off, dont waste your time responding to big hit, he’s not he’s a small hit that just continually needles the team that makes his look pathetic everytime they play!!#39 GrantsBatty: Corey may not be at the moment but this boy has the makings of a legend and will surely take the mantle one day.
20 Oct 2009, 07:27 am
#39 GrantsBatty: waka, you’re back?
welcome, we’ve missed you.
20 Oct 2009, 07:33 am
#39 GrantsBatty: oh and he broke Thorn in half, legally. Off balance, backfoot whatever, he snapped him
20 Oct 2009, 07:50 am
Four uncapped players that know one has ever heard of, man what a mess this lot has found it’s self in. These three have been in charge for six years now and all they have done is taken the all black name and rubbished it, what a disgrace to New Zealand rugby.
20 Oct 2009, 09:11 am
#53 Big Hit:
??!
#52 captain fantail:
Jane is a good player, tidy and skillful but not a player with any 1 ‘weapon’ that marks him out from the rest. But Cullen is a once-in-a-lifetime player with searing pace, unbelievable balance in top gear and incredibly brave in the tackle. Legend.
#54 Big Hit:
yeah, whatever. Jerry Collins pulled off similar ‘big hits’ in most matches, front-foot. whoop de ****.
20 Oct 2009, 14:17 pm
#29 CHAZ: too many and they haven’t 1 World Cup between them.
#56 GrantsBatty: Collins tackled illegally, and still does.
20 Oct 2009, 14:19 pm
#39 GrantsBatty: Barnes didn’t cheat, but the ABs DID choke or more to the point, they weren’t good enough.
20 Oct 2009, 14:25 pm
#57 Big Hit:
‘illegally’ – how so ? I dont recall any YC/RCs for illegal tackles throughout his Test career. Didnt see too many in the w/e’s victory for Ospreys either, a MoM performance.
Im not JCs biggest fan, he was a limited player, but he was/is a monster in the tackle. Smit gets lucky on a player receiving a hospital pass and now someone wants to make a meal out of it. Whatever.
20 Oct 2009, 14:28 pm
#59 GrantsBatty: Collins always hit too high for my liking, he aimed at the area just below the neck and above the chest. His technique wasn’t great. Didn’t see the O’s game at the weekend.
I don’t know why you have trouble accepting Smit’s tackle, probably because it was on one of your boys. It was a great hit and good to see a RL thug cop some.
20 Oct 2009, 14:52 pm
ironically you mustn’t have seen the Ospreys game either, because Collins was yellow-carded and for what? yep you guessed it, a shoulder charge
20 Oct 2009, 15:26 pm
#60 Big Hit:
Please give the medical term for the area ‘below the neck…..(and)….above the chest’.
Who said anything about ‘not accepting’ Smits tackle ? Not me. But because it was a hospital pass & Thorn caught off balance, then it looked a better tackle than it was. But by all means, celebrate it with a Victory Lap.
#61 Big Hit:
Ironically, from your answer at 60, youre in no position to comment on something you didnt see. The commentators, like everyone else there, chose to ignore the YC as a nonsense and still made him MoM.
20 Oct 2009, 15:33 pm
#59 GrantsBatty: I fail to understand this one show pony levelled against JC. Yes when JC burst on the scene he was one dimensional, a crush ball specialist, and had Butch James syndrome of shoulder charges but he rectified it soon.
Collins later developed into a linkman and a complete player in defence and attack. His attack was not only limited to him but he was creating for players outside him, with grubber kicks and the occassional up and under.
In 06 between Dewi Morris and Stuart Barnes JC and McCaw were the best flankers in world rugby and these two know what they talk about. Straight to the point and no bias, i know biggles does’nt like SB for that.
20 Oct 2009, 15:52 pm
#62 GrantsBatty: if you watch the first two tackles in this video you can see what I mean, Collins repeatedly hits his man in the face because he tackles too high youtube.com/watch?v=7hd8nahG8BU
#62 GrantsBatty: yes but I didn’t pretend I’d seen it. And yip, Smit crumpled old man thorn and put manners on him (well overdue too). Victory lap is a myth as well, it was to thank the Old Trafford fans
#63 rugby fan: Barnes and Morris are clueless, always have been. Cringeworthy to listen to those two.
20 Oct 2009, 15:57 pm
#62 GrantsBatty: Hi Waka…good to have you back.
20 Oct 2009, 16:02 pm
#64 Big Hit: Cringeworthy coz they say as it is. Did you hear Barnes last year when Eng played Aus at Twickenham?
This is the real test, Marsaille was an abberation and how correct and honest he was.
20 Oct 2009, 16:06 pm
#64 Big Hit:
Get real. Neither tackle is higher than the shoulders and is therefore legit. If first contact hits the neck, thats too high. Neither does.
Polys dont know what the ‘neck’ is because they dont generally have one.
If you didnt see JCs YC for Ospreys then that means you accept every refs decision as 100% correct.
Victory Lap is only a ‘myth’ in England because that must help ease the embarrassment. Which is understandable, because it was even embarrassing for the neutrals.
20 Oct 2009, 16:07 pm
#66 rugby fan: Barnes is really down on England all the time because he was ignored throughout his test career for Rob Andrew. Very bitter guy. I know he says what you want to hear, but it’s mostly self-promotion on his part. Read a bit about his views on Danny Cipriani and you’ll soon change your mind about him. England were going pi$$ all over the SH teams with Cipriani according to Barnes.
Marseille was no aberration anyway, Sheridan dicked all over the Aus scrum the year before when we beat them at Twickers. I guess Paris was an aberration too, never mind the fact we did it again 5 months later. Keep listening to Barnes though, you obviously enjoy his nonsense.
20 Oct 2009, 16:09 pm
#65 grant10:
Are you and Big Hit sisters ? why are you calling me waka ?! a waka is a Maori canoe last time I checked. You have a point, thats what my girlfriend calls it.
20 Oct 2009, 16:12 pm
#67 GrantsBatty: you must be blind, he catches Charvis in the face with his shoulder and clubs Ali Williams(?) on the jaw. Like I said, his technique is flawed and his tackles are often dangerous and illegal. They may not know what neck is, but they sure as hell know what chin is. As for the yellow card, I didn’t see it but apparently the guy didn’t even have the ball.
Dallaglio and Woodward explained the lap right after the game at the post-match press conference. It was to thank northern fans who were not used to seeing live tests yet were very voiciferous throughout. John Hart focused on the lap after the test to try to take attention away from the fact his side underperformed. He should’ve focused on the next game at Twickenham two weeks later because his side did even worse, the match ended in a draw. These were Woodwards first games in charge.
20 Oct 2009, 16:15 pm
#65 grant10: this one is a little less highly strung than waka, but every bit as one-eyed
maybe waka smoked some weed and chilled out? 
If not, I dread to think what the place would be like with both of them on here.
20 Oct 2009, 16:20 pm
#71 Big Hit: LOL…Could of sworn!!
20 Oct 2009, 16:21 pm
#69 GrantsBatty: Good on you….enjoy it…the canoe and the girlfriend that is…
20 Oct 2009, 16:24 pm
#73 grant10: howzit Grant. What’s up boet? Missed all of the semi-finals. Was the pits.
20 Oct 2009, 16:26 pm
#71 Big Hit: you being targeted again BH? Kiwis just love to get on your case it seems.
20 Oct 2009, 16:27 pm
#69 GrantsBatty:
Does she engage in waka-jumping?
20 Oct 2009, 16:27 pm
#74 TASSIES: i am cool…you okay my man??
Been away again then?
20 Oct 2009, 16:30 pm
#75 TASSIES: it seems that way
did you manage to catch highlights of the WP semi? If not, you can watch it here youtube.com/watch?v=E5eBGF0Krn0
20 Oct 2009, 16:33 pm
#78 Big Hit: thanks BH. No missed everything. Maybe catch in when get back.
20 Oct 2009, 16:34 pm
#68 Big Hit: i think you are confusing bitter with balance here. barnes makes balanced commentary, someone like nasser hussein is biased dont know about stransky, he makes it a habit to talk down the boks.
20 Oct 2009, 16:35 pm
#77 grant10: are we going to stick to this thread. I’m dancing all over the place. How was the game, assuming you went to Newlands like you would normally do.
20 Oct 2009, 16:38 pm
#80 rugby fan: Stransky sits on the fence, just like almost all the Supersport commentators. Naas being the worst of the mob IMHO.
20 Oct 2009, 16:38 pm
#81 TASSIES: ja….with JR,ROBZIM,DAWN,SLAPPES AND THE BLONDE…heartbroken ….so close…seemed to lack a bit of composure and self belief at the end….But M Steyn got ice in the veins….what a difficult penalty to win it!!
20 Oct 2009, 16:39 pm
#81 rugby fan: consider Barnes our Stransky then, I like Joel though
20 Oct 2009, 16:39 pm
#82 TASSIES: gotta run boet…lets have a cold one soon…cheers now
20 Oct 2009, 16:45 pm
#82 TASSIES: how on earth did tonderai ndoro get the job of doing rugby interviews?
20 Oct 2009, 16:48 pm
#70 Big Hit:
Whatever. Neither tackle made first contact above the shoulder and neither hits the chin. The 1 on Chris Jack hits his shoulders.
Engl did a Victory Lap because they were so proud of only losing by 17pts. The buildup all week was that Engl would lose by a record margin. No wonder they were happy.
ABs didnt lose at Twickenham either. Engl at home in ’97 – Played 2, Won 0. So proud, they named a shirt sponsor to commemorate it.
You probably think Taits foot was in too.
We also remember Woodwards last games in charge.
#76 WP Till I Die:
No. She’s Russian. They like to pole-vault.
20 Oct 2009, 16:48 pm
#86 rugby fan: haven’t a clue. Most of the interviews(if not all) are pretty lame. No one worse than the other. Collective rubbish.
20 Oct 2009, 16:51 pm
#86 rugby fan: gotta call it a night chap. Nice Chinese lady calling me/us to board. Very quiet tonight on Keo anyway. Cheers.
20 Oct 2009, 16:51 pm
#87 GrantsBatty:
Hmmmm, there’s just something about Russians and poles, isn’t there…
20 Oct 2009, 16:55 pm
#88 GrantsBatty: you’re wrong about both tackles, it’s clear to see he made contact with the opposing player’s face in both cases. We’ll have to agree to disagree though as I don’t see you changing your mind.
You’re wrong about the lap too, it’s a NZ myth which they’ve held onto to make themselves feel big and they couldn’t win the next game, but ‘whatever’ as you would say
It wasn’t Tait’s foot, it was Cueto’s and no, he was in touch. Yes, Woodward said upon leaving NZ that they shouldn’t get too excited as they won’t win the World Cup, how right he was.
20 Oct 2009, 16:56 pm
#90 TASSIES: later tassies, I best be off too. Later all, grantsbatty will spar another time bud, welcome to keo.
20 Oct 2009, 16:56 pm
#88 TASSIES: not surprised Tondi is a DJ, specialising in soul and RnB.
20 Oct 2009, 17:06 pm
#90 WP Till I Die:
Yep, my previous girlfriend was a Pole. She was always rushing for the waka too.
#91 Big Hit:
Woodward had a point to prove because he’d just leaked 100 of them. Poor losers. He said the Lions tour was “a success”. This is the same mindset that allows a Victory Lap when you lose by 17pts.
Youre right, it was Cueto. Off you go, run around the office.
20 Oct 2009, 17:09 pm
#94 GrantsBatty:
20 Oct 2009, 17:29 pm
#95 WP Till I Die:
tau pakeha, Big Hit, hamuti roro ehara.
21 Oct 2009, 15:50 pm
still sucking up to the Seth Afrikaans at every opportunity Big Hit.. doesnt your tongue ever get sick of the taste of springbok..?
least you have an excuse this year for Engs poor AI performances, just bring out the same line youve used every year since Ive been blogging here…
your constant berating of anything NZ really is tiresome, it shows a limited and juvenile mind…open your eyes, its a big big world, but I guess you cant see that with your b@m in the air and your head buried in the pillow…
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