Henry names uncapped quartet
18 Oct 2009
Graham Henry has announced four uncapped players as well as a coaching re-structuring for the All Blacks’ tour of Europe.
Flyhalf Mike Delany, fullback Ben Smith, wing Zac Guildford and utility back Tamati Ellison have all been included in the 33-man squad, while Joe Rokocoko got the axe. Isaac Ross, Hosea Gear and Aled de Malmanche were also left out.
Piri Weepu (ankle), Isaia Toeava (pelvis), Lelia Masaga (shoulder), Keven Mealamu (chest), Bryn Evans (back), Richard Kahui (shoulder) and Ali Williams (Achilles) were all not considered due to injury.
Meanwhile, under-fire Steve Hansen will no longer look after the forwards, Henry taking over that role. Hansen will be attack coach, while Wayne Smith will look after defence.
New Zealand play Australia in Tokyo, Wales, Italy, England, France and the Barbarians.
New Zealand squad (with caps in brackets): John Afoa (Auckland – 20 Test caps), Anthony Boric (North Harbour – 10), Dan Carter (Canterbury – 62), Jimmy Cowan (Southland – 28), Wyatt Crockett (Canterbury – 1), Mike Delany (Bay of Plenty – 0), Stephen Donald (Waikato – 16), Tom Donnelly (Otago – 1), Jason Eaton (Taranaki – 13), Andy Ellis (Canterbury – 11), Tamati Ellison (Wellington – 0), Corey Flynn (Canterbury – 5), Owen Franks (Canterbury – 6), Zac Guildford (Hawke’s Bay – 0), Andrew Hore (Taranaki – 43), Cory Jane (Wellington – 8), Jerome Kaino (Auckland – 22), Tanerau Latimer (Bay of Plenty – 3), Brendon Leonard (Waikato – 12), Luke McAlister (North Harbour – 28), Richie McCaw (Canterbury – 76, captain), Liam Messam (Waikato – 2), Mils Muliaina (Waikato – 77), Ma’a Nonu (Wellington – 42), Kieran Read (Canterbury – 12), Sitiveni Sivivatu (Waikato – 39), Rodney So’oialo (Wellington – 60), Ben Smith (Otago – 0), Conrad Smith (Wellington – 29), Adam Thomson (Otago – 12), Brad Thorn (Canterbury – 33), Neemia Tialata (Wellington – 37), Tony Woodcock (North Harbour – 58).
97 Comments
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18 Oct 2009, 10:56 am
I’m too blue to think about the AB’s. My WP and me are too sore.
18 Oct 2009, 10:59 am
Isaac Ross dropped as he is made the scapegoat lock for the poor AB lineout.
18 Oct 2009, 11:04 am
18 Oct 2009, 11:09 am
#1 The Jinxta: Howzit Jinx. does two sore hearts make it okay? I feel the same mate.
You can be very proud of your team. WP lost but they played with huge heart and they played very well. It was a cracker of a game.
Now good luck to both Bulls and Cheetahs in the final. May the best team win.
18 Oct 2009, 12:50 pm
All we need is Two World Class Locks, a Hooker who can throw straight, with accuracy, and hey……..the WC is Ours.
And I almost forgot ……….a 6’3″ Prop to do a bit of line-out lifting.
18 Oct 2009, 12:55 pm
The blacks will still have a strong starting 15 but there depth will be tested again if there are key injuries as they have a hard tour all in 6 weeks aussie, france ,wales, england and italy and then babaas thats not easy.
I think it shows in the past ten years how eroded the depth of talent in NZ rugby has become, could you imagine Ben Smith, delaney. latimar, boric and donald making the 97 Abs team or the 05-06 team. The problem is hard to fix because you can’t blame players for leaving NZ to the Uk for 4 times the pay. They still produce the best age group players so will always hold onto a good 15-20 players but the rest of them are leaving and finally they can’t plug the gaps anymore. Here is an example in 97 when the blacks were at there brilliant best if Walter little an inside centre got injured they could choose from the following ( excuse spelling ) Alama iremia, Lee stenseness, Scott McLeod, Tony Marsh, Eroni Clark even John Leslie who never got a look in! not a bad lot to choose from, now when they lose a inside centre they have to put an average fly half donald at centre??
I still expect them to win all there games but I wouldn’t rate my chances against France if carter and mccaw were injured and the replacements were delany and latimar no disrespect to them but it’s a different league.
18 Oct 2009, 13:17 pm
#6 west:
Westie,
9.7 out ten on the spelling Champ.
18 Oct 2009, 13:38 pm
Dagg and Gear have also missed out here.
Am I the only person in the country who thinks that Mils is off his game and maybe needs to go the same way as Roko?
Maybe after this tour we will know one way or the other.
Mils, Hore and Nonu are very likely to play in 2011. These are all areas where we are still working out a number 2.
A pitty we did not try something more in the centers. Thank ****** Toeava is injured anyway.
Ellis can think himself lucky because when Canterbury play I really don’t see a big difference between him and Keats (I think that Keats is improving well though)
18 Oct 2009, 13:48 pm
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
“Am I the only person in the country who thinks that Mils is off his game “.
Most likely:
A Team under pressure makes many individuals look less than Supernatural.
The 2nd best FB in the Country is in the Team, so what is your point?
18 Oct 2009, 14:00 pm
#6. Good point made there, the taller your lifters, the higher the locks will rise. Maybe thats why Aus struggled in their lineout this year. This is the basis of Jake White’s argument for tall loose forwards too. Stupid to ignore a short Bulldog like Brussouw though.
Requirements to win a world cup:
1) settled combinations
2) experience
3) a brilliant youngster (Horan, Steyn)
4) a few tester pool games
5) strong captaincy
NZ have two years to 2 years to work on the above.
18 Oct 2009, 14:01 pm
#11 add superb physical conditioning and a drop kicker to the above;)
18 Oct 2009, 14:05 pm
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
I dont think you have any need to try out anything in the centres in Luke McAlister and conrad smith you have to brillent centres throw in nonu and there is no real problems there. From a neutral perspective I cant believe how people in NZ just dont rate Conrad Smith i think he has been your more consistent back over the past two years he has scored some stunning tries and set up countless tries he also is a brillent tackler. The big problems you have is your forwards and especially the lineout fix that and you are nearly there.
From what i have seen of Muliaina he hasnt had a great year but lets put it into perspective who in the Abs has had a great year McCaw hasnt been at his best but you would never drop him??
18 Oct 2009, 14:05 pm
No Gear, Dagg, Maitland??? And the ABs are still short some decent forwards besides McJaw
18 Oct 2009, 14:12 pm
#10 Lions_Soutie:
Have to agree you cant win a world cup with unsettled combinations, look at henry at the 07 world cup he didnt play the same team togeather in pool games once and then comes quarter final time…… . Look how settled the Aussies were in 91-99 Horan and little had been playing togeather since they were 12!!, england 03 and the boks 07 were very settled teams.
18 Oct 2009, 15:09 pm
#9 cane:
Why Smith over Dagg?
18 Oct 2009, 15:44 pm
#15 David:
Dagg is too hot’n'cold. Ive seen him miss too many highballs for my liking, almost as bad as watching Percey.
Cant believe they didnt take Maitland, he’s got way more upside than Guildford.
18 Oct 2009, 17:16 pm
I was quite intrigued by Brad Thorn’s comments that the French tests in NZ this year were far more physical than any of the Tri-Nations games in 2009.
I think the Boks are in for a rude awakening in Paris this November.
18 Oct 2009, 17:43 pm
will the abs beatthe aussies in japan i say ja oh my poor sharkies
18 Oct 2009, 19:24 pm
#17 kwas: I understand now why your nic is Kwas, because you are one
Boks are not playing in Paris!! KWAS!
18 Oct 2009, 20:13 pm
Hey guys. I understand this about the AB’s squad issues, but this is my opinion on our own:
Amidst all of the Springbok glory and success, are a few niggles about our depth or lack there of. Lots of people feel that we don’t have adequate back-up for our dominant starting XV that will tour the Northern hemisphere soon. People seem to think we have a depth “crisis”. I actually disagree. Looking at fullback (now that Steyn has left), I would have to say that Terblanche is the best fullback in the country. I’m all for building towards the world cup, but the Sharks’ fullback is playing such sensational rugby that it seems almost ridiculous to omit him from selection. Yet a great young prospect for fullback could also be Louis Ludik of the Golden Lions. He is much more consistent then Jantjies or Kirchner and is solid under pressure. With our wings the only solid cover I see at the moment is Lionel Mapoe. He has come through with great form in the Currie Cup and it would be interesting to see how he plays against top teams. Another youngster for future years could be the Sharks’ Lwazi Mvovo. As for centers, with Jean out, Olivier should start with Fourie but cover is an issue. The sharks Luzuko Vulindlu is playing well and has center experience, or some people are considering turning Bulls players Frans Hougaard or Gerhard van den Heever into permanent centers. As for fly-half cover, Pienaar is far too much of a gamble to be the world champions’ fly half. At the moment Willem de Waal looks like an option but in years to come, I can really see Sharks youngster Monty Dumond playing an instrumental role in Springbok rugby. We have an embarrassment of riches at scrumhalf cover. Vermaak, Kockott, Adams and even Sarel Pretorius are all excellent. Our loosies are of the best in the world. With Spies, Smith, Burger, Brussow, Kankowski, Rossouw, Deysel, Stegmann, Potgieter, Vermuelen and many others dominating rugby at provincial level. As for second row, Bekker and Rossouw provide good cover for our veteran pair of Bakkies and Victor. Our front row is an issue. No doubt Tendai “Beast” Mtawarira is our best prop, and Bismarck du Plessis our best hooker, but John Smit is not our best tight-head. His captaincy is a blessing, yet there are lots of other strong leaders amongst the Boks (Victor Matfield, Fourie du Preez and others) and maybe Peter de Villiers should worry more about the scrum and put a specialist like Wicus Blaauw (Stormers) or even Wiaan du Preez (Cheetas) in the squad and play Smit as a hooker with Jannie du Plessis as prop. All in all, we really do have the depth we need, we just need to utilize it correctly.
My Bok 22 for end of year tour (remember no Steyn or de Villiers)
1. Beast
2. Smit
3. J. du Plessis
4. Botha
5. Matfield
6. Brussow
7. Burger
8. Spies
9. F. du Preez
10. M. Steyn
11. Habana
12. Olivier
13. Fourie
14. Pietersen
15. Terblanche
16. B. du Plessis
17. Blaauw/W. du Preez
18. Rossouw
19. Kankowski/Smith (Kankowski has been performing better)
20. Vermaak/Kockott
21. de Waal
22. Vulindlu/Hougaard/van den Heever/Ludik/Mapoe
18 Oct 2009, 20:22 pm
And my end of year tour squad of 36 would be:
Beast, Smit, J. du Plessis, B. du Plessis, Blaauw, W. du Preez, Kuun, Matfield, Botha, Rossouw, Bekker, Brussow, Burger, Spies, Deysel, Kankowski, Smith, D. Potgieter, F. du Preez, Vermaak, Kockott, M. Steyn, de Waal, Riaan Viljoen, Habana, Pietersen, Mvovo, Vulindlu, Mapoe, Olivier, Fourie, Hougaard, van den Heever, Terblanche, Ludik, Joe Pietersen
18 Oct 2009, 21:06 pm
Where’s de jong, Peter Grant, Vermeulen you blerry idiot.
18 Oct 2009, 21:11 pm
Cannot really talk now but from a management/leadership perspective one has to question the change for Henry to take over the forwards department.
Surely as head coach he should oversee things anyway.
Whether it is attack, defence, forwards, backline – ultimately Henry has to answer.
The Kiwi coaches – Henry and Deans not getting it right.
Is life not interesting: everybody thought PdV is out of his depth yet his curve is upward and the other guys are not as untouchable before.
18 Oct 2009, 21:11 pm
Morne steyn got no blood in the veins….just ice….how many more game winning kicks that guy gonna conjure up this season alone!
Dont mind when in the green and gold but yesterday was a bit hard to take….
18 Oct 2009, 21:17 pm
Theres alot of positives to take into the new super14 season………….wp rugby > always the bridesmaid and never the bride.
18 Oct 2009, 21:20 pm
Im glad pdv proved everybody wrong. If he hadn’t coloured coaches would still be regarded as knowing nothing about rugby. It is a open secret Pdv is the Best coach in the World.
18 Oct 2009, 22:37 pm
#17 kwas: I wonder if he would’ve said that when he was lying in a crumpled heap following the Smit hit in Hamilton. I watched the France series, Thorn was immense and easily the best forward on the field, I find it hard to believe he thought it was more physical than the Bok games where the ABs were blown away for the first hour of every match.
18 Oct 2009, 23:20 pm
#12 west:
I rate Smith as number 1.
19 Oct 2009, 02:12 am
#27 Big Hit:He has much bigger hits put on him when he was playing for the bronco’s,we don’t get blown away we just play **** on the odd occasion, oh yes while we are here talking about the best No10 in the proff yrs, DCarter go to your planet rugby BH and tell me how many AB’s are in the team, and they havn’t got to the forwards yet!! And keep your eyes on Cory Jane a Christian Cullen clone if there ever was one, in fact he is better than Cully.
19 Oct 2009, 02:17 am
#16 GrantsBatty: Thats why your not the coach, look at the work Gulli does around the park compared to Matland he is to lazy!!!
19 Oct 2009, 02:58 am
Barbarians are going to slaughter this Kaaiwaai outfit.
19 Oct 2009, 03:28 am
#6 west: Hardly the last ten years( how did you come up with that after how dominate we have been up until the WC)??
Our stocks, so to speak were depleted immediately after the WC, which by my figures are only a couple of years– Carl H,Chris J etc. What we ‘have’ left are still world class players by most standards and on the improve all the time. I have full confidence that we will regain the No1 mantle by the end of 2010 and probably the other titles we let slip momentarily……..I mean in all honesty, who else has ever been able to maintain that spot year after year other than the AB’s?
We get our shooting stars but….
19 Oct 2009, 05:37 am
#31 Predawn: You wish- ‘Slaughter is when a team has been left with a ZERO scoreline, that has never happened to us– how about your team, ever happened to you, even worse when its ats home I believe, nearly as bad when its away… at least once or twice maybe…very embarrassing to get slaughtered like that eh!!
Anyhow I cant see the Babaa’s getting over the AB’s at the mo!
19 Oct 2009, 09:41 am
#33 captain fantail: It is a pipe dream – ABs will be back to their dominating best – worried about Richie though , although still brilliant seems to be carrying an injury , we need Captain Fantastic back to his best
19 Oct 2009, 10:14 am
Big Hit – The French do lift themselves bit time for the ABs and from what i saw it was one helluva 2 test series!!!!
The French came down o SA in 2006 or 07 for a one off test and they literally blew the Boks away!!!
19 Oct 2009, 10:34 am
Is it just me or is there only one (out of form) hooker listed in this AB squad?
19 Oct 2009, 10:50 am
#36 puff: Corey Flynn from the Saders is in
19 Oct 2009, 11:02 am
#37 stew:
Ah yes, I see now. Thanks.
Hasn’t played in a while, has he?
de Malmanche has gotten a raw deal here, I think.
19 Oct 2009, 12:01 pm
#30 CHAZ:
Sorry, knobhead, but anyone who reckons Cory Jane is better than the Best AB Fullback EVER needs to up their medication. Perhaps spelling a players name correctly might deprive you of being a selector in future let alone the obvious cerebral-deficiencies.
#17 kwas:
The Boks are always in for a ‘rude-awakening’ vs France. Check your stats, les Tricolors have monstered the Boks more often than not. Any dickheads who have mocked the ABs for losing to France under a cheating Pom-ref have discovered in 2009 the delights of Barnes whilst turning a blind-eye to their pitiful record vs France.
#23 Sheriff:
Come now. How many players has PdV had to ‘select’/pluck from obscurity ? To whom can you REALLY point at and say “he’s a PdV selection ?” Perhaps Morne Steyn ? well he’s there as a kicker and only drafted in when Pienaars radar went askew, and whom PdV says is better. PdV inherited a RWC squad and when he tried to show how clever he was in the 3rd Lions Test, he got introduced to his own ringpiece. PdV hasnt had to show HIS hand yet, lets see how he goes when Matfield, Smit retire and Frans & JdV arent avail. The Jury remains out; the Bok team delected itslef in 2009 and nothing convinces me that Isaac Washington is not completely crackers.
#8 chch – welcome back Laulala:
Ellis is the worst RE-selection I can ever remember. I would be more confident if they brought Colin Farrell out of retirement ! Ellis is the PITS.
#27 Big Hit:
oh come on, Smit caught Thorn blind and off-balance. Anyone can look good in that scenario. Talk Smit up for the TH on that AB scrum, yes, but you can hardly make a legend out of tackling the fella when he’s on his backfoot. Typical Pom, making a meal out of nothing. What next, a Victory Lap ?!
#38 puff:
Cant throw straight, period. Same again for Waikato vs Northland on the w/e. They subbed him off. The only thing stopping Flynn from a regular 2 jersey has been his broken arms.
19 Oct 2009, 12:56 pm
#39 GrantsBatty:
Flynn
Mealamu
de Malmanche
Hore
In what order to you rate them?
19 Oct 2009, 13:04 pm
Gee, I rate Zac Guilford. He is class. He will be top try scorer in next year’s S14 with the saders
19 Oct 2009, 13:51 pm
#40 puff:
Mealamu
Flynn
Hore
Demalmanche
None of them are brilliant throwers tho. And that order would change if Flynn stayed fit because he’s the best thrower of the 4 listed and only Mealamus experience makes him 1st. If Demalmanche could throw as straight as he could carry, he’d be no 1.
Also, if the ABs had decent lineout props, then even Hore would have looked half-decent this year. The Worlds best lineout prop, nay the best scrummaging prop too – Carl Hayman – would make them all look good/better, altho Demalmanche is beyond that. Matfield has been the lineout King for 3 years now but he never dominated ABs when Ali Williams was supported by Hayman; fact.
19 Oct 2009, 14:09 pm
I have been trying to watch as much NZ rugby as possible in the last month or two and there are a couple of players that have stood out for me,namely Maitland and kruden (spelling?).As far as I can understand from speaking to a few Kiwis most seem to think Kruden isnt the real deal and is too inconsistant but surely he is a better long term option than Donald?.
Anyone that thinks Cory Jane is better than Cullen is smoking something……the fact that most rugby supporters would have Cullen in their all time world 15 (regardless what country you are in) and most wouldnt even have Jane in their current 15 (except maybe us Saffa’s now that Steyns gone) should tell you something.
The AB’S pack issues can be solved by the addition of 2 players- a fit Ali Williams and bring back Hayman…sorted!
19 Oct 2009, 18:53 pm
#39 GrantsBatty: Listen tosspot if I was talking to you I would of pulled your chain, knowing both these players personally I can tell you that CJ has far more strings to his bow than Cully ever did, and having watched them both play their way through the grades , CJ will have better future than Cully ever did, so either crawl back into ya hole and with a nic like that it should be hole the way GB turned out!!!!
19 Oct 2009, 18:54 pm
#43 bok4eva: Listen tosspot if I was talking to you I would of pulled your chain, knowing both these players personally I can tell you that CJ has far more strings to his bow than Cully ever did, and having watched them both play their way through the grades , CJ will have better future than Cully ever did, so either crawl back into ya hole and with a nic like that it should be hole the way GB turned out!!!!
19 Oct 2009, 19:05 pm
#22 Wezwp:
Wow someone change Chaz’s tampon
19 Oct 2009, 19:06 pm
#46 rugbywriter:
Sorry I meant WEZWP
20 Oct 2009, 00:08 am
howzit
wonder how hika elliot missed out to flynn when it was pretty clear in their recent match up who out played the other.
good to see messam recalled. he is the future without doubt.
surprised with eaton getting another callup. ABs need to pull in a replacement for thorn and then find depth to cover that position too.
ellis’ selection is also surprising, but i guess coaches feel there is nobody else.
biggest joke though is how the coaches are ‘switching’ roles around. what a coverup. if they werent collaborating with each other across their ‘specialties’ over the last 5 years then they dont deserve to be there. such a massive slap in the face to AB supporters saying they are going to make things a bit mre interesting for themselves. major cop out!
never the less, ABs should walk this end of year tour again. they might hit a speed bump in france, but the french already proved they can upset the ABs in their backyard. dont think they will get up again for them this year.
20 Oct 2009, 00:12 am
#48 Tomsta: Hello Tommy. Truly this is pathetic for the All Blacks.
And if De Melmanche is not better than Hore I dunno. It just makes Henry look pretty spiteful and out of touch.
I do not give him long. Stupid selections and a stupid cover up for Hansen et al.
20 Oct 2009, 00:23 am
#49 SodaJoe: howzit mate
de malmanche cant throw so i understand his dropping, but you would think they would work on him extra hard because of his field play. alas they go to hore who is not contributing much anymore, and flynn who is not robust enough for #2.
also funny how henry gave toeavo and rococcoco seasons to find form where as guys like messam, ross get shunted back and forwards.
mate, hansen is a forwards coach. how will he cope with coaching backs when he cant even fix his lineout.
cant believe smith takes over defence when he is supposed to be specailist attack coach. thought henry was the defence coordinator before. its just a whole lot of cr@p really. cant believe NZ take this sitting down.
play this scenario in the bok camp. no frigging way.
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