Smit to feel Bismarck’s heat
29 Jul 2010
GRANT BALL writes that Bismarck du Plessis’ imminent return to rugby heaps further pressure on John Smit.
Smit has rightfully been criticised by former players, coaches and the media for his performances over this international season, especially on the Springboks’ Australasian tour. On his return to South Africa this week, that pressure would have increased with news that Du Plessis – the Boks’ first-choice hooker last year – is back in training and taking contact after being out for three months.
Du Plessis won’t feature for the Sharks this weekend, but is set for a return to the 22 next weekend when they play the Lions. It will take some time for him to regain his best form and fitness after a serious neck injury, but what has been clear regarding Smit is that his form spirals without having Du Plessis pushing him, although he won’t have that luxury now.
Du Plessis’ return to the playing field will be two weeks before the Boks’ first home Test in the Tri–Nations, and while it would be unrealistic to expect him to force his way into that squad in such a short time, Smit will know that further laboured individual and team performances will have his critics salivating.
Smit will start at Soccer City, as part of the fanfare in the build-up has revolved around it being his 100th Test. Peter de Villiers has also stated his intentions and placed his faith in Smit until the end of the World Cup, handing him a contract until then.
If Du Plessis recovers fully from the injury and rediscovers any sort of form similar to last year, there’s no question that he offers more playing value than Smit. However, in the Boks’ current player-driven system, Smit’s leadership takes on even more importance, although even those attributes have waned with his and the team’s form on the decline.
Against the top nations like New Zealand, Australia and France at a World Cup, the Boks won’t be able to carry passengers and they require the best players on the field – not selecting a captain and then basing the rest of the side around that.
Du Plessis’ unrivalled physicality and mobility that sees him act as an extra loose forward – which will gain even more importance under the new law interpretations – was the initial reason why Smit was moved to tighthead in 2008. With Smit being so off the pace in the Tri–Nations at hooker, the remaining question is whether he’ll continue to be used there through until the World Cup.
After being so selfless for the Boks throughout his career, Smit needs to make the decision on which position he’ll play. He believes he offers the most to the team at hooker, but he’s been hampered by putting on extra weight for the tighthead switch. What’s clear with Du Plessis set to return is that Smit needs to be better conditioned and he must display a level of form that will silence his detractors ahead of the World Cup.
Accommodating Smit and Du Plessis in the same team has been a problem for the Sharks and Boks since 2008, and it’s set to continue with Du Plessis’ return next week.
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210 Comments
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29 Jul 2010, 17:14 pm
The WC games will nto be as fast as the 3 nations even with the new rules and there will be a lot more set-pieces etc.
The pressure the occasion and the fear of making mistakes will make the games very different to what we see now.
I wouldn;t use a 3 natiosn to judge a WC.
WC’s are won on defense, experience and territory and goal kicking (including drop kicks)
We have those, just make sure they are conditioned as best position come the time
29 Jul 2010, 17:15 pm
This whole we want to be pretty like the AB’s will not win us a WC.
29 Jul 2010, 17:16 pm
@Mike H(Mike H)-97: i’m quite chilled actually… 008 is just a big blinkered Smit sycophant.
i saw a thread where big hit was thrashing the whole notion of sh teams touring in november & calling their clean up of the home unions the ‘grand slam’
he was quite vociferous then.
29 Jul 2010, 17:16 pm
We all know what a disaster it was getting sentimental and handing Makhaya Ntini his 100th cap. He wasn’t up to and we lost the test…
There is no room for sentimentality in sport.
29 Jul 2010, 17:17 pm
103. Transformation(Transformation) :
HAHAHA
Anyway I’m off to play some golf, laters
29 Jul 2010, 17:19 pm
104. fish out of water(fish out of water) :
I still would have given Ntini his 100th cap. Winning a arbitary game is not everything when a guy has been a loyal servant for 10 years or more.
29 Jul 2010, 17:19 pm
@willievz(willievz)-98:
I agree, it seems to be a forgotten skill. You know, I hear JWs adage that defence wins WCs often stated here, as if it was some form of divine directive. The reality is that defence (bad) can lose WCs, which is a different perspective. When you look at the two Aussie WC wins, sure they had a superb defence, but they also had a great attack. We seem to select our centres more for their size as defenders, as if knocking the the ball carrier into another dimension is the sole criteria. It’s a cop out. The Aussies relied on their defensive organisation and technique to do the job, not the physical strength of the player.
29 Jul 2010, 17:19 pm
@Mike H(Mike H)-100:
John has been shocking in the 3N ………..it is a slap in the face to other leaders to say that JS is the only one that can lead the Boks, what a load of bollocks !!!
By accommodating JS you are either going to be keeping Bissy out or Guthro out (god forbid they use him as a 3), this means the best in their positions won’t be playing, something you can ill afford at a WC, no player can be “accommodated” at a WC !!
JS has 2 WC’s which he has played in……… very few make it to a 3rd and the way he is physically I cannot see him making it !!
29 Jul 2010, 17:20 pm
John is just tired mentally and physically AND he’s out of shape. He has plenty of heart, but when you only succeed in 66% of the tackles you attempt there is definitely a problem.
In the 2nd test against NZ he made 4 tackles and missed 5! To put that in perspective Gurthro managed 10 and missed 1!
29 Jul 2010, 17:22 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-90:
Sggies isn’t unjured, he’s out for at least 6 weeks.
29 Jul 2010, 17:22 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-94: we agree on Smit’s fitness for hooker, I was just pointing out he can have a place in the team.
I think it is fair to say we don’t expect as much dynamism at 2 and do generally look upon a hooker as a prop who can throw but perhaps that’s changing. Steve Thompson was fat all last season and was limited to the bench, it was only when he was back up to speed that he was granted a start at 2. Most people didn’t want him near the team, he was judged as too old etc but MJ saw he still had the talent and I think he’ll be up there with Bismarck as the world’s best hooker by the end of the year. It pays to keep faith in the talent even if it is the wrong side of 30.
@Mike H(Mike H)-97: lol yeah I recall, I think time on keo has mellowed my outlook
29 Jul 2010, 17:22 pm
Sorry, Steggies.
29 Jul 2010, 17:25 pm
WC Best possible 22 imo (squad of 30)
1 John Smit
2 Bismark du Plessis
3 Guthro Steenkamp (think he can do 3 as well?)
4 Bakkies Botha (he will get over his klein mannetjie sindroom)
5 Victor Mattfield
6 Heinrich Brussouw
7 Juan Smith
8 Schalk Burger
9 Fourie du Preez
10 Morne Steyn
11 Brian Habanna
12 Jean de Villiers
13 Jacque Fourie
14 JP Peterson
15 Frans Steyn
16 Jannie du Plessis
17 CJ van der Linde
18 Danie Russouw
19 Pierre Spies
20 Ruan Pienaar
21 Butch James
22 Gio Aplon
Bissie and John are the hookers (if bissie gets injured, john can move…but think bissie can finish 99% of games)
CJ can cover both sides, and if bissie off: guthro to 1
Pakslae covers lock (and 8 if needs) and pierre loosies, schalla can move around also
Ruan can do 9, 15, 10
Butch can do 10, 13
Gio can do 11/14/15. If centre goes, frans can move in.
REST of squad:
BJ Botha
Chilliboy Ralepelle
Andries Bekker
Dewald Potgieter/Francois Louw/Deon Stegman (wild card #1 slot)
Francois Houghard
Juan de Jongh
Lionel Mapoe
Zane Kirchner/Wynand Olivier (wild card #2 slot)
29 Jul 2010, 17:26 pm
I reckon give Smit a first half run at Soccer City, then replace him with Chilli for the rest of the 3N.
29 Jul 2010, 17:28 pm
@David(David)-107: agree david, also agree with your point about the best centre combination being that of a distributor and a carrier paired together. Not sure why SA coaches don’t note the success other nations have with this approach and follow suit. They seem to want to pick players to crash over the opposition and if that doesn’t work they’re rendered useless.
29 Jul 2010, 17:29 pm
108. justrugby(justrugby) :
Real MAdrid tried to have the best in all positions and they sucked ever since.
it’s not necessarily about the best in the position. You tell me who would lead the Boks to the WC2011 better than SMit?
Ok off to golf.
29 Jul 2010, 17:29 pm
@OUToftheBOKS(OUToftheBOKS)-113:
sorry…meant butch can do 10, 12
29 Jul 2010, 17:30 pm
@David(David)-114: sentimental 100th Test cap like Percy who was playing utter kak at the time and teh team got nilled @ Newlands. When will we ever learn?!
29 Jul 2010, 17:34 pm
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-115:
JdeV had his attacking flair curbed by JW, in my opinion. The previous combo of de Wet and Joubert was similar to Nonu and Conrad, so we have tried it successfully. It’s just that when it comes to the crunch our provincial selectors go for size. The current Sharks line up for Saturday shows the Kiwi influence with Lambie at 12. PdeV seems to be a proponent of a skillfull distributor at 12 or 13 and Muir was a superb distributing centre in his day, so all is not lost.
29 Jul 2010, 17:34 pm
Big Hit and Mike H solutions…..
Fark me,, this is actually scary….
Take the best loosehead [ guthro ] and play him at tighthead.
Take the kak fat hooker [ smit ] and play him at loosehead.
Fark me Mary!!!!!
Now see the normal okes reaction….
Take the best Lossehead and play him at loosehead.
Take the best hooker and play him at hooker.
take the best tihjthead and play him at tighthead.
Bobs your aunt.
29 Jul 2010, 17:35 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-118:exactly….i was there….he couild not even run!!!
29 Jul 2010, 17:35 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-118:
Why not, give him his 40 minutes and 100th cap, we’ve thrown the 3N anyway. It’s the least we can do.
29 Jul 2010, 17:38 pm
@Mike H(Mike H)-106: well that says it all…
you a farken amateur poser my man.
Alex Fergusonand Mourinho would choke themselves before such gross sentimentality.
I say it again….most saffas still think like amateurs.
29 Jul 2010, 17:39 pm
@David(David)-122: stuff thst David….that cap is not a right.
He does not deserve it….he has made buggerall attempt to get in shape.
29 Jul 2010, 17:40 pm
@grant10(grant10)-120:
Smit has served us well. I think it’s a bit much to refer to him as a “kak fat hooker”. At least show some respect for what he’s done for the Boks.
29 Jul 2010, 17:40 pm
@grant10(grant10)-120:
…that should be the case.
Bissie and Guthro are the best in their positions.
Smit was kuk at 3, and from what i recall at the sharks, he was not too bad at 1 (when him, bissie and jannie did very well).
What I think about guthro: class enough to be as good at 3 as at 1.
Perfect world: bissie at 2 and guthro at 1. But although I believe also smit is not the best in ANY position…this way the as my team above, we limit the damages of not playing best players…and again, hate to admit it, but i believe we cant drop smit now as captain (1.5 years too late for that). Or will you rather play Guthro, bissie, jannie/Bj? I really think guthro is good enough to mix it up both sides
29 Jul 2010, 17:44 pm
@David(David)-107: Very good point David. I mentioned in the last few weeks that we lost the games against NZ partly because of bad offense, and not only poor defense.
By running skew / diagonal lines in the backlines, our centres and wings collided with defense on their wrong shoulders, preventing them to place or syphon clean ball back to supporting players. The result was that our support arrived from the side or players holding on. The problem with support arriving on the side is not only that it is illegal and punishable, but if left unpunished, those defenders are with their backs to the ball and unbalanced for the next defensive move. The worst case scenario, however, was quick turnover ball, where the AB outside backs exposed us in the wider channels.
The difference between their back play and ours were remarkable. Our centres and 10 merely pass the ball, while the ABs distribute the ball, creating space and therefore attacking options for the next receiver.
On defense, however, we made crucial mistakes too, especially by allocating too many numbers at collision points in later phases. The players who were supposed to guard the fringes also were sucked in, and in many cases, these include a center (particularly a problem if a center guards the blindside, which means a forward will be in the backline on defense covering the openside regardless if the center is sucked in or not).
Because players were sucked in, an overlap became the norm on the AB ball, further compounded by our wings shooting up for the intercept and to try and cramp the space of the players looking to utilise that overlap.
Centres have vision on defense and is in a perfect position to decide whether or not to get involved in a collision or whether to guard the fringes. This is why I always cry out for a defensive organiser in the forwards (ideally the
and a defensive organiser in the backline (the centres).
So to cut a long story short, did the bigger centre(s) do the job?
29 Jul 2010, 17:46 pm
@David(David)-125: like the respect he showed Luke??
Stuff that…..
29 Jul 2010, 17:47 pm
@willievz(willievz)-127: “next defensive move” should read next supporting or assisting move.
29 Jul 2010, 17:47 pm
@OUToftheBOKS(OUToftheBOKS)-126: guthro will be killed at 3…
Smit was
Heinke vd merwe was
Os would not even contemplate trying 3….its insane my man…insane.
29 Jul 2010, 17:48 pm
anyway….drinks with mates
cheers
and for the love of the angels catch a wake up and smell the coffee Plod.
29 Jul 2010, 17:49 pm
@grant10(grant10)-123: guys like mikeh will stop supporting boks once plod retires…they’re so sentimental….
29 Jul 2010, 17:51 pm
@grant10(grant10)-130:
Im not too jacked up when it comes to prop play…dont think anyone is except if you are actually a big ol guy that spent time there!
But agree…best players will have to play in position, BUT we need smit. Cant lose Bissie or Guthro…only other option then is to play smittie at 3 again…he didnt do that badly there last year, did he…not worse than EOYT other props (clubs made us look kuk then)….so, for me, it is a decision where the effect of accommodation plod will lead to least damages! unfortunately. they should have made someone else captain last year allready…
29 Jul 2010, 17:52 pm
@grant10(grant10)-131:
Have a good one!
29 Jul 2010, 17:52 pm
@willievz(willievz)-127:
Yup, I was also tearing my hair out at the way we just aimlessly shovelled the ball down the backline.
On another point. The one player I was sad to see leave SA was Ernst Joubert. He’s big and fast while also being an intelligent player, the perfect replacement for Juan or even at 8.
29 Jul 2010, 17:53 pm
@Mike H(Mike H)-106: An arbitrary game perhaps but a test that in hindsight we could of and should of won in Ntini didn’t leak over 100 runs per wicket.
Pick on form and form alone – and I will say again sentimentality has no place sports.
If Smit isn’t good enough – which at the moment he isn’t – he should not play.
29 Jul 2010, 17:53 pm
Prove me wrong….
But I can almost guarantee you…
that no matter what you say…
I’m convinced that ending your sentences with ‘…’ …
And writing in one line paragraphs…
Is a sign of…
neurosis…
29 Jul 2010, 17:56 pm
@RedMan(RedMan)-137:
29 Jul 2010, 17:59 pm
@David(David)-135: He is one of my favourites too, unlucky not to have a Bok blazer in his cupboard.
29 Jul 2010, 18:05 pm
@willievz(willievz)-139:
He seems to be doing incredibly well at Sarries. I just wonder whether Johan Rupert will be good to his promise of giving young Saffas experience that they can bring back home?
29 Jul 2010, 18:06 pm
But back to the topic:
We need to ask ourselves one fundamental question:
How crucial is Smit for the team?
Considering that most of the players in the Bok outfit are already an experienced bunch and do not need a father to change their nappies, I think they will be fine without him.
However, I do appreciate that the concerns are really regarding external liaison and media relations. Captaining the Boks is a completely different animal than captaining another country. But someone needs to it when he is no longer there.
Perhaps I am just silly but I think his importance to the overall cause is overstated.
But I would still pick him if fit, on playing abilities.
29 Jul 2010, 18:11 pm
@willievz(willievz)-141: i quite enjoy your pragmatism dude…
29 Jul 2010, 18:29 pm
Well it will take some time before Bismark hits top form i would think after this injury. Three home wins and the media would back off a bit….until the end if year tour….that’s when the heat will really be on Smit because then you will have both players available for selection.
29 Jul 2010, 18:34 pm
@willievz(willievz)-141: if i recall correctly i think it was smit who once said…captaining SA is more than just flipping a coin and talking to the referees once in a while. I agree with you….id also pick him if fully fit…and right now its looking like a big if
29 Jul 2010, 18:43 pm
This is starting to piss me off a little bit. Bismarck is not THAT good a hooker. If you take away his physical presence, he is a pretty useless hooker.
You Bismarck fanatics say his scrummaging is too good to pass up. But he was in the team last year and scrumming was our biggest concern? And if you wanna blame the props, then you’re still proving my point. If the scrum is gonna suck with or without him, then why not have a more skilled hooker?
Enter Gary Botha. By a looooong way the best hooker in the country. He has every single base covered. He’s got good leadership, brains, temprement and amazing talent. In terms of play, he can tick all the boxes. He is good at the rucks, at the scrums, throwing in the line out, in open play and his defence is absolutely superb.
Bismarck is seemingly incapable of throwing the ball in straight which reall annoys me but also, I am sick and tired of dirty players. If Bismarck isn’t off the field with a red or yellow, he’s either banned or injured. The Boks need someone more stable and reliable and that is Gary Botha.
Still, I think it’s disgusting that we’re even still discussing John Smit’s involvment in the team. He is absolutely useless, full stop. He is an over rated captain as well. He doesn’t even deserve to be playing for the Sharks. Every part of his game is poor. The one thing he was good at was throwing in the line out but now even that’s for ****.
1. Gary Botha
2. Schalk Brits
3. Tiaan Liebenberg
4. Bismarck du Plessis
And John Smit is MUCH further down the list
29 Jul 2010, 18:51 pm
Glad to see Bismarck back.
For my money he and John are two completely different hookers and given what I saw in Bismarck’s absence no other hooker has the same impact he has.
Reference to Liebenberg and Strauss specifically.
29 Jul 2010, 18:53 pm
A choice of Bismarck and Smit at hooker is like ’08 with McCain and Obama. Two pretty kak choices
29 Jul 2010, 19:01 pm
@rugbywriter(rugbywriter)-147:
Are you in the States?
29 Jul 2010, 19:02 pm
@David(David)-148: Nah I just really love politics. Are you?
29 Jul 2010, 19:59 pm
The Boks management seem intent on playing over the hill players.
Which means in 14 months they will be even further over the hill.
Grant’s 120 is the sensible approach: pick your best tighthead and play him at tighthead; pick your best hooker, play him at hooker ….. go all the way through the team picking the best player at that position.
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