Bok fullback starts from scratch
15 Jul 2010
While Conrad Jantjes is relishing a return to the playing field, it will be some time before he returns to the Springbok fold.
On 2 May 2009, a horrific clash with Chiefs flank Liam Messam ended in tragedy for Jantjes. The Bok fullback had featured impressively on the 2008 tour to the United Kingdom and was expected to play a part in the British & Irish Lions series, but a broken leg shattered those ambitions and sidelined him for the next 14 months.
Jantjes returned to competitive rugby on 2 July in Western Province’s only warm-up game against the Griffons. A week later, he featured in the Cape side’s victory over the Cheetahs and displayed a fearless approach that suggested he was well and truly over the injury.
Speaking to keo.co.za, Jantjes said that while his confidence is returning, the past year has been a trying one from both a physical and psychological perspective. Fans may have seen that performance against the Cheetahs as the start of a comeback, but in reality, it’s taken Jantjes 14 months of toil to reach the point where he could run again.
‘It was really frustrating in the beginning of my rehab, I had to learn to crawl before I could walk,’ he recalls. ‘It was as much a mental battle as a physical one, and I’m still fighting that battle now. I never used to watch much rugby on TV because it frustrated me. I hungered to get back onto the field.’
As Jantjes suggests, the rehabilitation process isn’t yet over. Two steel pins are inserted into his leg, and his return to rugby is in fact two months ahead of schedule. He will use this year’s Currie Cup to build himself up, and this means a return to Test rugby may have to wait until 2011.
‘Everybody asks me if it’s in the back of my mind, but the truth is I can’t set myself those kinds of goals just yet. I’m grateful to be back, and people probably don’t appreciate what a major thing it is for me to be playing rugby again.
‘My confidence is returning with every game, and I’m sure my match sharpness and fitness will improve the more that I play. I didn’t really get many chances against the Griffons, but had some good touches against the Cheetahs that did my confidence good. You can’t let yourself worry about the injury, but it helps to get an early touch and settle the nerves.’
Jantjes added that the early form of this new-look WP backline has helped him readjust to the pace and intensity of the Currie Cup. Dewaldt Duvenage is the only player that started for the Stormers in the Super 14 with Peter Grant playing his rugby in Japan, Joe Pietersen defecting to France, and the rest of the backline joining the Boks’ Tri-Nations squad.
‘It’s easier for me coming back into this kind of environment. In the Super 14, the Stormers had a really strong defence and that’s been carried through to the Currie Cup. I’ve been really pleased with the way the midfield [Paul Bosch and Tim Whitehead] has come along. If you don’t have to do much tackling as a fullback, then you know your midfield is doing well.
‘Fabian Juries, Frikkie Welsh and myself have also worked well together at the back, so it’s a good start.’
Jantjes maintains that the Currie Cup will be used ‘as part of his rehabilitation’, but there is still an outside chance that he will tour with the Boks in November. Zane Kirchner hasn’t let the Boks down this season, but hasn’t really offered them anything special, and with Frans Steyn’s ongoing omission South Africa are short on fullback options a year out from the World Cup.
A strong showing in the domestic competition could provide Janjtes with a springboard to Test rugby, which in turn should provide him with a chance to prove his worth before the global tournament. For the moment, that remains the best case scenario, as Jantjes is rightly focusing on regaining his fitness one match at a time.
By Jon Cardinelli
175 Comments
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15 Jul 2010, 10:06 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-100:
15 Jul 2010, 10:06 am
cheers all.
15 Jul 2010, 10:07 am
@justrugby(justrugby)-94: I’m with you on that one, for the Bulls Steggies and Potgieter did the same sort of job as Schalk/Potties. If you have to have a Spies (and i’m not convinced you always do). you need to play other players around him.
Smacks a bit of putting the cart before the horse…
15 Jul 2010, 10:07 am
@PissAnt(PissAnt)-95: But you need to consider that Monty was doing most of the kicking when James was flyhalf
15 Jul 2010, 10:07 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-100:
compliment = complement. So shoot me for typing a bit too fast in my eagerness to point out the folly of your arguments.
15 Jul 2010, 10:08 am
@Falken(Falken)-97: I do not read anything in my post @ 74 referring to the S14. That is why I included Wilkinson. Maybe my inclusion of Cooper was the thing that confused you. So please, my man, before you want to argue with the adults, learn to read and stop arguing with the voices in your own head before you want to comment.
15 Jul 2010, 10:09 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-96: to be totally frank….
i like it and feel thats a lot better than the team we will see on Sat….
Although Chilliboy in place of liebenberg .
15 Jul 2010, 10:10 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-100: fark boet….that was moer funny….i havent spilt my tea for a while….but did then!
cheers
15 Jul 2010, 10:11 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-99:
Spies has not delivered in the big tests, admit it and stop trying to vindicate his weakness by trying to deflect the blame onto the Province loosies .
Spies looks good on the Out surance adverts, perhaps his future lies in TV, at least he does not have to tackle !!!
15 Jul 2010, 10:11 am
@WestAussieBok(WestAussieBok)-104:
26 of his 38 tests were played with Percy or during the time Percy played (from 2004 to 2008).
Butch James did not play any rugby for the Boks in 2004 or 2005 and only came in midway through 2006.
15 Jul 2010, 10:16 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-106: “MS did not have the best season for the Bulls either.”
That was the first line of your comment.
Thus referring to Super 14
So now that you have been proved wrong by the stats (see comments 83 and 95) dont try and swing the debate somewhere else.
Admit your wrong or prove that you are not.
But i will take your comments with a pinch of salt seeing that you are not the brightest spark around.
15 Jul 2010, 10:16 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-99: It’s a pity that we aren’t playing the Stormers this weekend then, but rather the All-Blacks, which as you know is filled with New Zealand Rugby Players, who, by the way, were beaten every time this season by the Stormers, in contrast to the Blue Bulls who guess what, lost to them this year.
So by that argument, the team should be filled with Stormers, who have a 100% record against the Kiwis this year, as apposed to Bulls players (who don’t)??
See how you reasoning is all to often flawed by the “We beat you guys to all our players must be better” fallacy???
Getting it yet? Didn’t think so.
15 Jul 2010, 10:18 am
sorry, should read “we beat you guys so all our players must be better” fallacy..
15 Jul 2010, 10:19 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-112:
good point bud… very good point…!!
15 Jul 2010, 10:20 am
Ok but he was rarely the first choice kicker in the tests he played.
Perhaps I’ve misunderstood the purpose of your original post but I took it that you were using points scored to demonstrate that Morne was more influential/better than James.
If so, it’s not an accurate reflection when you consider that kicking was not a Butch James strength and he did not have an opportunity to kick for poles as often.
Otherwise, by that logic Henry Honiball would be considered a poor flyhalf.
15 Jul 2010, 10:22 am
@WestAussieBok(WestAussieBok)-115: Sorry, response to Pissant #110.
15 Jul 2010, 10:23 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-112:
I’m not gonna bother responding to that ridiculous point.
Going by your logic, we should then pick zero Stormers against the Aussies, as you guys lost to the Brumbies, Reds and the Force.
You put up a straw man argument, pretending that it is my point of view, and then disprove that argument, claiming to have proved me wrong.
Poor reasoning skills there, young man.
Fact is, the Louw Burger combination isn’t working for the Boks.
Ironically, in the studio before the game, Marshall pointed out to Skinstad that he felt a weakness for the Boks was that they didn’t have a out and out Brussouw/Mccaw type of fetcher to do the damage at the breakdowns.
True’s Bob, Louw didn’t steal a single ball at the breakdown during the entire game.
And he didn’t make a lot of tackles either. He also didn’t have a single ball carry that I can remember.
So that begs the question: What exactly did he do for 80 minutes, other than hang around, waiting for a loose ball which never came?
That’s not the job of a no.7 flank, not when you are occupying the position vacated by Juan Smith, and when you have Dewald Potgieter waiting in the wings.
15 Jul 2010, 10:24 am
@justrugby(justrugby)-109: Lay off Spies; He is the 8th man in SA with something “special” as he himself has mentioned in the article in SA rugby mag. H3e is also regarded as one of the best no. 8′s in the world by many pundits.
15 Jul 2010, 10:25 am
@ufo(ufo)-114: Thanks boet, but unfortunately it’s likely to fall on deaf ears…..pearls before swine and all that….
15 Jul 2010, 10:30 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-117:
And Spies was just full of fire and brimstone, working his socks off trying to assist ??
15 Jul 2010, 10:33 am
@John1976(John1976)-118:
Go watch Sat’s game again my friend……if that’s the best 8th man in the world then there must be a lot of c rap 8′s around because he was diabolical, !!! and i will say it as I see it !!
If he was good I would give him the credit…….but he was shite !!
15 Jul 2010, 10:34 am
@WestAussieBok(WestAussieBok)-115:
Fair enough…
But then on what basis do we measure Butch’s value ahead of that of Morne in the current setup?
Because from what I read – some okes suggests Butch is a better option at 10 than Morne and I would like to know how they make that deduction?
15 Jul 2010, 10:38 am
@justrugby(justrugby)-120:
IT
IS
NOT
HIS
JOB
to make more tackles than the flanks, or to win turnovers.
This is not the Rassie school of rugby, where each loose forward can interchange with each of the others, where Luke Watson or Schalk Brits can pack down at number 8, and where the 8thman has the same job as the fetcher.
This is the real world. Where the flanks need to do their job properly for the primary ball carrier to do what he was intended to do.
Why pick a player like Spies if you aren’t going to use him primarily as a ball carrier? That’s like picking Os du Randt to assist with the tactical kicking.
Use a player according to his strengths, otherwise you are wasting him.
It is called specialization, and is originally an economic concept, where you can produce much more, and do it much more efficiently, if each guy sticks to what he is good at, instead of having to be a generalist covering multiple functions.
Once Spies is forced to commit to the breakdown, you have lost the primary function he is there to fulfill in the first place.
It really should not be so difficult to get you to grasp this.
15 Jul 2010, 10:39 am
@Falken(Falken)-111: OK, let me give you a little lesson in punctuation. You will see that the first comment referred to Grant’s comment that Steyn is good for the Bulls, but not always so good for the Boks.
Then there is a space – indicating a new paragraph and a new line of thought.
I apologize if I am confusing you.
So, to clarify things, I would like to ask you one question:
“Do you think Morne Steyn is the best flyhalf in the world at present?”
15 Jul 2010, 10:43 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-124:
He is the best flyhalf in South Africa, at present. That is all the info we need for decision making purposes.
15 Jul 2010, 10:44 am
you guys are gonna give tacci a heart attack saying spies did not play well
15 Jul 2010, 10:45 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-123: OK, Spies was poor because his loose forward buddies did not do their work. Is this what you are saying?
Louw did not get one steal in the game and not one ball carry. Therefore Spies was poor.
But, if the flanks were not complementing him, what do the flanks need from other team members to be effective, or do they perform in isolation?
15 Jul 2010, 10:46 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-123:
Come on Tac, you know better than that. Spies is only good with ball in hand when he has a bit of space. A test 8 needs to do a bit more than that, to justify his place.
15 Jul 2010, 10:46 am
@justrugby(justrugby)-121:I was only joking.
I agree he was diabolical in last weekend’s clash. I personally think that he is “show pony” pretending to be a rugby forward. He attempted tackles actually also reminded me of the way Rose was defending in this year’s S14 competition.
15 Jul 2010, 10:47 am
World Cup squad i would take:
15 Conrad Janjtes
14 JP Pietersen
13 Jaque Fourie
12 Jean De Villiers
11 Bryan Habana
10 Morne Steyn
9 Fourie Du Preez
8 Pierre Spies
7 Juan Smith
6 Schalk Burger
5 Victor Matfield
4 Danie Russouw
3 BJ Botha
2 John Smit
1 Tendai Mtawarira
16 Bismark Du Plessis
17 CJ Van Der Linde
18 Andries Bekker
19 Francois Louw
20 Ricky Januarie
21 Wynand Olivier
22 Gio Aplon
23 Tiaan Liebenberg
24 Guthro Steenkamp
25 Bakkies Botha
26 Heindrich Brussouw
27 Francois Hougaard
28 Peter Grant
29 Juan De Jongh
30 Zane Kirchner / Louis Ludik
15 Jul 2010, 10:47 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-125: That is exactly what I said, and I will say it again, Morne Steyn is the best flyhalf in the country by a mile
15 Jul 2010, 10:47 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-117: LOL for someone who wasn’t going to bother responding you certainly had a lot to say. It’s not surprising that you are not getting the point. You are the one constantly trying to promote the idea of an almost all Blue Bulls team, based on the fact that “we won the Super 14, we beat the Strormers so our players must be better” etc. etc. etc. You’ll notice that my argument is obviously failed, and that was the point.
“Going by your logic, we should then pick zero Stormers against the Aussies, as you guys lost to the Brumbies, Reds and the Force”. That’s my point. It doesn’t make sense, any more than “the stormers lost to the Bulls therefore the Bulls loose trio is the better one against the NZ’ers”. Sorry, that’s the error in logic that you seem to have, not me.
I was using it to illustrate that you have a constant bias based on the erroneous assupmtion that because a team is the champion team, that all the players in that team are by extension better than the other available players, which the rest of the country seems to get, but which the Blue Bulls supporters seem to miss, and if they do get it, their posts certainly often fail to convey this.
You know as well as I that rugby is an intricate balance of 15 (22) players working together in a very sophisticated system that relies on people fulfilling roles and supporting other players in their roles. If one facet is struggling, it is likely that the rest will struggle too. The whole system failed on saturday, leading to most players looking below par. Pierre is one of those that constantly seem to be left wanting in critical situations like this, and yes, I expect him to perform better than Flo, he’s the senior player and must lead by example. Same for Victor and JS.
15 Jul 2010, 10:50 am
@PissAnt(PissAnt)-122:
I certainly agree that Morne is more influential and a better option than Butch overall. It was just the use of “points scored” as an argument to prove it that didn’t mesh.
Ultimately, they are completely different types of players so to argue who is best on an individual basis would be fruitless.
To me, the way to value the player can only be done within a team context and on that front, it can only be Morne. He suits the Bok game plan (kick/chase, territorial etc…) perfectly, he’s the only recognised kicker in the team and his partnership with Du Preez (obviously not relevant this year) makes for the most effective combination.
15 Jul 2010, 10:51 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-117: No Tac, that is excellent reasoning skills
15 Jul 2010, 10:51 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-123:
Then it would be good if he does actually carry the ball up, it is surley his job to tackle ?? or is this just the other 14 role, it is surely his job to drop back and cover??, it is surely his job to make cover tackles , it is surely his job to control the ball at the back of the scrums ?
He is an 8th man FFS, not just a ball carrier , but he does not even do this effectively, often going to ground a the slightest contact !!!
15 Jul 2010, 10:51 am
@WestAussieBok(WestAussieBok)-133:
I am a fan of Butch back in the squad make no mistake. Morne simply offers more as a 10 at the moment.
15 Jul 2010, 10:54 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-123: Ok so if the game plan is not working and the tight five are getting a hammering as they were on Saturday, is it then Pierre’s job to just stand back and wait untill he gets good go forward ball so he can run it up?? (It’s not my job to tackle) Or does he have to adapt, get stuck in and help support the primary ball stealer when the others are not up to the job??
Your reasoning is akin to the Naas Botha “I’m not here to tackle” reasoning, which doesn’t surprise me, with you preferring to be be defined by history and not the present an all… The problem is that Pierre is no Naas, and no one in modern rugby will ever be allowed to be a “Naas” again. The game has evolved beyond specialists, just as economics has. This isn’t Adam Smith’s division of labour anymore boet. The concept relates to manufaturing and unless you live in China, that no longer works.
15 Jul 2010, 10:55 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-132:
Again, you raise a supposed position that I have taken which is not the case. And you claim my ACTUAL position as yours.
Poor attempt.
I do NOT advocate all Bulls to be in the Bok team.
I DO advocate that specialists be chosen who complement one another’s styel of play.
The current Bok pack does not offer that synergy.
My suggestions are based on which players WOULD function well together, not which province they come from.
The fact that most of them DO come from the Bulls, is maybe not so astonishing as you make out, given that they have proven highly effective together – being champions of the Southern Hemisphere and all.
15 Jul 2010, 10:56 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-132:
Dont worry im sure in Francois Louw was a bulls player he would be a certainty in the starting 15 and the same goes to JDV at 12, oh and also burger should apparently be replaced by steggman? haahaha, NO.
This raises the question why are there so many people who want the national side to involve as many of their franchises players as possible?
And also that after one test against the All Blacks who at the moment along with the wallabies when they bring their best are the only team in the world capable of beating the boks, there is too much unrest after just one loss.
15 Jul 2010, 10:57 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-137:
Don’t know where you learned your economics. Must be in the same place you learned your rugby.
Die kroeg agter Nuweland se spoorweg paviljoen.
15 Jul 2010, 11:00 am
@PissAnt(PissAnt)-136: Absolutely. And I think that is PDV’s reason for bringing him in. He’s recognised that our bench has been one of our weaknesses so there’s certainly an attraction to having an experienced, world cup winner sitting on our bench who can cover flyhalf and centre.
15 Jul 2010, 11:02 am
@GI POT(GI POT)-124: Thanks for the lesson.
Ok so lets say you did not mention anything about Super 14. My bad then but his stats prove your comments wrong at any level be it Super 14 or Test level.
“He does not have the ability to put his backline away into gaps and create space on the outside. He does not have the footwork to beat opponents other than tight forwards and he does not have the pace off the mark to hit gaps.”
All i wanted to do was show you that this part of your comment was way off line.
I would not go as far as saying he is the best in the world. With Dan Carter around that will never happen.
So if this is the point you are trying to make i take back what i said!
15 Jul 2010, 11:02 am
@WestAussieBok(WestAussieBok)-141:
The bench isn’t the weakness, it’s his inability to use it! And when he does load the bench with non-entities, he alone is to blame for that. He keeps shooting himself in the foot.
15 Jul 2010, 11:04 am
Can I now play in the 8th man debate?
Flyhalf one is boring…
15 Jul 2010, 11:05 am
@Rhys7(Rhys7)-139:
You have a short memory there was the same unrest around here during the Tri Nations campaigns of 05/06/07/08. When the Ab’s get 50% of the ball they usually beat the Bokke, last year we had no lineout so the pickings were very easy for the Bokke. If we get parity in the lineout on Saturday we will win again as our backs are far more creative, score more tries per match and don’t rely on intercepts.
15 Jul 2010, 11:10 am
@Falken(Falken)-142: Falken, I must apologize for my little rant. It was not aimed at you, more to do with my utter frustration at the inept showing of the Boks on Saturday.
I had a little time to reflect on all the debates that are going on here regarding Spies, Flo, WO, MS, Januarie, JDV, JS et al. It would be grossly unfair of us to judge any of them on the showing they gave on Saturday because they were all very poor.
Maybe there is method to PDV’s selection of the same team excepting the enforced changes. A better performance by all and sundry will make it easier to judge and if we lose again this Saturday, he will be in a better position to judge who the players are that do not deserve to be there.
15 Jul 2010, 11:15 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-140: Mate, I have a degree in economics from the University of Stellenbosch, and am quite secure in my post in that regard. Perhaps you could be more specific as to my errors? Is it because I fail to see the relevance of the concept of division of labour and it’s benefits to your assertion that Pierre is a specialist? Boet everyone is a specialist, just like the scrumhalf’s job is to clear the ruck and pass the ball to the backline, but that doesn;t mean he mustn’t get stuck into all the other facets of play.
As for you refuting my assertion, then fine, however i think that if you did a quick survey around here and asked all the other bloggers, they would certainly echo my sentiments. If that isn’t what you believe then fine, but it’s certainly what your posts all too often imply.
15 Jul 2010, 11:16 am
@PissAnt(PissAnt)-136: although i agree it also depends on the game plan PA , and who you are playing
horses for courses
fact is in the super 14 morne was **** in NZ and aussie , yet shone when back home
that is also a factor one must take into account
15 Jul 2010, 11:18 am
@Alucard(Alucard)-143: That’s true. But I think Butch’s inclusion is part of his plan to address that. At least if he’s still stuffing up the timing of his substitutions, we can hope a more experienced player will help maintain momentum.
Whether it’ll work out or not is yet to be seen. It reminds me a little of Jake White bringing back Andre Snyman shortly before the 2007 WC. It would have been brilliant to have someone of his calibre and experience at the WC but he was not the same player anymore and the experiment was dropped.
Hopefully Butch can make a contribution.
15 Jul 2010, 11:23 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-147: And by the way I learned my rugby at the same place. The largest Rugby club in the world and the holder of more club championship titles than any other club in SA. That must mean that all our players are better than any other club players then
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