ABs sitting pretty
30 Nov 2009
The All Blacks have increased their lead at the top of the IRB world rankings.
Richie McCaw’s men will finish the year as the world’s best team following their emphatic 39-12 win against France and the Boks’ 15-10 loss to Ireland.
Ireland jump France into fourth spot as the highest placed European nation. England and Argentina both rise one spot with Wales falling two places after their disappointing 33-12 loss to the Wallabies.
Lower down the rankings, Italy jump Samoa into 11th spot with their 24-11 win against the Pacific Islanders.
IRB world rankings (top 10)
1(1) New Zealand 91.68
2(2) South Africa 88.59
3(3) Australia 85.55
4(5) Ireland 84.58
5(4) France 82.40
6(7) England 80.72
7(8) Argentina 80.55
8(6) Wales 79.89
9(9) Scotland 76.59
10(10) Fiji 75.91
126 Comments
30 Nov 2009, 15:15 pm
Indisputably number
ONE !
30 Nov 2009, 15:27 pm
Indisputable – any objections ?
30 Nov 2009, 15:33 pm
Well done All Blacks. That was a beautiful game to watch. Corey Jane was brilliant. Conrad Smith just magic, and Carter showed why he is pure class. All round brilliant performance.
@WakaNathan: Well done on predicting that Richie will win IRB player of the year. As for your question on another thread on Friday. I love AC Milan, but I’m a Crusaders supporter first. Red and Blacks.
30 Nov 2009, 15:34 pm
Fair enough! but we did beat the “Indisputable” number ones 3 nil!
30 Nov 2009, 15:35 pm
@rossoneri:
Well of course, there is only ONE ‘rossoneri’.
Cheers. Its been noted you are a very fair man. You’ll need a thick skin to survive around there here parts.
30 Nov 2009, 15:36 pm
When will we ever be the best again.
30 Nov 2009, 15:41 pm
@WakaNathan: Not a man. A woman, and I know all about having a thick skin. This is my fourth nick.
30 Nov 2009, 15:52 pm
@Sonito: Bizarre Rankings system where you beat a side 3 times in a row but they go above you thanks to a money making match (Extra Bledisloe Match)
30 Nov 2009, 15:54 pm
@rossoneri: Well actually if you had thick skin you’d still be on your first nick.
30 Nov 2009, 15:55 pm
@Oxy moron:
too true.
punto
30 Nov 2009, 15:57 pm
@Oxy moron: Not if you are banned 5 times Dude. You can’t use it anymore. First time was a yellow card, all the the other times was straight red cards.
30 Nov 2009, 15:58 pm
On current form I think the rankings are fair enough. None of the NH team can claim to be in the top 3 until they can actually beat the SH teams regularly at home.
30 Nov 2009, 15:58 pm
@rossoneri:
How do you get banned?
30 Nov 2009, 16:08 pm
@rossoneri: ha ha, fair enough. well done.
30 Nov 2009, 16:16 pm
@Sonito: by singing the anthem badly, ras dumisane now has a lifetime ban from keo.
the only other way to get banned on here is to agree with the tackler.
30 Nov 2009, 16:23 pm
Fair enough.
Middle of the year, we were the best – no doubt. AB’s have however stepped up and the Boks stepped back. They deserve to be no 1.
Well done.
30 Nov 2009, 16:25 pm
@Sonito: Getting banned was easy when the RT crowd still thought they dictated to the Moderator in deciding who stays and who goes. Many people were banned for rubbish. Ask Dawn, and Skop. But that was during the “wars”. The blog is a very peaceful place these days. It’s nice to see people stating their views freely and that there is a little more tolerance. Gone are the days when my personal information was investigated by bloggers. It’s good to be back.
30 Nov 2009, 16:46 pm
@rossoneri:
Hectic.
30 Nov 2009, 16:55 pm
@Sonito: “None of the NH team can claim to be in the top 3 until they can actually beat the SH teams regularly at home.”
The only SH team that actually beats the NH teams regularly away from home is New Zealand.
I don’t have a major problem with the rankings though. Ireland have proven they’re the best team in the NH on current form.
You could make an argument that they deserve to be ahead of Australia. Ireland are unbeaten all year (undefeated in 11 games) and won the 6N. Australia got pretty much stuffed in the 3N, with the exception of one game and have lost to Scotland.
But the Irish would have been ahead of Australia if they had beaten them instead of drawing with them at home so there can’t be too many complaints.
30 Nov 2009, 16:55 pm
@Sonito: Yeah it was. It’s nice to see the guys have a go at eachother without it getting as low down filthy as it use to get.
30 Nov 2009, 17:13 pm
@Paddylock:
Not really. The SH teams only lost 1 game last year in the NH tests and lost 3 test this Autumn. France and England are the only teams to beat the SH teams at home.
30 Nov 2009, 17:17 pm
@rossoneri: @17
hearty chuckle.
Id leave if Skop was banned. Then hire him as my Personal Bodyguard. Or guard-dog.
Dawn ? well, we’re still getting to know each other….
30 Nov 2009, 17:31 pm
@Sonito
Yes really. When was the last time South Africa won in Dublin? Or France?
There’s little doubt that the SH (or more particularly NZ, SA and AUS) is stronger than the top three NH sides but Australia can’t tour without losing tests up North. Neither can South Africa. Counting easy wins against Italy is far worse than counting easy wins against Argentina in Argentina.
NZ consistently come up North and beat everyone. South Africa don’t and Australia don’t. They might grab a couple of wins against the weaker sides (and they don’t always play the stronger NH sides because nobody expects them to play six test matches and the games have to be spread about).
France do have a good touring record which is quite amazing really when you consider they play more rugby than anyone else in the world. England’s record in the run up to 2003 was good.
Ireland do have to take a scalp or two in the SH now if they are to prove their progress. They play NZ home and away next year as well as England, France and Australia away before playing the Boks and Argentina at home. It’s certainly a good schedule of preparation for the World Cup.
30 Nov 2009, 18:49 pm
kiwis fully deserves ending top of the pile.what pleasure it was on saturday to watch rugby the way it should be playedwell done graham henry and the kiwi players!
30 Nov 2009, 19:23 pm
All victories will be superficial until the entire world has a concurrent season.
30 Nov 2009, 19:46 pm
Can someone please explain to me how these rankings work as i fail to see how the all blacks can be above the boks after the boks beating the lions and winning the tri nations.
30 Nov 2009, 19:47 pm
@blueboy: lions tests don’t count…
30 Nov 2009, 20:01 pm
@BALLER canREADY: Oh, everyone agrees with me except they can’t bring themselves to admit it. It’s got to remain their in-closet secret! Give them time.
30 Nov 2009, 20:13 pm
True reflection on current form…no problems here.
@Paddylock:
France and Ireland granted, but SA hasn’t lost to England,Wales and those useless Scots away from home in quite a few years now.
30 Nov 2009, 20:14 pm
@Oxy moron:
Good points.
A global season is the stuff of dreams though….
30 Nov 2009, 20:34 pm
2010 will be a watershed year for PDV and the Boks…..i bet the talks in the backrooms must be frantic….some real decisions need to be made now.
In my very ,very humble opinion that Bok set uo too much of a closed shop old boys club. I have nothing against continuity and experience but it has resulted in complacency to a certain extent. I mean how long did it take H Brussow to become a 1 st choice? Despite a stunning impact he was still earmarked to be dropped for France test for Schalk….and it was only an injury that allowed his talents to be displayed in Lions 2 nd test ….after a very good 1 st B Lions test he was dropped like a hot potato for Schalk….
Matfield and Bakkies are untouchable…..Smit has to be on field for 82 minutes …..
FDP and MS are above criticism…..JPP has been playing as if on a double dose of sleeping tablets…..
Beast tasted the axe and resonded magnificently.
Are we not allowing for complacency> How difficult and frustrating must it be for those players who week in and week out put in the big effort knowing that the 40 test veteran can perform poorly but will be there next week anyway?
I certainly do not advocate wholesale change for change sake….that too is suicide. But this disregard for form and acceptance of mediocrity is a cancer. The over reliance and dependence on Smit is and has done the skipper no favours….he now finds himself having to keep a young lion in Bissy out the mix at sharks and Boks for 22 months??? Can he do it? Any realisic option for him as a 3 is now well and truly drivel. BJ ,
30 Nov 2009, 20:38 pm
South Afirca lost 5 games this year New Zealand lost 4. Then taking into account the previous years rankings the Math makes sense.
And to use the logic of SA sweeping Nz, Nz beat the teams that beat SA ie Oz and France. So at worst that’d put them about even.
30 Nov 2009, 20:51 pm
Bj , cj and wp nel are the men for that job. In fact BJ used correctly can be a key part of the boks strategy to retain the WC…he is that good….obviously he has come on a great deal since leaving for Ireland.
Strategy and game plan has been found wanting….this too reflects poorly on the bok management team and skipper, who never remotely looked like a plan b was ever discussed.
Selections were a shocker on this tour…..in fact i cringe at the lack of foresight and disrespect shown to conditions.
Plumtree got a huge role to play in the Bok set up now….will he use Ruan Pienaar at 10?
Whats the deal with Smit and Bissy?
Will PDV walk the talk and begin to exert more authority and his own brand on the Boks….or do the rumours of player power actually hold credence?
Will the boks embrace the overseas saffas….as they should?
The crystal ball….22 months out, says a bok team like this may be best ….
15…F Steyn….Kirchner
14 Mapoe….JPP
13 J FOURIE….J DE JONGH
12 J DE VILLIERS…..M NEWMAN
11 HABANA….
10 M STEYN……P GRANT
9 F DU PREEZ….J VERMAAK
8 SPIES….D POTGIETER
7 J SMITH….D VERMEULEN
6BRUSSOW….L WATSON
5 A BEKKER….V MATFIELD
4 B BOTHA….JUANDRE KRUGER
3 BJ BOTHA…CJ VD LINDE
2 BISSY…T LIEBENBERG…CHILLIBOY
BEAST …HEINKE…
Captain Matfield.
30 Nov 2009, 23:42 pm
this is what it sounds like to be no1.
Go to YouTube and search ‘Changing room after French clash’
Good times !
“Only 1 Brad Thornie…..theres only 1 Brad Thornie….” – could it be the new Christmas no1 ?
30 Nov 2009, 23:44 pm
@Paddylock: Paddy Paddy Paddy, I wouldn’t put any of the NH teams in the same league as to top three, Congrats to the Kiwis by the way, well deserved and once again the team to beat.
The interesting thing about the Wallabies tour is that the statistics were similar for all three games, the only difference was that we converted well against Welsh, not so well against Irish and disgusting against the Scots. The important things is that the team grew and learnt from their mistakes, We had so many players that stood out, Cooper, Genia, Pocock, Mumm and Gits came back at the end. Ireland should feel fortunate to have drawn, the Scots should be proud as punch to have won and good on them but bring your team downunder and play and Suncorp against a full strength Wallabie outfit and then and only then will see where your team really is.
30 Nov 2009, 23:58 pm
@WakaNathan:
Google Rugby World Cup Champions 2007. Also try Tri-Nations Champions 2009. Super 14 Champions 2009 also works well. I hear even the keywords ‘Sevens’ and ‘Lions’ bring up some results.
I await your barrage of stats.
1 Dec 2009, 00:01 am
Yeah come now Paddy, you boys need to string together a few of these years before you can start competing with the big boys from down South
I for one would love to see a powerful Irish team at the next WC; can only add to the occasion.
I’m just not sure they know how win away from home yet.
1 Dec 2009, 00:04 am
@blueboy: Because the Boks lost a few of their points losing in Europe, whilst the AB’s were winning, as someone pointed out, Boks lost 5 this year, AB’s lost 4. It doesnt matter if you win the 3N, its all about overall wins, losses, away from home etc.
Point is, does it really matter? Some are suggesting that Ireland should be ahead of Australia? Why? last time they played, they drew. But the points ranking system takes into account a whole bunch of previous encounters and after all is said & done, its maths. Simple.
Many Bokke supporters are still getting all misty eyed over clouting us 3 zip this year – hey, full ya boots and celebrate because that may not happen for a while, who knows. In a way, we probably needed it, our depth needed to be tested, and you blokes are the best to do that, it was an honesty check.
Enjoy it all, its sport, teams win, lose and sometimes draw.
1 Dec 2009, 00:28 am
The Boks with their first choice team no injuries and playing well are by far the best team in the world at the moment to say otherwise is delusional. Thay have beaten the All Blacks 3 times this year, i know Carter didnt play in the first two games but so what, the boks played at 60% in those 2 games and won. Carter returned in the 3rd game and they still won and they won more comfortably than the 3 points suggests.
It seems the All Black supporters are getting a little ahead of themselves after Saturdays win over France, did they not watch the game? it was down to Frances defensive frailties more than anything the All Blacks done. In fact i have not seen 5 softer tries in ages.
The Boks were not great this year either, but there are too many people claiming they only won the tri nations because the other teams were poor but show me a tri nations which has had such close scorelines in ages.
It is the same every time the Boks go top people start bleating on that it is because of the other teams are poor. nobody is saying that the current Australian and All Black teams are the strongest they hae ever been but the Boks can only beat the teams put in front of them.
Ireland may have been unbeatean this year but they dont play top opposition consistently let alone 3 times each in a competition, the were also a penalty away from losing to wales in the 6 nations. The boks are poor travellers but show me any decent results of NH teams in the summer tours they take part in over the last 5 years.
1 Dec 2009, 00:43 am
In the real world you don’t EVER get to field your best team, with no injuries, in perfect weather, not too ring-rusty but not too worn out, with a ref who makes no errors.
That’s a computer fantasy game, not real rugby.
ALL sides are going to HAVE to cover with injuries, because injuries are GOING to happen. Not if, but when.
They’re going to HAVE to cope with bad weather, read the ref, find their combinations, peak at just the right time etc.
You can only play whoever is in front of you. Anytime, anywhere.
If you’re good enough, you’ll win.
1 Dec 2009, 01:23 am
@KiaKahaNZ: Finally a calm collected post.
Yup.
But for us beating New Zealand 3x makes it a very good year. THE rugby sporting rivalry.
2010 is another year. I am sure we have learned from our mistakes.
1 Dec 2009, 01:27 am
No one can blame Pieter De Villiers for the loss on Saturday.
The SA team on paper were very good, I expected a +8 point win, teh players never rocked up when it counted.
And no-one can tout Victor Matfield as a Bok captain, when his opportunities as captain came his petulance was embarrassing and cost us.
When he arrived on Saturday for the game – he just didn’t “feel like it”. Couldn’t be arsed to jump, defend, or play for the jersey. Smitty for all his limitations at 3 never ever stops playing for the jersey.
1 Dec 2009, 01:34 am
And I am glad I missed the typical full Keo post loss war.
1 Dec 2009, 01:37 am
@Centurionshark Yes, you will see that I don’t dispute that the Tri-Nations sides are still better. My point was simply in response to a previous assertion that seemed to imply that the SH sides come to the North and sweep all before them whereas the NH sides don’t do the same down South. The SH sides don’t sweep all before them in the North. NZ do. SA, Aus and Argentina don’t (and I’m including Argentina because if you include Italy and Scotland then you have to include the team that finished 3rd in the last World Cup). It’s very difficult to win away from home in world rugby. This is why when SA win away in NZ it’s such a big deal.
@Saussie/QldRed I don’t know what you’re taking issue with. I’ve already said that for Ireland to prove their progress they have to go to the SH and take a scalp. At least one. We play NZ and Australia away in 2010. We’ll give it a good go. I don’t disagree with your overall analysis of the Australian tour. Despite Australia’s poor year and not winning two of the four grandslam games I’d be quite happy with the way your team is developing. You’ve fixed your scrum and you are building a very good team. I hope your rugby public and media give the team the time to develop. I know that rugby union has a similar problem to the one we have in Ireland in trying to capture the imagination of the public (it’s the fourth most popular sport in both countries I think, it certainly is here). I would take issue with your analysis of the Ireland game. Yes, we were happy to take the draw in the end. It was Ireland’s first game together in seven months and Australia played well (Pocock was magnificent and as a Leinster fan I know just how brilliant Rocky Elsom is). We gave Australia a seven point head-start but your point about Australia not converting against Ireland ignores the fact that Ireland are the best side in the NH and they are less likely to allow teams to convert against them. I simply said that you could put forward an argument that Ireland deserve to be ahead of Australia in the rankings having won the NH competition and going unbeaten for 11 tests. But the simple fact is that if they had won eleven and not won ten and drawn one (against Australia) then they would be in third.
1 Dec 2009, 01:46 am
@DQuinn25: The Irish team can only play the teams they’re scheduled to play. The 6N competition doesn’t have the same strength as the 3N (5 World Cup wins out of six) but, in fairness, Ireland went to Twickenham straight after England had won the World Cup in 2003 and were indisputably the best team in the world and beat them.
1 Dec 2009, 02:15 am
@Paddylock: Your team is looking very good.
I think you’ve found the pivot for the next 8 years or so. The rest of the back line as we know are very very good.
Like many countries you need a front row, with that you will be very very hard to beat.
I suspect we will see a changing of the NH vs SH guard soon. The competition is getting very strong at club level, which will move the national teams upstream. For all 6 nations.
Good for the sport.
1 Dec 2009, 02:42 am
We’re actually okay at loosehead. Healy is 22 years of age and super around the park and people who know a bit about scrummaging, Ollie le Roux when he was at Leinster for example, say he will develop in to a very solid scrummager with some experience. Horan has a couple of years left in him and Buckley and others are more than adequate.
But at tighthead we have nothing. Absolutely nothing. Poor John Hayes has to play 80 minutes in every game now despite holding the position for a decade. He’s never been the greatest scrummager but has been a great servant.
We could do with a bit of back-up at lock (Casey and Cullen are good but getting on).
All other positions are as well covered as they’ll ever be with a playing base the size of ours.
Sexton will never be a Carter but he’s a winner, hugely competitive with a good kicking game and the ability to move a backline and make a break. Crucially he’s top class on defence and shores up a channel that was exploited by many teams. We have a brilliant head coach who has assembled a very good coaching team.
A WC semi-final is a realistic goal now.
The big difference now is that the Irish players, because of professionalism, are realising that they’re not grossly physically inferior to the South Africans and New Zealanders. We never felt physically inferior to the Australians, they beat us in different ways.
It would be very good for the sport for Ireland to step up along with France and another 6N team on a consistent basis. If you look back on the 2003 World Cup not one team ranked below the side they were playing won a game (with the exception of Aus v NZ and Aus were playing at home). As we all know the number one ranked team won the tournament.
2007 was a little better but it would be great if there were six to eight teams to be truly competitive in the World Cup.
1 Dec 2009, 03:23 am
@ 6 Andre WP
cheer up man,you’re still world cup champions and trin-nations champions-somethings us kiwis want to try and rectify
1 Dec 2009, 05:21 am
“The boks are poor travellers but show me any decent results of NH teams in the summer tours they take part in over the last 5 years.”
When last have the All Blacks lost anything on any EOYT in the last 5 years? They’ve scored TWO grand slams under their belt in that time.
1 Dec 2009, 05:22 am
@TheTackler:
Big deal…….what cups they got?
1 Dec 2009, 06:31 am
You’re far better off with a reputation and no cups than cups and no reputation.
Have the reputation and the cups will come.
Have no reputation but cups and those cups will go.
Cups are reminders of the past — of where you once were. Reputation is about the future — of where you are heading.
Tomorrow won’t be in the past. Tomorrow is in the future. And we only move in that direction.
1 Dec 2009, 06:43 am
Wow a kiwi blog, wonder where the real men, the Maori, instead a bunch of scrawny white boys.
AB will choke at home in the WC, cant wait, choke, choke…
1 Dec 2009, 06:47 am
Choke
1 Dec 2009, 07:04 am
As a South African, I think some of my compatriots are in serious denial. South Africa’s wins this year have not been unequivocal bar the test in Bloemfontein and Perth.
Watching the ABs on Saturday 2 hours after the Ireland game, it is clear that the ABs are back on track. They play exciting, intelligent, creative rugby. Notwithstanding the long season, they did not appear jaded, lethargic or indifferent. The fact is that the Boks played mediocre, one-dimensional rugby against an overrated Ireland team…and lost. There is no doubt the ABs would have thrashed Ireland as well.
It is clear that SA does have an abundance of talent. What is depressing is the mismanagement of that talent. We see problems with selections, a lacklustre gameplan and unintelligent remarks from coaching staff.
Why does SA persist in this way? That is the mystery. Politics is only part of it. That doesn’t account for this 10 man game which they cannot seem to transcend. It would be nice to see the management acknowledging the problems and fixing them. Who knows, perhaps they are doing that in private, but I wouldn’t raise my expectations.
1 Dec 2009, 07:04 am
@KevinRack: AB’s are going to be very tough to beat at home so you may want to take it easy on the choking thing otherwise you may be the one choking, on those words, after the world cup.
1 Dec 2009, 07:08 am
@rex: Spot on! And agree Ireland were pretty average.
1 Dec 2009, 07:18 am
You on the Bundy again Kev?
1 Dec 2009, 08:09 am
I would add…
The Boks can run the ball. But why only in the last two minutes as if suddenly the rugby synapses suddenly begin firing at long last. We have all seen this before. They kick away possession again and again until a few minutes before the game ends as if they suddenly realize it’s going nowhere. Then suddenly they run the ball and appear as if they are a different team. Either there is a genuine lack of intelligence or maybe they were paid by the mob to throw the game but had to make it look as though they were really playing at the end.
1 Dec 2009, 08:12 am
@TheTackler:
“Have the reputation and the cups will come.”
Stated with such confidence… yet while the ABs have had the world’s-best-team reputation for decades… THE Cup has not come since 1987…!!
Having said that… Congratulations to the ABs on regaining the number 1 spot. They certainly finished the year on the up and deserve the top ranking…
Will make the 2010 3N very interesting and see which way the Boks go…
Strange thing is…this time last year the PdV doubters (and haters) said they would judge him by the Lions tour and then the 3N… now they’re saying we will have to judge him on the upcoming 3N…
Come what may… hell or highwater… win or lose… this time next year they’ll be saying… You can only judge Peter De Villiers on whether he wins the World Cup or not…
Also… congratulations to the Aussies… I was expecting Wales to beat them and give them a tough time… They really picked it up after the Scotland game and ended their year on a high note too…
1 Dec 2009, 08:15 am
@rex: My sentiments exactly, we were awesome with 1 minute to go where as the Kiwis were unbelievable from beginning to end, they should pace, power, made great decisions and changed things up constantly and we allowed a very over rated Ireland get bragging rights over us, very disappointing to say the least.
1 Dec 2009, 08:33 am
I reckon John Smit summed up the difference in approach between the Boks and ABs, with his comment that the game plan against Ireland was based on kicking into their half and forcing errors through pressure from the chasers which would be converted into penalty points.
The ABs, on the other hand, go out to win the game by outplaying the opposition.
Basically, we rely on the opposition to give us the game rather than us going out and taking it.
That approach is also the reason why we rarely manage to win by more than a few points. We won’t take the risk of going for them.
1 Dec 2009, 08:35 am
@David: 100%
1 Dec 2009, 08:39 am
@TheTackler: When it comes to winning percentages , the good money is always on Black.
1 Dec 2009, 09:11 am
@David: Very succintly put
Watching the match between us and Ireland, and between France and NZ, which was a better advert for rugby? Ping-pong ping-pong ping-pong ping-pong ping-pong ping-pong penalty, versus a fluid, exciting running game…I know which I would rather watch!!
1 Dec 2009, 09:12 am
@David: Actually that game plan is an old Crusader ploy. Kick, kick, kick and kick it until the opposition falter. Crusaders prided themselves for many season of giving the opposition all the ball they could… so they could pulverise them to err. Amazing how many times the Crusaders converted mistakes into good fortune and it was called ‘broken play’.
Old game plan revisited!
1 Dec 2009, 09:21 am
@David:
Great comment David…!!
1 Dec 2009, 11:09 am
@TheTackler: Time for your Prozac.
1 Dec 2009, 12:13 pm
@RugbyRulz: So it’s vintage. Well the boks wore it to the Trinations, you can’t keep wearing the same dress to all functions. People will notice and start to talk.
1 Dec 2009, 12:50 pm
@KiaKahaNZ:
Best post from a Kiwi for a while!
1 Dec 2009, 12:52 pm
@Paddylock:
Agreed. The Irish used to be easy pickings for the Boks (in Ireland and at home). You seem to be getting your house in order thats for sure.
Can only be good for World Rugby.
1 Dec 2009, 12:53 pm
@TheTackler:
As a Sharks fan I would trade all the ‘Top of the Log finishes’ for some more trophies!!!
1 Dec 2009, 13:00 pm
I@CenturionShark (aka LondonShark): I can understand that, but it’s only the one little cherry on the very top of the cake. Owning the whole cake minus that one solitary cherry isn’t exactly a terrible thing.
The cherry-eater will be hungry after 20 minutes, but by then you’ll barely have eaten half of the 20 slices of the cake you own.
1 Dec 2009, 13:56 pm
@TheTackler:
MATE, I’m still ****** hungry after the 2007 Super 14 final.
1 Dec 2009, 14:30 pm
@Test: @55
what, and deprive him of his 1 and only joke ?!
1 Dec 2009, 14:41 pm
@CenturionShark (aka LondonShark): @36
last time someone here on Keo told me to ‘Google (something) Sth African’ it was “are Sth Africans”
Can I expect that answer to be the same ?
1 Dec 2009, 14:50 pm
@WakaNathan:
Aha.
Here you are.
1 Dec 2009, 14:55 pm
@WakaNathan:
Who invited you to the do?
1 Dec 2009, 15:29 pm
@Dawn:
are you stalking me, Dawn ?
@Dawn:
My company bought a table.
1 Dec 2009, 21:10 pm
@whatever:
#50
All those cups and still at the end of the season NZ are the number one team,what do you guys have to do?
1 Dec 2009, 23:47 pm
NZ were good against France but lets not forget that this is the same France that got smashed by England in last seasons 6 nations. That match was over as a contest quicker then saturdays match.
2 Dec 2009, 00:39 am
@dquinn25: Aaah but the AB’s hardly ever lose in the north – not like the Bokkes, they do lose more than they should.
We respect the Bokkes effort, dont get us wrong, however, this year, everyone, not just AB supporters, have been saying this is teh weakest AB team we have seen in many a year – probably since 1998, its called a trough, and if anyone should know about that, it should be you guys, your record over the entire 3N is not as good as ours.
No, Im not talking RWCs here, knockout v round robin is an unbalanced comparison
2 Dec 2009, 01:17 am
@KiaKahaNZ:
Funny, you lose to the Boks and suddenly it’s your weakest team since 1998………………pleeeease.
2 Dec 2009, 01:20 am
@Hurricane:
We still got the cups. You have the ranking. I know what fills up the cabinet! You had a good spurt at the end of the year whilst we had it when it counted in the competitions. Again, I know which I prefer. You have a good record inbetween WC’s whilst we do the business at the competition. AGAIN, I know which one I prefer……….you getting the message dude?
2 Dec 2009, 01:31 am
@whatever: aah no, we lost to France this year too, struggled to beat them in Wgtn, scraped past Italy twice, it hasnt been great has it?
In 1998 we lost 5. Therefore, when else have we been this weak, its pretty straight forward dont you think?
Most we’ve ever lost in one year in between these times has been 2 games (in the one calendar season)
Why would try to twist into something else?
2 Dec 2009, 02:52 am
@KiaKahaNZ:
Got nothing to do with your opposition hey? They never get better and make winning everytime harder? The only twisting being done is you blokes twisting your own BS!
2 Dec 2009, 02:54 am
84. They try to twist it because they are in denial about the current state of Bok rugby as compared with NZ. Until the Boks face these facts, they will never be a consistently excellent creative team. They probably could be on a par with the ABs consistently, but they do not learn from errors.
2 Dec 2009, 03:10 am
@rex:
Mate, NZ does not have to put up with the political BS that is rife in SA Rugby. Period. Right now boet we are not only on a par, but better. You are only good as the last three games you played against each other! How come you blokes always think the sun shines outaya a hole all the time?
2 Dec 2009, 03:15 am
Jeez, the boys went off the boil at the end of the season and now all the frign Kiwi’s come running out of the woodwork shouting “we are the champions”………..hello people. Wake up, did you win when you should have this season? No. Did you collect the 3 Nations? No. One swallow does not make a summer dude!
2 Dec 2009, 03:40 am
@whatever: you say ” One swallow does not make a summer dude!”
I couldnt agree more. Like we’ve said, enjoy your moment, do we moan on and on when we win a 3N, no, coz some of you lot start dissing it, and start mentioning RWC’s etc.
Are you ever able to accept the AB’s are overall a better team than SA – as our record against you shows? Or is that hard for you to accept, ie, the truth?
Currently, yes, the last 3 games you win, it happens, we’ve done it to you too cowboy, swings both ways.
I dont think any kiwis are proclaiming anything of the sort – ie that we’re the champions etc, we maybe on top of the rankings, whoop-de-f***,
I think the Frogs took us on at a running game, a similar style that has worked for them against us in the past, but it backfired, a nice win for us, but they allowed it to happen too.
Why you so hot under the collar about all of this?
2 Dec 2009, 04:00 am
@KiaKahaNZ:
Mate you can swing whichever way you want with whatever coyboy you want, thats your choice.
What I think is pathetic is this constant “my team is better than yours” from you Kiwi blokes. Are you trying to make up for something?
You had a great game against the Frogs, well done. But, how many times have you seen the Frogs string two good games together? They played there big game of the season against a flat Bok side.
Don’t give me this BS about us going on about the WC. If you had won a blooming WC recently you would be unplayable. You gaan aan about overall records just as much as we may go on about WC’s. Pot calling kettle not so? Well it would be if you openned your other eye!
2 Dec 2009, 04:28 am
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2 Dec 2009, 04:44 am
Whatever ain’t you a saffa living over in Kiwi land just like Tackler, so whats the deal how come you so ingratuitous to yr kind hosts.
Tackler on the one hand always sticking the knife into his ex home nationality and you sticking the knife into your adopted one. Can’t quite work out who is less honorable, the jarpie hater or the kiwi one.
Maybe its true what they say, saffa’s truly are a weird complex bunch.
2 Dec 2009, 04:45 am
@Oxy moron:
enjoy your slide down the rankings.
Rankings is an accumulation of points over time and that means not just this year but last.
In case you did not know…hope you did…if you did not then that would make you a doos.
2 Dec 2009, 04:53 am
@whatever: Whatever whatever.
I dont mind discussing genuine facts etc, but your unbridled bravado ruins any sentiment you carry.
I will recind any comments on the AB’s being the best, as I feel its a moving title anyway, its relevance is only fit for the desperate.
I take great delight in being an AB supporter, as they have delivered many times, and have generally been a pleasure to watch.
Im glad you mentioned France having one good game, we’ve been saying that for years, we found that out the hard way in 99 and 07
2 Dec 2009, 04:56 am
@Paddylock:
The reason why Ireland is not above Aus is because Ireland plays against weak teams in the six nations.
You have to beat teams above you to go above them.
Playing weaks sides multiple times does not give you points to move up.
2 Dec 2009, 05:02 am
@skopskiet:
No mate, just sticking up for my home country. Big difference. Just get sick of the AB suporters arrogance. Great country, but as you would know, each country has it’s a-holes…..
2 Dec 2009, 05:03 am
@whatever:
You are a sook!!
“They played there big game of the season against a flat Bok side.”
did you not say you are tired of NZers saying they are better. Well arent you saying just the same.
You seem to give your teams game against the French credence and not the same for the AB’s
Jealousy makes you look ugly!!
2 Dec 2009, 05:04 am
Oh, and skopskiet, it is not a “host” type situation. The country simply needs immigrants to post a positive growth. Economics of a small country.
2 Dec 2009, 05:04 am
Yeah seems France are adept at lifting themselves for about 1 good top drawer game per season. If they could keep that intensity up with any degree of consistency it would be France at the top of the heap year after year. Good thing they got feet of clay and minds made of marshmallow else Ab’s and Bok’s would be snapping at their heels more than the other way round.
2 Dec 2009, 05:05 am
@wallabie.:
And you would know, hey dingo?
2 Dec 2009, 05:06 am
@whatever:
You must be bitter…being around supporters of consistent winners.
Just enjoy their case and go along for the ride…they are just winding you up.
They obviously know you are grump and so are putting the stir in.
Do yourself a favour and lighten up and you will see they are joking with you. Do the same back and they will enjoy your case.
Make sure it is in good humour. Know some saffas they do take it seriously and get very personal.
2 Dec 2009, 05:07 am
@skopskiet:
Quite agreed. They can be brilliant one week-end and shite the next. If they could string it together then they would be consitently in the top 3.
2 Dec 2009, 05:09 am
@wallabie.:
Wallabie, who asked you to the party with the patch over your eye? Read without bias dude. Aaah, but that’s difficult for you as you also keen to have a dig at every oportunity not so?
2 Dec 2009, 05:09 am
@skopskiet:
How many games have the boks and French played since the boks last beat them?
2 Dec 2009, 05:10 am
Ok I guess patriotism can still be classified as a virtue, not forgetting ones roots should always stand one in good stead. As they say, home is where the heart is.
2 Dec 2009, 05:11 am
Oh, and wallabie, constant winners? Yeah right. I had a good season in NZ to be honest, how about you? Must be happy with your lot?
2 Dec 2009, 05:11 am
@whatever:
Hey just giving advice.
many kiwis here and they love a banter…we love it and happy to return the favour.
2 Dec 2009, 05:14 am
@whatever: and you are the biggest one from your country mate… youre only as good as your last game, not the games that were played 4 months ago… you harp on about the french being flat, but face it, two wins out of your last nine attempts says it all… the french have a bigger number on your lot then ours, but you will never admit that…
and as for Ireland, still a country that hasnt beaten us, yet they showed you guys up didnt they… 4 losses against NH opposition, two of them club sides… keep believing your the best, what excuses you going to bring up now?? as Ive said before, we can add IRELAND to the “teams SA were lucky not to face in 07″, cause we all know you would have lost to them too.. as results indicate..
and is it 42-33 overall, that tells me whose the best… yuo must love living in denial.. idiot!!
2 Dec 2009, 05:14 am
@skopskiet:
Skop, I stick up for my boys. Patriotism, but not blind patriotism. They were c r a p at the end of the season and I would be the first to admit that, but I still feel they won when it counted this year.
2 Dec 2009, 05:14 am
@whatever:
giving you lot a chance.
It irks many how no depth team over performs. Enjoy our lowly postion while it lasts because it aint going to last.
The bokke are moving down and the wallabies are on the way up.
2 Dec 2009, 05:15 am
@poppa69:
jeez, who rattled your cage Poppa? You on a tea break from the security rounds?
2 Dec 2009, 05:18 am
@wallabie.:
I’m not so sure about Boks on the way down. Never write them off, but I agree your boys are on the up, in fact I reckon they may take the next WC. I’ve said that before as well. Young side full of talent.
2 Dec 2009, 05:18 am
well I’m too lazy to look it up but I believe we did beat them in PE in 2005 which should be about 4 games ago, but last time we beat them over in France was Mallet’s team of 97 where we gave them a 5 try hiding something like the Ab’s just done. Must have been Bok’s riding high that day and Frenchie in disarray.
You always got to catch France on a bad hair day then they easy picking’s, catch them on a good hair day or when they bristling with Gallic c.cksure anxiety and you in for a tough day at the office with a few sore or broken ribs and noses to be writing home about.
2 Dec 2009, 05:19 am
whatever
Aus is a small rugby nation…smaller than Scotland, Wales but we are over achievers.
You see we use brain and not brawn. SA cannot go past brawn and it most times brawn loses out.
Its coming fast and de villiers knows it but he has woken up too late.
done nothing to facilitate the moving out of old players.
2 Dec 2009, 05:19 am
@whatever: just the way you live in the past mate… if our teams faced each other tomorrow even you know what the result would be… well done, you won your first tri nations in five years and did it well… but its funny how when we won 4 in a row it was somehow devalued with travel and the like…
yet most kiwis I know said at the time that SA were deserved winners, not too many SA’s said that over the preceding years did they??
2 Dec 2009, 05:22 am
@whatever:
Bugger…you taken the wind out of my sails.
I was hoping for some banter!!
The wallabies have some way to go as one swallow does not make a summer although the youngsters are showing promise.
2 Dec 2009, 05:28 am
@poppa69:
Go play in the traffic dingbat
2 Dec 2009, 05:32 am
@whatever: ooohhhh touch a nerve did I, cause you know Im right… still safer then playing in the streets in SA huh, no wonder you moved to NZ…
tell me also, is it 4 losses to Scotland your team has had ? bwahahaha seriously, another team that has never recorded a victory against us… you must love being the best for 3 month or 5 week stints, a record to be proud of for sure…
2 Dec 2009, 05:46 am
Its true Sa coaching haven’t been nearly as proactive as they should have. They been missing far too many tricks the past while and I think we’ve left it far too late to rectify now. Hopefully I’m wrong but Smit should certainly not be calling the shots about player selection etc.
Old timers should be upgraded regularly else we going to be trading on age old shares pretty soon. We got to get fresh blood into the system or we going to stew in our ancient juices. De Villiers better bust some gut this next year and ring some long overdue changes and start calling the shots himself.
Smit & co. must just be players, not player coaches, if their influence is extending beyond the on field management and into board rooms and change rooms to the extent where no decisions are taken without his veto able acceptance then its getting to a tail wagging the dog syndrome and can hardly be healthy or profitable. It then means some players carry far too much clout for the overall value and evolutionary progress of the team.
2 Dec 2009, 05:53 am
@poppa69:
So why you working as a security guard in OZ then? Greener pastures? Or did you start getting scared in South Auckland?
2 Dec 2009, 05:58 am
@whatever: hahahaha not at all, I was there last week visiting family… you should go visit them, they like insecure little saffas who contribute absolutely nothing to society…admit it, you were kicked out of SA for bringing the national IQ quotient down a thousand points..
2 Dec 2009, 15:32 pm
@blueboy: “Can someone please explain to me how these rankings work as i fail to see how the all blacks can be above the boks after the boks beating the lions and winning the tri nations.”
1) BIL games do not count, as BIL aren’t ranked team.
2) Before this year’s 3N Boks were HUGELY laggind behing the ABs in the rankings – by more than 3 points. Thanks to 3-0 win and NZ loss to France, Boks leapfroged them and became no1, despite own loss to Australia.
Since then Boks have played 3, lost 2 (both to lower ranked teams), while NZ have played 6 (last 3N Test vs Australia, Tokyo Test vs Australia plus 4 European Tests all away from home), won all 6.
That’s how.
2 Dec 2009, 19:14 pm
In relation to Springbok ratings, the AB ratings should always been seen in the context of the uneven playing fields they enjoy in both the Super 14 and Tri-Nations, which elevates their results due to an easier touring schedule and creates the false perception of their ongoing superiority on the playing field.
They can only truly enjoy that rating when the playing fields are close to level, which they are not at present, a fact expressed and confirmed earlier this year by Mils Muliana, the AB captain.
It is incumbent upon SARU, South African journalists and Springbok supporters to always keep this fact in mind and express it in public. Otherwise we stand the risk of demeaning our players and our results.
We need to make it a priority to even the playing fields.
2 Dec 2009, 22:31 pm
@sglazer: Pathetic, Mils didnt say that at all, its swings and roundabouts for all teams, stand up and be counted.
cant you just accept you had a purple patch this year, and we didnt? We came right and you didnt. Its sport for gods sake
2 Dec 2009, 22:48 pm
@poppa69:
Yeah mr poppavitch, first you flee eastern europe then nz. Why is that? No one like you?
3 Dec 2009, 00:14 am
@sglazer: “which elevates their results due to an easier touring schedule”
Playing 7 Tests (including one in Japan) is easier than 3 for Springboks (plus 2 midweek games where, I guess, just a few Boks featured).
Flying across the globe (and playing, by the way) is easier than flying in the same timezone after nice time at home.
Speaking about 3N, I have never seen Boks playing away at the other side of the globe the very next week after the home Test. ABs did just that in Bloem this year.
Moreover, before this years 3N, ABs have beaten Boks at their own backyard almost twice as much than lost. 9 to 5. It certainly affects the rankings, when Boks clearly have been weaker than ABs for years. And (bar some few exceptions) Boks have usually played in November tours in Europe much worse than the ABs. It, too, does affect the rankings.
You have valid point about S14, I agree, 4 or even 5 game tour is a huge ask for any SA team and it puts them in disadvantage. Frankly, I do not see how it can be otherwise in round-robin system (surely, no SA team would like to travel across the ocean to Aus/NZ 2 times to make each trip shorter) when Aus/NZ are fairly close to each other while SA is far away.
Hovewer – bar this (and 2007) season for the Bulls and fairly long winning streak at home for the Sharks – SA teams consistently have been poor even at home. Now where Kiwis have the enjoyed some advantage, when beating SA teams at their own turf for years?
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