Pumas set for Tri-Nations inclusion
9 Mar 2010
The International Rugby Board will provide $2 million so that Argentina can join the Tri-Nations in 2012.
As reported on keo.co.za last month, the IRB said they would fund the deficit of Sanzar’s costs for allowing Argentina into the competition, which will now be expanded to a four nations tournament.
The Pumas’ commercial viability and sustainability was the final stumbling block after leading French clubs agreed to allow the Argentinean players to play in the southern hemisphere showpiece. IRB chairman Bernard Lapasset said the one-off payment removes that final obstacle keeping the Pumas from joining the championship.
Lapasset said the IRB council is set to confirm the deal at a meeting next month.
120 Comments
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9 Mar 2010, 20:43 pm
Poor Argies, no rest window for their top players. Keo what does Prof. Noakes say about this?
9 Mar 2010, 20:44 pm
@RedLion: there is a rest window, it comprises most of June and July, the Tri Nations is starting later from 2012.
9 Mar 2010, 20:44 pm
Should make the tournament a little more interesting.
Would love a little trip back to beaunos aires.
anyway, New Zealand will still be the whipping boys.
3-0
9 Mar 2010, 21:00 pm
don’t agree that the argentine will be the whipping boys.
if they can put their full team together they will be competitive.
after all in rwc2007, they twice beat the team that knocked the ab’s out.
9 Mar 2010, 21:02 pm
I think the Agries will be more competitive than some give them credit for…
9 Mar 2010, 21:02 pm
anyway, the trinations is getting a bit boring.
will be good to watch new players and a different game plan.
will put a bit more travel stress on oz and ab’s though.
9 Mar 2010, 21:03 pm
@SJonesIsAGit: I agree. And to be honest, it is a professional era we are in. Money talks. So maybe we should have the Sanzar 3, the USA, the Argies and the Japanese involved in a six nations. That way we can try to unlock the big money markets for the game.
9 Mar 2010, 21:11 pm
@Tacitus: Really Tacitus. You are either a forum troll, trying to think up the most biased and narrowminded things to say just to illicit responses.
Or you really believe in your points, in which case, well.. good luck to you.
9 Mar 2010, 21:12 pm
Haha, that would be “elicit”
9 Mar 2010, 21:15 pm
@wpjoulekkading: tac is entirely serious, he’s said on here before that he doesn’t get any enjoyment from watching rugby if he doesn’t have a vested interest.
9 Mar 2010, 21:56 pm
have just been reading through the rugby-talk site.
hell, interesting articles and animated discussion (non-political).
the guys have done a good job – kudos
9 Mar 2010, 22:17 pm
@Tacitus: That’s an easy one. I get to see the skills of the likes of Hernandez, Pichot, and their 8th man (can’t remeber his name) tested in the international arena, on a regular basis.
You need to let go of this paranoia regarding SA players being poached by all and sundry in coming years. Yes, it (transfers abroad) will happen, but there wont be a mass exodus to europe, australia or elsewhere, purely because the administrators won’t let it happen. Think salary caps, think limits on foriegn players, think local incentives, like representing your country.
Your blue bulls ARE building a wonderful empire, don’t begrudge others when they try as well.
This is a great development for Argentina, and the game is better off for it. Period
9 Mar 2010, 22:31 pm
@charo: go and register there then…
9 Mar 2010, 22:38 pm
Big Hit: the fact remains they have never beaten NZ or SA for that matter, not sure how they stack up against Aussie… At the moment they have a solid side, beating England last year was it? once the core of this side goes though, do they have the players to step up? not sure they do..
@Brigadier Van Zyl: bwahahahaha obviously youve only ever watched the 2009 3Ns, tell me, who won the 5 previous ones before that? and who was the whipping boys on most of those occassions?? what a pathetic statement to make…
9 Mar 2010, 22:42 pm
tacitus has managed to hijack the thread with one of his ever so parochial diatribes.
Why should the game of rugby be for your own personal enjoyment only?
Are you worried that more “stereotypical south africans” like that roodt kid at the Tahs will leave your beloved bulle and you know your dream of ever matching & surpassing the crusaders’ success will not be realised. How petulant.
9 Mar 2010, 22:50 pm
transie, you seem a little grumpy of late man
tell me again why we should care about other rugby nations improving?
it seems all a little wishy washy to me. i will be pleased if the new format puts strain on the kiwis and aussies in terms of travel but thats about it really.
ok, it will also be nice to have a partner voting against nz and aus thereby reducing controversy.
and thats it really.
oh and by the ay mate, surely it doesnt concern you where people blog?
9 Mar 2010, 22:54 pm
@Transformation: @63
very mature comment there trannie.
did hater egg you on to say that?
after all, she is the one that keeps the eagle eye on the site and builds up a library of quotes to use later in life.
would you make a similar comment if i applauded the efforts of rugby365 or planetrugby?
or are you simply prejudiced?
9 Mar 2010, 23:00 pm
i said it before, i will say it again, this site seems to move in cycles.
the left are attempting to stifle debate just as willingly as they accused the right of doing it before.
i find it quite amusing really.
9 Mar 2010, 23:02 pm
@Transformation:
You really seem to be pre-occupied by whatever it is that others do…
Charo merely made a point and a very good one I think.
Whether you agree or not is really irrelevant.
Your attitude is annoying to say the least and speak worlds of you in general.
Grow up man…
9 Mar 2010, 23:03 pm
@rangerman:
So true…in more ways than one…
9 Mar 2010, 23:04 pm
@race of tan: it has to be good with the Argies coming in. The format surely must drop back to one home and one away fixture for each opponent. So the boks play 6 4N games which is the same as now. so no change and a major boost for world rugby by brining Argies up to speed in the professional test arena.
2013 4N they will get some scalps
9 Mar 2010, 23:07 pm
Anyway…I’m off.
Enjoy all…
9 Mar 2010, 23:08 pm
@rangerman: @Blouste:
there is a very good story on the 1970 all black tour dealing with nwp and namibia – bloody interesting with pictures of games and the towns visited.
also quoted comments from the all black players of their impressions of the places.
way, way above anything this local lot of clerks can put together.
9 Mar 2010, 23:09 pm
sorry, northern cape, not nwp
9 Mar 2010, 23:11 pm
@charo: i will read it charo though i dont have much time for blogging at the moment.
you let me know about those cold hansas at the george though eh?
9 Mar 2010, 23:13 pm
@poppa69: Italy have never beaten England but 82,000 turn up to watch the game because it’s competitive. That’s the key and the challenge for them.
Can they step up? they have a world class pack, flyhalf and inside centre, they really need a bigger threat at outside centre and on the wings but have a couple of years to uncover some talent.
9 Mar 2010, 23:13 pm
@Tomsta:
#71
Yip, I agree – it will add spice to a tourno that is getting a bit stale – I mean how many times do you want to see only 3 teams playing each other over and over for year after year.
It is becoming like limited over cricket -one for you and then one for me type of stuff.
The Latin American temperament usually makes for good viewing one way or the other and I am sure the average rugby fan will find at least a bit on extra enjoyment in watching them compete as well.
9 Mar 2010, 23:14 pm
@rangerman:
between 10/4 and 24/4
i’ve got your cell number – will call closer to the time
9 Mar 2010, 23:19 pm
@charo:
#73
Hi Charo,
You are forcing me to ask you why do you not join that site if it is so good? Or any of the other sites?
It is a genuine question, I really want to know.
9 Mar 2010, 23:21 pm
@charo: 73 – Howzit Charo, Just a quick post here. Been getting things ready for a very early meeting tomorrow morning. So still up.
Super puts something every Tuesday about the 1970 AB tour to SA. If you go back to last Tuesday there two articles on it, some great pictures of the whole AB team to come here. Very interesting reading it. Enjoy history and rugby history too. Also brings back memories of that time. So if you interested look in every Tuesday on articles of that tour.
Okay that is me out. Going to get ready for bed now. Been a long night.
Cheers Charo.
9 Mar 2010, 23:27 pm
@Robzim:
hi rob,
i try to read up on all rugby sites for snippets of news but spend most of my internet time here.
i find planetrugby a bit too nh focused.
superrugby is quite good for the columns as is rugby365.
silverfern is ok but their blog is limited.
hardly ever look at rugby-talk but keo was so quiet tonight wandered off there.
superbul posted a very interesting story about the 1970 all black tour along with pictures and quotes from players.
loved it. will go and read again more often.
very much more a true rugby site than this and driven by guys who love the sport.
won’t leave here though – too many opportunities to take on the delinquents
and to read skoppie’s prose 
9 Mar 2010, 23:30 pm
@Big Hit: While Im pleased Argentina are finally going to be playing in a competition regularly, is it really going to be conducive to their rugby occassionally winning a game in the tourny?
plus, even though we have assurances at this stage of their players being released, a few injuries to key Argentinian players may see the European clubs reverse that trend..
we seen it in 2003 when the clubs wouldnt release Samoan players for the World Cup???
9 Mar 2010, 23:31 pm
@Puma:
hi puma – found that article very interesting as it was around about the time i became more aware of international rugby.
will scroll back and read the other installments – almost like reading a biography
9 Mar 2010, 23:33 pm
its taken SA 5 or 6 years to win a 3Ns and now the tourny’s getting stale… hmmm
9 Mar 2010, 23:34 pm
@charo:
That is fair.
I also read most of the sites but have not joined any of them them or blog anywhere else – they all have something to offer- rugbyheaven nz and Aus are also quite interesting.
In terms of diversity, robust debate and interesting people nothing beats this one though imo.
Yip, there is only one skoppy
9 Mar 2010, 23:35 pm
@poppa69:
hi pops,
as a kiwi, having dominated for so long, don’t you guys welcome another player?
change is good – wakes everybody up – otherwise it becomes another boring tourney.
9 Mar 2010, 23:41 pm
@poppa69: Their contracts will have release clauses, if players get injured then perhaps clubs won’t be as keen to sign Argentinian players but there will always be room in the S15, and perhaps they can have a franchise of their own there.
If Oz rugby continues the way it is heading, the addition of Argentina could be crucial for them. Interest levels are already low there and were they to endure 3 defeats every year from NZ/SA there would be serious question mark over the future of Union in Oz and as a major partner of NZ that wouldn’t be good for them either.
9 Mar 2010, 23:42 pm
@Robzim:
my view is that one should keep one’s mind open to any info one can find.
i know there are some here who curse rugby-talk for it’s perceived rightwing support but to me that is complete ****.
the mere fact that a group of keo bloggers decided to get out and start their own blog is, to me, admirable.
i doubt, seriously, if the shoe was on the other foot, that the opponents of this group would have managed something similar.
9 Mar 2010, 23:44 pm
@charo: Hey Charo… of course, but using Italy as an example, has it really helped their game, consistently being beaten? has it helped the game grow in their country?
would Argentina fare much better in the SH? debatable, I guess next years WC will give us a much truer indication… I dont believe both teams will encourage new people to the game if they are constantly the easy beats in their respective comps..
Im all for trying to improve their standards, but is being thrown in at the deep end the best way to do it?
9 Mar 2010, 23:48 pm
@RedMan: Argentina will bring some class players (Leguizamón, Fernández Lobbe both class players) but their depth is nowhere near the level required for 3N.
Argentina won the bronze with an amateur wing on the bench.
While it might be better for Argentina in the long run, they will suffer some pretty bad defeats.
Argentina is much more level with 6N and all their players live there. I can’t see how Italy deserve a spot over Argentina. o well.
I cant see how anyone whose ever played rugby or enjoys watching it, could not endorse the development and spread of the game; if only for the intrinsic value. and we really need it here in the States as our rugby is pretty poor.
9 Mar 2010, 23:49 pm
@Big Hit: I would much rather see them in the S15 first, I believe it would help them garner more interest in Argentina, one only has to look at how fanatical they are with their soccer clubs, plus the probability in their first couple of years of wins and being competitive would IMO be more beneficial in the long run…
as for OZ being a major partner of NZ??? just cant help yourself can you
9 Mar 2010, 23:49 pm
@charo: 83 – Charo, Just packing up now. Finally finished what I was putting together for tomorrow.
You have to go back and read from the start. Last week superBul put up two articles. It was fascinating. I remembered many names. I was only 15 at the time but remembere a lot of the AB players. There are photos of the whole team, their thoughts of playing here etc…. Also before they got here the AB team played two warm up games in Perth. They beat a local team there by 50 something. Then when they arrived here there were about 4000 people at the airport cheering them when they arrived. They said they felt so great to see such a huge crowd waiting for them to arrive. Also Danie Craven that had tears that rolled down his face as the team arrived. Cause it took two years to get that tour on the way. A very, very good read. Go back and see the pictures and comments from the AB players. I enjoyed it a lot. It is on every Tuesday night.
I enjoy history and it is just about that but rugby history.
I too read many rugby sites. Good to get a lot of different views. Even read one that is on Skysports and a Scottish one. Then the NZ herald I read that everyday about what is on about the rugby.
Okay now really out of here. Phew!!!! been a long, long
day and tomorrow will be too.
Cheers Charo.
9 Mar 2010, 23:51 pm
@poppa69:
pops,
the alternative is that argentina continue to stumble along with the pros playing in europe and the amateurs at home.
hardly a recipe for growing interest in rugby in the country.
these guys did bloody well in the last rwc and should be encouraged to grow.
an international tournament like the 4 nations will do wonders for them – that’s my opinion.
9 Mar 2010, 23:52 pm
For our beautiful game to expand we need to be inclusive and not exclusive(SCOTLAND take note with your vote)!
South Africa has clearly taken a lead in this especailly with Samoa when we handed over the ticket sales of a home game.
As long as narrow minded self interst takes first place our game will keep shrinking as it is. Soccer/football is eating into supporters in Australia(what game is played on the paddocks on Saturday mornings)and South africa with the world cup coming up.
The talk of including Zimbabwe and Namibia into out local comp is another example of expanding the game.
It would be great to see the same gestures offered to the Island nations, who if had the same money and could KEEP their players, would be by far the best teams.
But not as you can see by the small minded drivel that usually follows this blog, that will not happen.
9 Mar 2010, 23:53 pm
hey, my old home town on tv – slummies.
lovely place and an even better coastline
riddled with huge black mussels
9 Mar 2010, 23:56 pm
@poppa69: 87 Italy has doubled its registered player base since joining the 6N, they’ve just joined the Magners league.
You do make a good point however, Arg would’ve been a better fit for the 6N, indeed they might well have won it in 2008 had they joined then but the IRB didn’t want it to happen.
I think they were scared of an 8N situation developing with SA joining the more lucrative 6N too which could devalue the World Cup, the IRB’s major source of income.
@poppa69: agree, a Argy S15 franchise is a must for their development. Not sure what standard their players back in Arg are like compared to the Euro-based players, but if they can get some cash together from the 3N perhaps they can entice some players home.
I was serious about NZ/Aus being major partners, what would happen to NZ rugby if they didn’t have a competitive Oz team. SA would join the 6N, there would be no Bledisloe, no HK game, lose TV money, NZ finances would be hit and they’d lose players. There’s a reason they’re on the same side of the negotiating table.
9 Mar 2010, 23:59 pm
@Puma:
will do mate – and good luck for your meeting tomorrow.
join ranger and myself for a frostie or two in rocks next month – ok?
10 Mar 2010, 00:00 am
@charo:
I do not share your views on rugby talk – I wont go so far as to say that they in general support the “rightwing” (we must also define who and what the “rightwing” is)but it is a fact that many of those who left are more inclined towards the “right”.
To me,the fact that they started their own blog (with strict control measures to keep certain people out) shows a lack of tolerance towards those with views that are radically different as well as a laager mentality.
I have no problem at all if people blog on both sides as long as they do not bad mouth bloggers from one site (or the site itself) when talking to their friends on the other side.
It is not really a serious issue.
10 Mar 2010, 00:00 am
@charo: what happens though once the 2mill from the IRB runs out… theres no guarantee that their inclusion will change the profits, which at the end of the day is the main driving force… will the SANZAR partners be willing to continually fund the Argentinians?
I think the first year or two it will pay for itself, after that I wonder about the financial viability of it all…
10 Mar 2010, 00:07 am
@KevinRack: on that same note Kevin, what about Canada and America? why are they not investing more in those countries? the market potential is enormous.. is it because they didnt show enough promise at the world cup?
as for the island nations, they have always struggled to produce quality forwards (there are exceptions) and forward packs that compete… we all know they produce some outstanding backs, but you cant see “poaching” (which I dont believe happens, of course I’ll be in the minority on this site) destroying their engine rooms… look at the Samoan team at the last world cup, the majority are NZ born and bred…
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