Preview: Wallabies vs All Blacks
30 Jul 2010
JON CARDINELLI foresees another Blackout this weekend as the Wallabies won’t be able to live with the All Blacks’ physicality.
Last Saturday, the Wallabies landed a blow that sent the Springboks down to the Tri-Nations canvas. They were rougher, tougher and ultimately smarter, and at the end of the Australasian tour from hell, the Boks had no reply.
The Wallabies’ dream start, however, will be short lived. They have home advantage, but they’re playing a team that’s grown stronger with every game this season.
After a scrappy start against Ireland and Wales, the All Blacks hit their straps against the Boks to score two bonus-point wins. They also managed to limit their opponents to two tries in two matches and 29 points overall.
The Aussies enjoyed similar success on the defensive front, but relied heavily on the boot of Matt Giteau to see them home. Their superior physical display was complemented by their ability to retain possession for long periods, and halfbacks Will Genia and Quade Cooper were instrumental in penetrating the Bok defence.
The All Blacks won’t be so generous. They smashed the Boks at the tackle at Eden Park and at the Cake Tin. In Richie McCaw, they have a player capable of slowing or stealing possession, and this will be key considering the All Blacks need to disrupt the Wallabies’ rhythm.
Cooper’s suspension is a setback for the hosts, even though Giteau is a more than competent 10. Whether he can offer Australia the same attacking edge is doubtful.
Neither Giteau nor Berrick Barnes are known for their abilities to take on the defence, and this, along with Australia’s likely loss at the collisions, is bound to limit the hosts’ overall potency. The All Blacks, having dominated the tackle point, had an easy time marshalling South Africa’s wide forays, and we should see more of the same in Melbourne.
The set-pieces will be interesting with Stephen Moore bolstering the Wallabies scrum and Nathan Sharpe sure to test an All Blacks lineout that enjoyed plenty of success against the Boks. But it will come down to the breakdowns and collisions, and the Aussies will play more territorially.
The Wallabies hardly kicked last week because they didn’t need to. The momentum was provided through their breakdown superiority, and as long as they retained possession, they usually prospered. This week, they’ll be outmatched in this area. They will strive for good field position and then try to build an attack from deep within All Blacks’ territory.
The Blacks will continue to employ their surge and destroy brand, although the Wallabies’ defence will be tougher to breach than that of the Boks. Dan Carter will vary his play in the early stages, and only once a comfortable lead’s been established will the visitors cut loose.
It may not be another bonus-point victory, but the win should bring the All Blacks one step closer to reclaiming the Tri-Nations title.
Prediction: All Blacks by 10
Wallabies – 15 Adam Ashley-Cooper, 14 James O’Connor, 13 Rob Horne, 12 Berrick Barnes, 11 Drew Mitchell, 10 Matt Giteau, 9 Will Genia, 8 Richard Brown, 7 David Pocock, 6 Rocky Elsom (c), 5 Nathan Sharpe, 4 Dean Mumm, 3 Salesi Ma’afu, 2 Stephen Moore, 1 Benn Robinson.
Subs: 16 Saia Faingaa, 17 James Slipper, 18 Rob Simmons, 19 Matt Hodgson, 20 Luke Burgess, 21 Anthony Faingaa, 22 Kurtley Beale.
All Blacks – 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Cory Jane, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma’a Nonu, 11 Joe Rokocoko, 10 Dan Carter, 9 Jimmy Cowan; 8 Kieran Read, 7 Richie McCaw, 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Tom Donnelly, 4 Brad Thorn, 3 Owen Franks, 2 Keven Mealamu, 1 Tony Woodcock.
Subs: 16 Corey Flynn, 17 Ben Franks, 18 Sam Whitelock, 19 Victor Vito, 20 Piri Weepu, 21 Aaron Cruden, 22 Israel Dagg.
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286 Comments
30 Jul 2010, 05:41 am
cooper suspension is a big blow….they’re in need of Ioane’s physicality coz this week O’Connor will be taken back to school as he always is against the all blacks
30 Jul 2010, 05:41 am
All Black – Fire breathing Dragons
30 Jul 2010, 05:41 am
Damn it!
30 Jul 2010, 05:42 am
s
30 Jul 2010, 05:45 am
@flanka(flanka)-1: O’Conner is a bit small isn’t he? Cruden has that problem too but size is not quite as crucial at 10 as it is at 15.
30 Jul 2010, 05:53 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-5: cruden is a bit of a stick…don’t get me wrong, o’connor’s no twig but when he gets roughed up earlier on he tends to go missing for the rest of the game and that was clear in last years bledisloes especially when they bombarded him with the high ball….that all black back 3 is just too classy and to think dagg’s on the bench..
30 Jul 2010, 05:57 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-5: Naas Botha couldn’t tackle an angry 8 year old girl, and he regularly ended matches with the cleanest pair of white shorts in the team. Didn’t stop him from being one of the finest flyhalves in history. Naas always had great protection in his channel from his openside flanker and no.8.
30 Jul 2010, 05:59 am
Eligibility:
O’Connor was eligible for all 3 Tri Nations teams because of his New Zealand born parents and South African born Grandmother. He was a Parramatta Eels rugby league junior in Sydney before switching over to rugby union at 15.
30 Jul 2010, 06:06 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-7: Harder to do that in today’s game? Flatter defences, players marking one-on-one, video analysis to concemtrate on weaknesses etc.
You see a lot of 10′s scrag-tackle these days to slow a player while another defender comes to finish him off. Dan Carter does this. Gregan did it a lot. Wilkinson did not – brave as Custer but he was not mindful of his body and that’s why he’s fcked now.
30 Jul 2010, 06:13 am
All Blacks used to put Mehrtens in at full back for first phase defence towards the end of his career and the Irish have done the same with O’Gara. The need to smash someone back in the tackle or stop them on the advantage line is greater at fly half and centre then it is at full back generally.
30 Jul 2010, 06:27 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-9: Gregan was the master of the small-man tackle, using the player’s own momentum against them.
Was the only Wallaby I ever saw that could take down Lomu one-on-one.
Surprised that more teams don’t take him on as a defense consultant, especially for their flyhalves.
30 Jul 2010, 06:31 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-11: Yeah, he hung around the neck like a dead albatross.
30 Jul 2010, 06:34 am
Anyway:
All Blacks 32 – 22 Wallabies
30 Jul 2010, 06:38 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-12: Modified version of one of the staple Judo throws, extremely effective.
Growing up I used to have to spar against Julian Salvi (now plying his trade with Bath and the Brumbies), who was a good 20-25kg my superior. Was the only way to take him down
30 Jul 2010, 06:43 am
Back to the game, I think the loss of Cooper may actually work in the Wallabies favour to an extent.
The All Blacks no doubt had a plan to shut him out of the game very early on by unsettling him, something I am surprised that Schalk and Danie etc did not do last week.
Barnes, while not having the same flair, is the most level headed player in the Wallaby setup, and his midfield defense is much stronger than a Cooper-Giteau combination.
Very even in many facets, but Wallabies will probably struggle at the breakdown unless they really put in the hard yards.
Wallabies by 5.
30 Jul 2010, 06:43 am
No Gregan now though and while Genia looks the goods, he’s still inexperienced, and unlike Gregan, won’t be able to psychologically beat the AB’s before the game’s kicked off.
30 Jul 2010, 06:48 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-15:
Brave call
30 Jul 2010, 06:50 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-15: The Wallabies do usually make the most of their hometown advantage and unless the Blacks put in a performance like Ak or even Wgtn it will be difficult to win. I’m picking that they will hold their intensity though.
30 Jul 2010, 06:52 am
“Celebrating Heaven’s Game Competition!” – Competition on KEO.
WTF? Why would you want to celebrate that monki-fcker?
30 Jul 2010, 06:58 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-15:
They tried but they could not get to him…
30 Jul 2010, 06:59 am
Its a shame about Cooper being banned (pathetic decision Bakkies is the only player who should of been banned) I would have favoured the Wallabies at home with him and Genia playing so well in tandem along with the rest of the team. I still reckon that the Aussie can win this one however. The Boks have made both teams look better, by not playing with a recognised fetcher against the likes of Mcaw and Pocock is pretty much suicide!
30 Jul 2010, 07:04 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-9: Dan Carter is a VERY good tackler, quite willing and able to cut off a ball-carrier at the knee. Scragging around the collar is not his preferred style.
30 Jul 2010, 07:04 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-13: I think the ABs will run away with this one
ABs confidence is very high and Aussies are a very poor streak against the ABs
I did not see anything special from the Aussies against the Boks
30 Jul 2010, 07:09 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-19: Why the anger, did you two lovers break up?
30 Jul 2010, 07:11 am
@HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-21: I’m hoping they get Hodgson on the field early in place of Brown.
More effective at the breakdown than Brown, so would help Pocock counterract King Richie.
Brown is not that strong a ball runner anyway.
30 Jul 2010, 07:15 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-25: Pocock is a Zimbabwean is he not?
30 Jul 2010, 07:17 am
@JL1(JL1)-26: Yes, moved to Aus when he was about 12 I believe.
30 Jul 2010, 07:23 am
I wonder if Robbie Deans would like to coach the Boks?I think he is gonna be u under pressure at the end of the 3Nations
30 Jul 2010, 07:30 am
21. Hong kong – yes it is but for some reason sa coaches refuse to learn this fact. I doubt we’ll play a fetcher in the home leg and no F louw is not a fetcher
30 Jul 2010, 07:36 am
@JL1(JL1)-26: kicked off their farm when he was 14…of course it wouldnt have mattered if he stayed in africa coz the ANC would toss him around regarding eligibility for the springboks
30 Jul 2010, 07:45 am
@JL1(JL1)-24: I’m new here but it didn’t take long for us not to see eye-to-eye.
30 Jul 2010, 07:46 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-25: Why do you reckon they are ignoring Higginbotham? He was awesome in the super 14. Maybe he still needs a few more games to get back to full fitness?
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-29: Until Stegman got injured last week, I thought he should have been brought into the team. People are obsessed with looking at players individually, but the combination and balance is crucial as well. A lot of people seem to think that Brusseuw wont be as effective under the new law interpretations, but I disagree. Pocock gave away 4 penalties against the Boks, for having his hands on the ball, and Ritchie Macaw did as well, but they slowed down the Boks and turned over a lot of possession, which meant there was no decent continuity at all for South Africa and hence the lack of trys. Brusseuw would have done the same, but the Boks chose otherwise.
30 Jul 2010, 07:50 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-22: Agreed. Has enough time and is smart enough to copy-book tackle when necessary but scrag when with supporting defenders thereby saving his body and increasing his longevity.
30 Jul 2010, 07:52 am
@HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-32: He is just coming back from an injury picked up late in the S14, I don’t think Deans wants to rush him back in.
Plus he really seems to rate Brown, I don’t know why (same with Burgess).
I’m also surprised that Stegmann wasn’t brought in, or at least Flouw given more time (after one bad game where whole forward pack were bad), especially after seeing how powerful Brussow was last year.
30 Jul 2010, 07:54 am
@HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-32:
Higginbottom was injured for a period, he only got back to playing a week before the team was announced. He is part of the squad and will get a run sooner or later. It does however appear if Deans have a thing for Brown…
30 Jul 2010, 07:55 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-34: By rushed back in, I just mean in, as it would be his debut. No point ruining him by throwing him into a Bledisloe not at 100%
30 Jul 2010, 07:55 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-34:
SNAP!!!
30 Jul 2010, 07:57 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-37: Great minds, etc
30 Jul 2010, 07:59 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-37:
Times 2!
To think he was just a no name at the start of the season. One of the best things that could have happened to Oz rugby appears the sacking and hiring of Link from the Tahs to the Reds. Cooper is another who is a totally different player than last year.
30 Jul 2010, 08:00 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-38:
I know, the injury bit I can understand, the Brown bit is a bit scary
30 Jul 2010, 08:00 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-35: Scott Higginbotham is a phenomenal loose forward….to be completely honest he is what Spies SHOULD be…he can come up with the flash plays to outsprint backs but he also gets involved in the dirty work. I’ll never forget him outsprinting Olivier over 50m to gather the ball for a try
30 Jul 2010, 08:03 am
@flanka(flanka)-41:
He puts in the hard yards if and when required, just like you would expect and unlike the super human speciment…
30 Jul 2010, 08:14 am
The most boring thread on keo to date.
30 Jul 2010, 08:17 am
Longterm I would like to see Higginbotham converted to a number 8, as it is the backrow spot lacking real depth in Australia.
After Palu, who is prone to regular form drops as is, there is a lack of a Test class no8.
Brown is sound without being spectacular, while Hoiles really needs to be about 10kg bigger to be effective at Test level.
After Elsom we have Mumm, Mitch Chapman and Hodgson, who I all believe are capable of playing 6 at Test level.
Higginbotham has all the attributes and attitude to be a number 8 in the Kefu mould.
30 Jul 2010, 08:25 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-44:
Was he not originally selected as a #8 for the Reds? With the early injuries there was a reshuffle…
30 Jul 2010, 08:30 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-45: You may be right. I just remember that for most of the season Leroy Houston was at number 8 over him, which annoyed me.
30 Jul 2010, 08:34 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-46:
I am sure Link swapped them but to long ago to remember…
Right, beer o’clock, I am off. Enjoy the weekend and the rugby and catch all on the rebound…
30 Jul 2010, 08:38 am
All Blacks by 15
30 Jul 2010, 08:58 am
will be a bit bloody funny if the ozzies win both their home tests against the kiwis.
they’ve lost 7 on the bounce against them, eventually they are going to win 1.
ozzies by 5?
30 Jul 2010, 09:34 am
Will be a good game,first Bledisloe Cup game of the year plus Aus with home advantage.
Will be harder for Ab’s than everyone thinks.If Pocock & Brown can compete on the ground with a fair amount of success it will limit AB effectiveness as they depend largely on quick ball.If they get it-THEY WILL DESTROY AUS.
With the return of Robinson & Moore upfront,will add much needed stability.
Barnes at 12 will be crucial,he is one of the best tactical kickers in the game.will need to kick accurately though.
It will be close.
BUT
Dont see the Ab’s losing this one,their pack is humming,loose trio operating at optimum.And while halfbacks have been ok,Smith/Nonu have been outstanding.But the real man of the series with Boks (along with McCaw),is Mils Muliaina-back at his irrepressible best.Kick aimlessly-you will be punished.
(if game opens up,it would be nice to see Vito & Dagg in for 20/30 min…that’ll be fireworks!!)
AB’s by 5
30 Jul 2010, 09:38 am
@DonutDunning(DonutDunning)-46:
Leeroy Houston seems to be highly rated in OZ,went on tour with Wallabies a few yrs back as a 19 yr old.
I believe he has the tangibles to become a Kefu type 8 as well but it’ll never come to fruition due mainly to his conditioning.Which is pathethic.Period.
30 Jul 2010, 09:41 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-13: Very genorous of you giving the margins you have. I think the Ab’s will be looking at between 19-24 points over the Wallabies.
You have to take into account they played a team (Boks) that had just had the snot belted out them for two weeks running and then they let in two try’s as well. I think the margins will be quite even going to the sheds at the break but the AB’s will put on the surgeons gloves and take them apart piece by piece in the last thirty. I think they may even give the Wallabies bigger shock than the Boks.
Looking at guys like O’conner, they will hammer the like of him and wear out the tough guys with their relentless style of play and as the Wallabys are not a team that really all stand up and are counted the onslaught will be too much for a few to handle.
AB’s 35+ Wallabies 15-
30 Jul 2010, 09:41 am
I think those that say O’Conner and Barnes can’t tackle are a bit misguided, I saw him drop Big Vic and Guthro, plus a few big Figians this year. He has very good technique IMO
Barnes had a tackle count of 24 on one super 14 game. That’s huge. I rate him as one of the best defensive backs around.
Before the Bok game I also wanted Higgenbottom in place of Brown, bur Brown had a big game and you cant drop him off the back of his best game. Stanaforth too is up there, a real blue collar player.
Amazing, a depth argument/discussion on a wallaby thread…Good signs for the future?
Last year was supposed to be the best tri-nations….I recon this is going to go down to the last few matches…here’s hoping
30 Jul 2010, 09:45 am
@muffy(muffy)-53: yep i saw that! He dropped guthro big time, got him around the legs and floored him. Good technique as you said!
30 Jul 2010, 09:46 am
@HongKongSlong(HongKongSlong)-32: You spot on and the test season has shown that the new laws will have little effect on someone like Brussow’s contribution.
Yip with Brussow and Stegman out, we have very little options to be honest. Quite scary but not surprising since the coaches in SA are clueless when it comes to balance in a lose trio
30 Jul 2010, 09:47 am
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-55: Maybe Derrick Kuhn?
30 Jul 2010, 10:02 am
I enjoy this bloke’s column, no frills or useless bits just the facts.
ADAM FREIER
July 25, 2010
The power of the press and how we are all
at the mercy of the public and, in some
cases, our peers has been evident during
the week. Jason Akermanis is a special
athlete and, by all reports, a unique
individual
.
I don’t know Jason personally, but what I
can take from his sacking is that he is a man
who lives and dies by the sword – his
opinion.
Brendan Cannon’s comments towards Peter
de Villiers, although harmless, sent
shockwaves through the Springboks camp,
and generated enough noise to provoke an
apology. That’s the beauty and harsh nature
of the media.
But expressing an opinion on a player is the
most delicate matter of all. It’s a challenge
that all coaches face. How do I get the best
out of that player without hurting them or
the team? Using the press can be difficult,
some have mastered it, while others don’t
have to, which is an art in itself.
Robbie Deans and Graham Henry are among
the very few that don’t. These coaches are
very much on similar parallels in ensuring
their message is clear and precise, while
protecting their greatest assets and still
getting the best out of them.
If you watch either of them being
interviewed, they are professionals at
making sure they don’t put their foot in it.
One misinterpretation can create a
completely different presentation. As we
have seen with other coaches (should I say
de Villiers?), imagine the devastation that
would follow if Deans or Henry put their
stars on notice at a press conference. It
would be a media frenzy and it would take
weeks for the team to get back on course.
They don’t single out any particular players,
their efforts or form with words, but
introduce a little thing called ”healthy
competition”.
Henry started about 12 months ago with
some of his All Blacks. Mils Muliaina has seen
the emergence of plenty of stars all capable
of wearing the All Blacks’ No.15 jumper like
Cory Jane and Israel Dagg.
What this has done is create a healthy
nursery for a player to be the best they can
possibly be. The result? Mils has stripped
back a few kilograms and produced some
devastating rugby at the end of a white-hot
All Blacks back line.
The same with Tony Woodcock, who has
been New Zealand’s loosehead prop for
many years. But this year Henry did not
guarantee him a spot in the starting XV, or
even the 22 following the arrival of the
Franks brothers at the beginning of New
Zealand’s international season. Woodcock
has had to work hard to get back into the
run-on side and looks leaner and meaner.
Piri Weepu falls into the same category.
Although he started against the Springboks
through the injury to Jimmy Cowan, he still
had to work extremely hard to bypass
players such as the Blues’ Alby Mathewson
and the Crusaders’ Andy Ellis. Would Weepu
have been the player he was against South
Africa if he was daylight in front of all No.9s
in New Zealand?
So let’s apply this method to our Wallabies
stars. Nathan Sharpe’s international career
appeared over in 2009 with Deans’s
selection of James Horwill and Dean Mumm
as Wallabies locks. The result: Sharpe played
out of his skin for the Western Force in
2010 and is playing the best rugby of his
?career, at the age of 32.
Anthony Faingaa could turn Matt Giteau into
the player he never thought he could be,
too. Would he improve if the coach or some
Wallabies legends in the media put him on
notice through the press? Maybe. But most
probably not.
Then the most talked-about comeback of all,
Drew Mitchell. Getting left out of the
Wallabies squad and returning through
injury, Mitchell worked overtime on his
game.
Would Mitchell have pushed himself if
he was granted a walk-up start?
There is no question my best season was
when Tatafu Polota-Nau joined the
Waratahs.
Let’s hope Deans can continue to find ways
of pushing the Wallabies without
‘Akermanising’ himself in the press.
Two coaches, two nations. Same nationality,
same applications in achieving the best
from their men.
Who has the better timing? This will be on
show in Melbourne on Saturday night. Bring
on the Bledisloe.
30 Jul 2010, 10:02 am
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-55: Brussow would be huge this year, low to the ground, fast, strong and ball hungry, not interested in the man (read Schalk), will be the first pick in my bok team when fit again
30 Jul 2010, 10:10 am
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-55: They made a good point on Reunion last night, why pick 2 ball carriers at 7 & 8 if you aren’t gonna carry the ball?
You’re spot on there….can’t wait to see Ratel back in the picture!!!
Has anyone ever seen Spies actually lying on the ground?
30 Jul 2010, 10:12 am
@muffy(muffy)-58: Yea he might not be as big as Pocock but he’s easily as strong
Schalk’s history in my book too. Was disgusted with the way he clawed at Pocock’s face…..even before he slammed him, he was clawing at the side of his head…what is he, a frikkin schoolgirl???????
30 Jul 2010, 10:13 am
@muffy(muffy)-53: How did Higginbotham not make the squad?
30 Jul 2010, 10:14 am
@Atreides(Atreides)-59:why should he? Spies stops runaway trucks my man!
30 Jul 2010, 10:16 am
@Atreides(Atreides)-61: higgins (meisiekind killer) was injured @ the end of s14 don’t know if he’s fine….
30 Jul 2010, 10:17 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-62: Lol…I’m not buying into all the Spies bashing so much, but he definitely needs to up his work-rate and get a bit more aggressive
30 Jul 2010, 10:22 am
if higgins killedWO, imagine what we would do to de jongh … we all know how WO killed JDJ in the Super final
30 Jul 2010, 10:30 am
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-65: um, de jongh would never be left behind by higginbotham in a sprint race, never hahahahaha
30 Jul 2010, 10:45 am
nee, hy ken al weghardloop van die polisie in mitchelsplain
30 Jul 2010, 10:47 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-52:
Be careful with predictions like that, Poppa will be calling you an arrogant p**ck and slating your family & history – or does arrogance only apply to Saffa’s when they back their team?
I think the All Blacks will win this but not by 20 points – I reckon around 7-10 points for this game. The Aussies will have a bit of confidence from last week despite how bad the Boks were so will give it plenty. Once you get them back to NZ then you can start talking about winning by 20+
30 Jul 2010, 11:00 am
@muffy(muffy)-58: Agreed. Like I’ve said before, the first 2 players in your side should be a reliable goalkicker (M Steyn) and a genuine fetcher (Brussow). Since Fdp is the best player on the planet he can be included with the above 2 names IMHO.
@Atreides(Atreides)-59:
Haha. You mean why pick 3 ball carriers if you not going to carry the ball. Spies is the most overrated player in SA with Brussow the most underrated
30 Jul 2010, 11:02 am
@Rugby-1(Rugby-1)-68: Yea the AB’s are not going to stand back and let them hold onto the ball the way the Boks did….104 breakdowns and they retained possession 103 times? That’s a bit of an indictment on our loosies!!!
30 Jul 2010, 11:10 am
@Atreides(Atreides)-70:
Yes I agree, we were **** & going into a test match with no recognised fetcher was a seriosu step backwards. Have to wonder what the coaching staff do all week, that was a schoolboy error
I just think the Aussies will be playing out their boots this weekend, and they do have a bit of confidence now. They will defend a lot better than we did and make it tough for the All Blacks. I still fancy the AB’s to win (they are a much better team), but talk of 20+ points is pretty arrogant considering the abuse these boys have been throwing at Saffa supporters for the very same thing!
30 Jul 2010, 11:12 am
@Atreides(Atreides)-70: Could you send that info to the coaches. I dont think they getting why we couldnt defend or get momentum going.
I dont think it would help anyway because for some reason Pdv is thinking like Jake White re a fetcher.
30 Jul 2010, 11:16 am
I see all the antipodean apologists and armchair Bok naysayers have colonised Keo…
30 Jul 2010, 11:17 am
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-67: hy is nie van mitchellsplain nie doos
30 Jul 2010, 11:20 am
@Heavens Game(Heavens Game)-73: nee fok, hier kom kak!
30 Jul 2010, 11:21 am
I fancy the Aussies for a win this weekend.
Not only do they have a good chance on home turf they are better sports on the paddock.
Go Aus!
30 Jul 2010, 11:23 am
@Heavens Game(Heavens Game)-76: There will also be no sheepshagger partiality from evil leprechaun refs in the back pocket. Quite plainly John O’Neill woul not countenance any of Paddy OBriens shenanigans. full stop.
30 Jul 2010, 11:28 am
transform .. nee, wie het gese hy doen, hy doen net sy drugs en crime daar
30 Jul 2010, 11:33 am
So now PdeV doesn’t appreciate a fetcher after selecting Ratel? The main reason he went with Flo for the tour was that Flo and Schalk were highly effective as a combo in the S14, especially at working the new law interpretations.
What happened in NZ was that the ABs had worked out a way to nullify their tactic and prevent Flo from getting to the ball. He wasn’t helped by the refs interpretations either. The point is that the SA coaches didn’t have another fetcher option available and in order to combat the Aussies tried a different tactic with what was available.
30 Jul 2010, 11:45 am
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-78: hehehe jy praat net klomp kak
jdj is ‘n moerse gooie speler en jy weet 
30 Jul 2010, 11:47 am
@David(David)-79: If you recall Brussow was only brought in after Schalk was suspended (A suspension which won us the series in my opinion) and not at the start of the season like he should have been.
Fair enough regarding your comment on Schalk and Flo but after the first test with Bakkies sent home, the first thing Pdv should have done was send a genuine fetcher like Stegman over to balance the loose trio?
30 Jul 2010, 11:47 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-75: What kak! I am pinpointing AB preciousness way before it starts pi.ssing the rest of Bok supporters.
I know how AB supporters think: Contrary to all this facade about “rivalry” and “respect” the sheepshaggers don’t respect Bok rugby and they have more of a rivalry with the Wallabies (Bledisloe cup). We are the poor cousins in 3N from their POV. Plainly.
Memories of all their bullshyte have been blurre by recent success of the Boks. Time to start remembering…
30 Jul 2010, 11:49 am
@David(David)-79:
Well why go with 1 fetcher and how many centres? The squad selection was poor, we should have had options with the depth we have but we didn’t and ended up playing a tactic against the Aussies that 90% of fans and commentators knew was wrong – but hey apparently that’s okay because had to make do with what we had. How unprofessional
30 Jul 2010, 11:50 am
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-78: So. You are from PE. Where in PE are you? Forrest Hill Shebeen?
30 Jul 2010, 11:54 am
At least we know the breakdown calls will be reasonable with Craig Joubert at the whistle. Certainly better than some of the NH rookies we’ve had to deal with.
30 Jul 2010, 12:00 pm
@David(David)-79: it worked in ’08 at ellis park when div played burger, spies & smith against waugh, elsom & palu (waugh was replaced by george smith) 53 – 8
30 Jul 2010, 12:02 pm
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-81: schalk didn’t play the 1st match because of a calf injury…
30 Jul 2010, 12:06 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-85: craig joubert watched boots ‘n all, he knows he must nail mcCaw or Keo will slate him in business day come monday!
30 Jul 2010, 12:06 pm
@rossoneri(rossoneri)-84:
Just ignore the twat.
30 Jul 2010, 12:09 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-87: Then how did he manage to gauge the guys eye??
30 Jul 2010, 12:10 pm
one day to go boys and girls, The kiwi’s have a spring in their step and are confident, that’s good to see. The wallabies have been given a hammering in the press for not going on the job so expect 80 mins of high octane play. I feel that the Wallabies are a lot more settled this year, good scrum, good line out, Genia is majic, Burgess was **** last year and I think really cost us. This game will depend on the who wins the breakdown and if the S14 is any judge Jourbet will be hard on teams who deliberatly kill the ball. If McCaw gets 10 mins cooling off then its really game on because he won’t push it again. They can do it but they need to turn up, I just have a feeling they will. Can’t predict the score
30 Jul 2010, 12:10 pm
Dis Naweek !!!! kom ons fo%&&^n duik
30 Jul 2010, 12:10 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-85: Even Craig Joubert is better than some of the oirish excuses for leprechaun refs that have been on show in tokoloshe land…
30 Jul 2010, 12:14 pm
@Bok fan(Bok fan)-90: only @ loftus, 1st Test was in Durban
30 Jul 2010, 12:17 pm
I love the smell of whining in the morning.
30 Jul 2010, 12:26 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-88:
Haha
Many have felt the wrath of the Keo’s business day column!
30 Jul 2010, 12:27 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-96: Business day is definitely not the Economist…
30 Jul 2010, 12:34 pm
Keo….if you write such rubbish in your weekly newsletter please take me off your mailing list.
You are becoming as soft and accomodating as the average saffa brainless moronic, candy floss, feeble minded, limp wristed mommas boys.
If Plod is not good enough, then he in not good enough. Giving caps away for ‘the occassion ‘ is sick and weak.
You can continue with the ‘Fat Boys Club’, together with the slapgat back slappers.
Its WP nd Vasco Da Gama Football Club for me.
I wont be hoodwinked or sugar coated into believing or buying into the rabble currently parading as the national team….
Klaar.
30 Jul 2010, 12:38 pm
801. grant10 :
November 15th, 2009 at 8:08 am
#792 Real Deal: Korean vet man….screw you wally….you reckon its okay for a Bok captain to denigrate a fellow Bok in a book it shows up your lack of moral fibre….actually expected a bit more from a traditionalist like you….seems you okay with this as long as Smit is climbing into Luke.
Hypocrite….go back to Korea….The new SA dont need your kind here.
so thats my grant doesn’t like JS … its all about the cancer puke
30 Jul 2010, 12:43 pm
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-99: yes….partly true.
Fact that he is out of shape and playing the poorest rugby i have ever seen from him certainly adds to my hoping Plod retires.
30 Jul 2010, 12:43 pm
@grant10(grant10)-98: I thank the creator everyday that Puke is as far away from the Bok setup as possible…
Puke in Bath forever!!!, Please!!!
The Boks will then be safe…
Also, a request for you to take tricky dicky on one of your regular dolphin watching/dancing forays where hopely he mistakes a great white as one…
The Boks and Captain Barney, your Captain, will be as safe as possible and back to high performance…
30 Jul 2010, 12:44 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-86:
Yeah, it did, although I think the combo against the Aussies last week was the wrong one, given the choices available. If they wanted to change I’d have played Pottie somewhere and dropped one of the other three. Sometimes coaches get it wrong and the opposing coach gets it right. I remember the ABs last year playing Kaino at 8 and Rodney at 7, when they’d played in the opposite positions the year before. Isaac Ross was also a mistake.
30 Jul 2010, 12:48 pm
grant, i agree js is p!ss poor ..always has been, but just 1 question, wasn’t Teichmann also off form when he was dropped? And aterwards everyone called “rape”
30 Jul 2010, 12:49 pm
@Heavens Game(Heavens Game)-101: well i am thrilled that you are happy and content with Plod….
You may rue your shortsighted acceptance and accomodation of the Michelin Man come 2011 when we head home in the quarter finals…..
But what can i say….strangest thing is i never saw you as being so forgiving of such mediocrity.
30 Jul 2010, 12:50 pm
@quotas_sux(quota_conrad_jantjies_is_jorrie_muller)-99: No – have to disagree, its all about grant the liberator of the “New SA”…
30 Jul 2010, 12:52 pm
@grant10(grant10)-104: Barney is not mediocre… Answer me this: Have the scrums and lineouts been a problem in the last few tests?
30 Jul 2010, 13:01 pm
With most of the bloggers here concentrating on their perfect WC squad, has anyone bothered to look at the current problems we face for the next 3 matches?
Victor is out on his feet with Bekker out for the year and Hargreaves (the apparent next in line 5) injured.
Bakkies out and Danie running on empty with only a green, young 4 in reserve.
Ratel and Steggies out.
Smith still needing a couple of games to get back to test fitness.
I think this shows that we need to keep blooding new players as if this happens prior to the WC we’re in serious trouble.
30 Jul 2010, 13:07 pm
@Heavens Game(Heavens Game)-106: scrums were the only stable aspect of Boks play. Perhaps Plod had a role there ….although i do feel it was the fact we played with actual tightheads as opposed to a bloated hooker masquerading as the anchor of the bok scrum.
Plod missed some crucial lineouts, the 1 which resulted in a Aussie try just before half time that buried Boks.
And for goodness sake, the lineouts should always be virtually 100 % with that aspect being a bok strength.
Plod was dismal, not hitting rucks, not makin tackles and generally being miles off the pace compared to the kiwi and aussie hookers.
Sorry HG….you can spin this all day long….you know it…i know it….Plod is the on the Nowhereville Road that leads to Palookaville.
30 Jul 2010, 13:08 pm
Regardless of anyones opinions over John Smit, it’s really hard to take anyone who cries out for Luke Watson to come back into the Bok squad seriously!
David – yep we have some serious problems with injuries and fatigue right now, be interesting to see who is available for the test at Soccer City. Time to blood some young form players
30 Jul 2010, 13:08 pm
@David(David)-107: I look forward to Juandre Kruger performance tomorrow….he may be the man to back up Matfield once he finds his feet here.
30 Jul 2010, 13:09 pm
@Heavens Game(Heavens Game)-106: the lineouts were sh*t Barney himself conceded! What games were you watching France?
30 Jul 2010, 13:10 pm
LW would be far better than Spies on current form….thats for damn sure.
Even JW says he would have LW as his captain…..how bloody ironic.
30 Jul 2010, 13:11 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-111:
ja
1 st test we lost 4 balls…in 1 st half!!
30 Jul 2010, 13:11 pm
@grant10(grant10)-98: There is an ‘unsubscribe’ option at the end of the newsletter.
That might be easier
30 Jul 2010, 13:13 pm
@RedMan(RedMan)-114: thanks…
missed it
30 Jul 2010, 13:15 pm
@grant10(grant10)-112:
Jake White would say anyting right now to get the Bok coach position so I would take that with a bucket of salt.
And no I think Luke would battle to make the top 10 loosies in SA. I do agree with your comments on Juandre Kruger, seriosu potential there and may get a look in for the Boks sooner than later. See you’re finally talking sense
30 Jul 2010, 13:20 pm
“the Wallabies landed a blow that sent the Springboks down to the Tri-Nations canvas. They were rougher, tougher and ultimately smarter”….. ja right, you try playing with a blind ref and for 20 minutes with only 14 men.
30 Jul 2010, 13:21 pm
@grant10(grant10)-112: stop being a bum licker man, now you really talking sh.i.t.
30 Jul 2010, 13:21 pm
Step right up, step right up place your bets…..
3-1 on Richie getting the first card, 2-1 on Pocock.
Don’t miss out.
30 Jul 2010, 13:29 pm
@Flametop(Flametop)-119: richie a yellow card…haha, do think any ref would dare give richie a yellow card?
30 Jul 2010, 13:33 pm
Asked which trophy was more important, he (McCaw) didn’t have much hesitation in saying:
“I think the Bledisloe probably edges ahead but if you get the Bledisloe there’s a fair chance you have the other one (3N) as well.
30 Jul 2010, 13:33 pm
I’m beginning to wonder how much the B&IL tour has interfered with PdeVs WC planning. A lot of the senior 2007 WC players stayed on for it and then decided to continue for the next WC. In some ways I reckon it would have been easier for PdeV if he’d started to build a new squad and implement his own style and game game plan when he first took over. To some extent his tenure has been a bit of a compromise between the JW approach favoured by his senior players and his own concept of what he wants.
30 Jul 2010, 13:39 pm
@David(David)-122: he had no time to faff around when the lions came calling he had to win! So he abandoned his running rugby philosophy @ the alter or history & results! Imagine being known as the coach that lost 3 – zip to the lions playing ur prefered style of rugby
30 Jul 2010, 13:39 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-121:
And if you beat France….ah wait…
30 Jul 2010, 13:41 pm
@foreverrugga(foreverrugga)-120:
Most refs probably don’t know Richie is even playing, let alone card him.
Pocock is the new apprentice
30 Jul 2010, 13:41 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-123:
I agree, which is why I said that that tour probably interfered. He was on a hiding to nothing.
30 Jul 2010, 13:48 pm
@David(David)-122: You blaming the LIONS now for Div?
WTF?
30 Jul 2010, 13:55 pm
@David(David)-122: Very true. But then again – if you had all these world beaters at your disposal, wouldn’t you be tempted to squeeze the last bit of international rugby out of them?
Especially when a significant majority of them would still be under 30 at the next WC?
Of course, the buzz word here is “management”.
One should look at practical examples of good and poor player management in sporting codes to see our current dilemma in perspective and to look for solutions.
The dynastic Australian cricket team of the 2000s held onto their resources in similar fashion, and experienced major if temporary setbacks with the piecemeal retirement of traditional stalwarts.
Of course, comparing cricket resources to its sister sport rugby is like comparing apples with pears, as players have a greater longeivity in the game where leather challenges willow.
But there are some lessons to be learned from their strategies, particularly in identifying a core group of players out of these world beaters to form the foundation of a future challenge. They managed to succeed in strategic planning with limited resources, while the English WC winning team in 2003 failed to make their labour push the frontier further out.
We have identified Smit, Matfield and FDP in 2007 to form the backbone of a WC defense leadership in 2011. We also assumed that most of the rest of the team would be available in 2011.
In hindsight, were those the right choices? Or rather, were those the realistic choices? And more importantly, were we complacent in our medium- to long-term planning to ensure their availability?
We are now struggling with the issue of fatigue, more than we ever thought we would. I guess that we have identified the core group of players correctly, but lack the strategic acumen in managing them. We are not engaging on the Australian cricket trajectory, but on a stagnating English rugby one.
The means we are applying to achieve the end goal of a back-to-back WC triumph is suspect, and reminds me of the trajectory of the English WC winning team.
I will conclude by reminding you that PDV was under more pressure than JW to also improve on the win % ratio instead of focusing merely on WC triumph. This obviously had implications for his team selection(s).
30 Jul 2010, 13:55 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-127:
What do you mean, “blame the Lions tour for Div”?
What I was getting at is that because of the importance of winning that tour it may have curtailed his long term plans.
30 Jul 2010, 14:03 pm
@willievz(willievz)-128:
That’s basically what I was getting at.
There was also another factor, though, and that was PdeVs idea of approach and the resistance by the senior players which would take time to change, something he didn’t have the luxury of with the B&IL tour coming so soon. Generally change is evolutionary if managed intelligently, but this wasn’t possible in time for the Lions, as his first season showed.
30 Jul 2010, 14:03 pm
@willievz(willievz)-128: re this whole ‘management’ issue i blame pdv when it comes to last year’s eoyt, Plod, fdp & matfield had no business going on that tour whatsoever! Especially when pdv himself was saying the players are tired – even mentally – but still HE succumbed to their demand that they want to cap a very successful year by beating their hoodoo teams france & ireland, we all know how that turned out!
Imagine if the nucleus of the team that played against wales this year – without the stupid selections of raubenheimer and the rest – had all those games last year to test their mettle in europe!
Lost opportunity!
30 Jul 2010, 14:04 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-121:
So if Reechie says to you to “Jump off a cliff”, will you respond like a lemming.
30 Jul 2010, 14:12 pm
Has PdV called up Frans Steyn yet?!!!!
Arse-wipe
30 Jul 2010, 14:15 pm
@David(David)-130: For sure.
So this is how I (and I am sure you too) see it:
A Sanzar team playing the Lions in between WCs would really only have two years to build for a WC, commencing only after a Lions tour, because it will take two years after a WC to prepare for the Lions.
Whereas other teams can build for a WC in a 4-year time window.
30 Jul 2010, 14:16 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-131: That EOYT was a lost opportunity. They merely selected a bunch of individual players without thinking about combinations.
30 Jul 2010, 14:17 pm
@David(David)-122:
That’s what’s so tragic about all of this. He compromised on his own vision to please others and now it’s come back to bite him in the ***, and all those people he tried to appease though compromise have got the knives out.
30 Jul 2010, 14:25 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-136:
That’s the difference with a manager like Sir Alec Fergusen. No player is more important than the team. He’s the boss. PdeV was considered as almost a caretaker of an existing squad.
30 Jul 2010, 14:27 pm
@David(David)-130: See here is where I think Div out-thought himself.
On one side he decided to recall Smit to enable him to manage a team that perhaps was not going to buy in to his ideas at all.
Smit wanted to return so it seemed to work out fine.
The flipside is: Smit has a sell-by date and we Div hasn’t identified a new Captian in his place (Chiliboy is not senior enough to be Captain).
And it seems Smit, just like the rest of the seniors, wants to play their own game.
Div has dug himself a large hole, one which you can’t blame on other people. He had an opportunity to sweep it clean, instead he relied on structures already in place.
I agree he couldn’t win BUT he took the job. I would have left Smit in France.
30 Jul 2010, 14:32 pm
@Yetirat(Yetirat)-136: and jake is conviniently musing out loud in the media “i can’t help but wonder how far the team would’ve progressed if i like graham hery was allowed to carry on”
30 Jul 2010, 14:37 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-138: leave Plod in France when apparently 80% of the players wanted Heineken Meyer as the coach? fdp was ready to bounce – he said it himself -, vic was @ Toulon, Bakkies wa itching to follow suit. SA Media would’ve eaten pdv alive. Rock & a hard place
30 Jul 2010, 14:46 pm
@David(David)-107:
IMO best team for next 3 games
-3 week rest will help the likes of Matfield recharge
-Rossouw has never played a full season bar this yr,dont think he is running on empty.Missed most of first game in 3N as well,plus shared time with Flip in S14.
My team for next 3 games
1.Guthro
2.Smit(c)
3.BJ
4.Rossouw
5.Matfield
6.Burger
7.Smith
8.Potgieter
9.Pienaar
10.Steyn
11.Habana
12.De Villiers
13.De Jongh
14.JPP
15.Aplon
16.Bismark
17.Beast
18.Flip
19.Spies/Louw
20.Hougaard
21.Butch
22.Basson/Kirchner
30 Jul 2010, 14:52 pm
I think we should blood the youngsters in the next 3 games. We have nothing left to loose.
IMO BJ and CJ have not been the saviours the hype boys have made them out to be. Using the current squad I would pick the following guys to rest key players and shake things up:
1. Guthro
2. Chilli
3. Smit (He is still carrying the weight he put on as a prop and would have played here if Bismarck was fit anyway)
4. Russouw
5. Vd Merwe (Bekker injured and we might need more bulk at the rucks also gives Matfield a rest)
6. FLouw/Potgieter
7. Smith
8. Burger
9. Hougaard
10. Pienaar/James
11. Habana
12. JdV
13. JdJ
14. Aplon
15. Kirchner
30 Jul 2010, 14:52 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-141: How on earth can you justify Plods inclusion.
It defies belief!
30 Jul 2010, 14:53 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-140: Well kinda tells you they chose the wrong guy then.
If fingers are to be pointed, point them at the politicians.
Div may be a bunch of things, and I don’t particularly think he is the man for the job BUT
I have to acknowledge the guy was hung out to dry.
Firstly the appoint him, then they leave him to make a fool of himself. I have a feeling that the guys were so cross at having to appoint BEE that they did and then left him to it. Basically without any help it’s a big set of shoes to fill and his mouth seems to run on auto. No guidance, no PR secretary, no help.
Basically seemed like a big f-you to everyone from SARU.
Not sure I would have acted differently though.
The appointment of DIV was the beginning of the end though, bu bringing back a few guys he managed to keep it going for 2 years and good on him, but it’s over.
Call them the Proteas and be done with it.
30 Jul 2010, 14:54 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-139:
“Allowed to carry on”.
As I recall, he’s the one who didn’t re-apply for the position once his contract expired…
30 Jul 2010, 14:54 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-142: oh my word…..
The inmates are running the asylum!
Smit at 3?
After he admitted to being scared for his own safety?
Even i, who dont like the oke, would not subject him to that punishment!
30 Jul 2010, 14:55 pm
Rugby | Springboks
Peter de Villiers © Gallo Images
I am in charge – Div
——————————————————————————–
by Brenden Nel 30/07/2010, 08:56
Springbok coach Peter de Villiers has come out strongly to tell the country that he — and nobody else — is the coach of the national team.
After several articles which suggest that De Villiers was not in control of the World Champions but it was either run by senior players, or by the assistant coaches, the Bok mentor moved swiftly to dispel any doubts about who is in charge.
De Villiers faced up to fans questions in SA Rugby’s Bokzine — the email newsletter for Springbok fans — and was forthright when asked who is in charge of the team.
“I’ve heard this so many times — and not just in New Zealand — that it’s obvious that those with fixed opinions won’t change their minds whatever I say,” De Villiers wrote.
“I am the coach but I do listen to players who have played in close to 100 tests and won every trophy there is to win in rugby. It has brought us success and I don’t recall this being a criticism last year. I am not threatened by this talk — after all, I went to France to fetch John (Smit) back.
When confronted by the question of bringing in young talent and the suggestion that some of the senior players have past their prime, the Bok coach pointed out that experience was a telling factor when it came to the World Cup.
“One of the key questions that we spend a long time debating in selection and this year you’ve seen that we have brought through young players like Francois Louw, Juan de Jongh, Flip van der Merwe and others,” De Villiers explained.
“But the history of World Cups is that they’re won by experience — the Bok and England teams that won the last two were the most experienced in either teams’ rugby history! All but three of Jake’s team won in 2007 had made their debuts at or before the previous World Cup, so experience can’t be a bad thing.”
De Villiers added that utility back Frans Steyn’s cannon boot was very much still in the Bok plans, but suggested his commitments to his French club Racing Metro were hindering him from playing for the national team.
“In answer, Frans is very much still in our thinking and we would like him in the team — we just have to balance the demands of club and country so that he can perform his best for the Springboks,” De Villiers said.
30 Jul 2010, 14:56 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-144:
Booked your plane ticket for Australia yet, then?
30 Jul 2010, 14:58 pm
@grant10(grant10)-146: Who else to play at 3 has BJ or CJ done anything of significance since being back in the fold?
IMO Smit would have played @ 3 this season was it not for Bismarck’s injury. I for one feel sorry for him, he is asked to bulk up to play prop and is now hammered in the media for being off the pace as a hooker.
30 Jul 2010, 15:00 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-57: wow,…that’s some really great insights there…you should become a journo yourself…!
30 Jul 2010, 15:00 pm
Kan iemand hier vir my se of die Bulle
al ooit teen die All Blacks gespeel het
op Loftes, en wat was die score???
30 Jul 2010, 15:00 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-144: This coach has however raised the bar. Gone are the days where we go to NZ and are content with losing by a couple of points.
We have lost at home to 2 of the strongest teams in World rugby and now everyone wants his head. I don’t think PdV has been hung out to dry as much as him being measured against a different set of expectations.
30 Jul 2010, 15:02 pm
@Diontnz(Diontnz)-150: @Diontnz(Diontnz)-150: oh adam freir wrote it…oops
30 Jul 2010, 15:03 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-148: I don’t want to go to Australia but I also want to tell the truth.
I’m not putting my head in the sand like the rest of you muppets in case someone calls me a racist, or defeatist, or traitor.
Ignoring it won’t make it any better.
30 Jul 2010, 15:03 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-152:
JJ Harmse of all people wrote a brilliant piece in which he compared Jake White and Peter de Villiers at similar times in their coaching careers.
2006 was a watershed year for White; will the same hold true for de Villiers?
30 Jul 2010, 15:03 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-154:
Fair enough.
30 Jul 2010, 15:04 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-152: Dude I don;t like Div and don’t think he should have the job. Neither should Muir or Gold or Smit.
Div is arrogant like all people in jobs for which they are not qualified.
30 Jul 2010, 15:05 pm
Kan iemand hier vir my se of die Bulle
al ooit teen die All Blacks gespeel het
op Loftes, en wat was die score???
30 Jul 2010, 15:05 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-156:
30 Jul 2010, 15:08 pm
@IOU(IOU)-158:
Dink nie so nie – ek kan net dink aan die NZ Cavaliers wat Noord-Transvaal op Loftus gespeel het in 1986, die Cavaliers het 10-9 gewen.
30 Jul 2010, 15:09 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-160:
Mind you, the Cavaliers side that toured in 1986 was basically an All Black team – I think 28 of the 30 who toured with the Cavaliers were All Blacks before that.
30 Jul 2010, 15:09 pm
@IOU(IOU)-158: Sorry kan nie help nie. Maar dit sal seker voor die isolasie periode gewees het.
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-157: Whether you like an individual or not does not determine the standards against which the person should be judged.
I have never heard of a coaches head being called for due to losing against 2 of the worlds best sides in there own back yards. Until 2 years ago the idea of beating the All Blacks in New Zealand was a pipe dream, now we have done it 2 years in a row, hence the bar being set higher than ever before.
We have been outthought by AB’s and Aus this year after we did it to them last year. They have raised the bar and it is up to us to repsond.
30 Jul 2010, 15:09 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-160:
Baie dankie vir die reply!
30 Jul 2010, 15:11 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-160:
En ja, daai was die wedstryd wat daai lae skurk Burger Geldenhuys vir Andy Dalton se kakebaan afgeslaan het.
30 Jul 2010, 15:13 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-162: Our coach is a muppet, like him or not.
Dude you can’t seriously consider Div as the best man for the job. His selections in the positions of Assistant Coaches should be enough to show you he doesn’t have either the intelligence to hire the right guys, or he is too arrogant to surround himself with clever people.
Either answer is not good enough. Do you think Branson or Trump are brain surgeons? No they are not but they hire brain surgeons on their teams.
30 Jul 2010, 15:16 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-161: I remember that tour as I was in NZ at the time.
The anti-apartheid activists wanted to kill us ‘Seth Effrican’s’ who lived there. They also wanted to kill the Cavaliers.
It was sad. Rugby vs non-rugby in the same house.
30 Jul 2010, 15:16 pm
If Aussies take this one, then it will give the Boks something to play for in the home leg other than just pride. Go the Wobblies!
30 Jul 2010, 15:18 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-166:
Yes, there were rumours about payments under the table to the All Black players to go on tour.
I think none of them were selected for the All Blacks for a few Tests after they returned, as a form of punishment.
30 Jul 2010, 15:22 pm
@Diontnz(Diontnz)-150: as it says at the top, adam freier wrote it and i’m definitely not aussie!
30 Jul 2010, 15:23 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-168: They were not allowed to play for the Abs after that.
The NZRU have done some dumb things over the years, like banning Stu Wilson and Bernie Fraser for writing a book (Ebony & Ivory) and getting PAID!!
Shock horror (like the Boks were never paid LOL.)
30 Jul 2010, 15:23 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-165: In 2004 when Jake was appointed there were a few eyebrows raised. I think there were some good provincial coaches that were overlooked.
I agree that PdV was not the person with the best provincial record as Meyer was, but he had similar credentials to JW.
You have your opinion and I have mine. Neither of us are going to change our minds on a Friday afternoon. And these things have been debated at lenght by people that know a lot more than we do.
You can’t deny that his results have been up there with the best coaches since re-admission though
30 Jul 2010, 15:25 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-169: Is he not the guy that plays hooker for one of the S14 Aussie franchises. He is very well versed for a hooker.
30 Jul 2010, 15:28 pm
just give snorre a PR MANAGER so they can keep him out of tthe media!
30 Jul 2010, 15:31 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-171: I agree to disagree.
I would just like to see some results that are positive (not even score-wise but in attitude).
I would seriously do away with Smit and Muir though.
Anyway, as you say, we won’t change anything.
30 Jul 2010, 15:34 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-172: um, yeah. If you read the piece he says even he himself got the fire burning up his bum when tatafu polota-nau got to the tahs, competition is good! Which is the opposite here in south africa, john smit knows, he could be as kak as earl rose he will still be picked because of his mythical leadership aura that this springboks team of professional player can’t play without!
Apprently without Smit the bokke become like the u12 of skopskietfontein pre-primary school
30 Jul 2010, 15:35 pm
“Neither Giteau nor Berrick Barnes are known for their abilities to take on the defence……….”
JC………
Do you have a white cane?
and a quide dog?
30 Jul 2010, 15:35 pm
AB’s to win all their games if they stay constant in selection.
30 Jul 2010, 15:35 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-174: ave to agree with you on Muir he does not inspire confidence.
A win would be nice, but I think we should write this year off and brand some youngsters, similar to the 3N prior to the ’07 WC. We have a lot of talent but they are short on experience, we can build at home and on the NH tour this year and have a much larger pool to pick from in 2011.
30 Jul 2010, 15:37 pm
@Panzer Chief(cane)-176: Also saw the comment on Giteau. Not sure what was being smoked when the article was written.
30 Jul 2010, 15:43 pm
agree
team for rest of 3n
1.beast
2.botha/liebenberg
3.kruger
4.flip
5.roussouw/skeate
6.louw
7.potgieter
8.daniels
9.houghaard
10.jl potgieter
11.vd heever
12.jdejong
13.fourie/lambie
14.aplon
15.f steyn
30 Jul 2010, 15:45 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-178: since when didn’t muir inspire confidence? He nearly won the s14 with the sharks the year before he became pdv’s assistant, what was kak about that achievement? If it wasn’t for that drunk steve walsh or that poephol frans steyn the sharks would’ve been champs and relegate heyneke meyer to an also-ran!
30 Jul 2010, 15:47 pm
@Corndog(Corndog)-179:
I see on Keo’s “Poll”………..65% of Keo’s Faithfull think the Wallabies will win by 15 points or more.
30 Jul 2010, 15:50 pm
or a team with nothing to loose to break aussies in half
1.wp nel
2.schalk brits
3.jaco engels
4.bakkies
5.johan muller
6. wicus van heerden
7. baywatch
8. luke watson
9. kocket
10. butch
11. akona
12. de wet barry
13. jp nel
14. meyer bosman
15. jaco vd westhuizen
with an irish ref 7 yellows in 1st half but cooper in hospital hahaha joke….
30 Jul 2010, 15:51 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-168:
$100,000 each Cavalier.
Paid by some SA Newspaper.
Thirty pieces of silver.
30 Jul 2010, 15:54 pm
@Panzer Chief(cane)-184:
That’s a bit more than 30 pieces of silver.
30 Jul 2010, 15:55 pm
@Panzer Chief(cane)-184:
New Zealand Dollars?
30 Jul 2010, 16:05 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-181: Put it this way mate, not many Sharks shed a tear when Muir left.
30 Jul 2010, 16:12 pm
@David(David)-185:
Matthew 27.3
30 Jul 2010, 16:13 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-165: Steady now, we all know muir is good and I can’t say I’m in a position to comment on the rest of his panel, BUT
The real shocker is his team selection.
People, his head is not being called for just because of two games?!
His head is being called for:
- His consistently poor team selections.
- A piss poor end of year tour.
- Being handed the two teams that contested the S14 final and
then some more good international players for good measure
and then delivering a team that can barely seem to wipe it’s own arse in a coherent fashion.
- Oh, and his magnificent displays of intelligence and maturity when corresponding with the media.
Still think this is all just a knee-jerk reaction?!
30 Jul 2010, 16:16 pm
@Johnny7(Johnny7)-189: Muir is rubbish. Don;t think he’s a good coach and as a person he’s not my favourite either, but that’s another isssue.
Div and his selections are awful, from Captain to positional changes to Muir, Gold and the rest in between.
30 Jul 2010, 16:21 pm
@Panzer Chief(cane)-176: Think we should try and raise some money for a guide dog for JC…
30 Jul 2010, 16:24 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-190: Come on, Muir took the Sharks to the S14 final, was only walsh and/or francois steyn kicking out between him and winning the S14.
30 Jul 2010, 16:24 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-186:
yes NZ$.
Probably around US$80,000 at that time.
Enough to purchase, a very, very, nice suburban homes in NZ at the time.
Not bad money for a Railway Worker, like Scott Crichton. Enough to tempt many a battler.
30 Jul 2010, 16:26 pm
@Johnny7(Johnny7)-192: Mate you’re not going to change my mind on Muir. Ever.
Don’t like his coaching style, don’t like him period.
I have zero time for the guy, he has no moral compass.
30 Jul 2010, 16:28 pm
Does anyone else find these pop-up corner ads a pain in the arrssshole!!!!!!
30 Jul 2010, 16:30 pm
@Johnny7(Johnny7)-191:
It might be easier/cheaper, just to chop JC’s fingers off.
That should put an end to this kind of reckless typing.
30 Jul 2010, 16:39 pm
Well at least the Boks cannot loose this weekend.
30 Jul 2010, 16:40 pm
Did someone mention chopping off fingers?
30 Jul 2010, 16:44 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-194: sharks supporter?
30 Jul 2010, 16:45 pm
@BULLET(BULLET)-197: loose is like a pair of trousers that fall off.
Lose is to not win, to be beaten.
30 Jul 2010, 16:46 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-199: heh yeah I am.
Seen the guy around town. So I know what he gets up to. Not nice.
30 Jul 2010, 16:49 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-195: mmm.. I think everyone is pissed off about that one.
@Panzer Chief(cane)-196: While we’re at it, can we also chop the fingers off of whoever it was that stuck that bloody irritating ad at the bottom of the page?
30 Jul 2010, 16:51 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-200: are you the new TheTackler?
30 Jul 2010, 16:53 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-203: No, I’m not the new ‘TheTackler’ (remember your inverted commas).
30 Jul 2010, 16:54 pm
Yeah dodgy old SA, that cavaliers tour was another disgrace, having to buy off players, but must admit I loved that tour, all the years they had not played
pity some of the boneheads did not wake up sooner, then again we never got to see the worlds best flanker on that tour,michael jones. Can’t remember if Maori fellas on tour or if our horseshit policy still applied.
30 Jul 2010, 16:59 pm
What an idiot Gold is:
Springbok assistant coach Gary Gold has broken his silence, admitting that the away leg of this year’s Vodacom Tri Nations was a failure, but vowed the coaching staff would work tirelessly to make the home leg a success.
Gold admitted in his online blog at rugbyiq.com that the Boks had executed their game plan poorly, but took another dig at referees by implying the difference between Super 14 and Tri Nations success was refereeing from the Northern Hemisphere. He also refused to believe the Bok game plan was outdated or old fashioned, as some critics have claimed.
“To say that the tour was not a success would be the understatement of the year. And while many of you rugby supporters are understandably annoyed and irritated with the team’s performances, it is our responsibility – and job – to not get caught up in a wave of emotion but, rather, objectively and systematically go about fixing the problem. Something which Peter de Villiers, as the head coach, is very good at doing,” Gold wrote.
“I believe that the cardinal rule about learning from our losses is that we need to focus our time and attention on the issues that we can control – in so doing we need to be honest and harsh about the things that we have done wrong; as an entire group. That said, I truly believe whilst there certainly were other external factors that aided our poor performances, spending time moaning and deliberating over these issues is counter-productive and takes our focus away from fixing the areas of our game that we can control.
Gold added that while it was a popular view at the moment that the Boks kicked too much while in New Zealand, the match statistics show that the All Blacks actually kicked more than the Boks.
“However, what is unquestionable is that their kicks – in their intentions and execution – were all superior to those of ours. Their kicks were on target more often and their chase was aggressive and accurate; in fact, their entire kicking strategy put us under similar pressure to what we did to them last year.
“You see, friends, what is really important is that we get to the bottom of whether our intended strategy and plan is wrong, as is widely report, or simply our execution. I believe the latter.
“Our kicks were generally inaccurate, we chased and aligned poorly and then failed on far too many occasions to make the first-time tackle intended to pin them deep in their own 22 – which, of course, exerts pressure and hopefully leads to turnovers. That is why I firmly believe, and clearly like NZ do, that the strategy is good – but on this tour our execution was far below our acceptable standard.”
Gold believes there is an irony in the claims the Boks aren’t “advancing the game” in the same way the Aussies and New Zealanders have.
“At last November’s SANZAR conference; the Super 14 teams from Australia, New Zealand and South Africa were told in no uncertain terms that four areas of the game were going to be heavily policed and teams not adhering to the refreshed interpretations of these four areas would be heavily penalised and thus be left behind. (The area that was most significantly going to be managed, would be the breakdown – with particular attention to the defending team allowing the attacking team to generate quick ball.)
“There is no doubt that South Africa’s Super 14 teams – through some astute coaching – adapted magnificently; an example of that is the team that conceded the most penalties in the 2010 Super 14 were the Crusaders, followed by the Hurricanes.
“In all, the Crusaders conceded 90 penalties; of those 75 penalties were conceded whilst on defence – mainly against effecting opposition from gaining quick ball.
“As we know, the Super 14 culminated in two SA sides meeting in the final and I am sure none of our Antipodean teams would disagree that they were the two best teams throughout the competition.
“How then, can it be possible that a few weeks later a Springbok team – made up largely of these same players – are now being accused of not ‘keeping up’ with how the game has advanced?
“And, here lies the irony…
“SANZAR instructed and initiated the new law interpretations and used 17 referees – from Australia, NZ and SA only – in 99 Super Rugby matches this season. Yet, to date, not one of those 17 referees have featured in the Tri-Nations (until this weekend – with our very own Craig Joubert in charge in Melbourne).
Gold said the team was admittedly “defenceless” when it came to their defence pattern on tour and this was something they would have to rectify.
“This is an area we will be giving massive attention to in the coming weeks as we build up to our next game in Soweto.
“The team has always prided itself in its strong defence and in the past that strong defence has given us a favourable reward by being able to turn over opposition ball. So, I am confident that rectify it.
“We are a tight squad under Pete’s leadership and nobody will shirk the hard work as we look to rectify our performances. Everybody in the Bok squad is very passionate about what they do, and how they do it, and there is a great camaraderie between everyone – all of whom have one goal; Bok victories. “
30 Jul 2010, 17:04 pm
@cab(cab)-205: Dude I thought the Cavaliers tour was great. It showed rugby is not about politics.
30 Jul 2010, 17:06 pm
Ah **** same old same old, it’s fine to get your kicking right, but that is not why we last, we have zero attacking impetus or plan to do so and our pack is considerably off the pack of last yeear
if they concentrate on their kicking again, even at home, the boks will get pumped again. Get the pack right and have a go with the ball in hand
30 Jul 2010, 17:17 pm
In short let Krusty work his magic, bugger this kickchase nonsense performed by lazy forwards that don’t want to committ and win hard fast giforward ball – Head Coach de Villiers must take a krusty mask to slip on before the kiwi tv postmaych interview
30 Jul 2010, 17:24 pm
jeepers Cab
stop talking so much sense.
It doesent feel right agreeing with you….
30 Jul 2010, 17:24 pm
Gold says that the Abs kicked more than the Boks. Well you genius, if they have 80% of the possession chances are they will do more than us, but the ratio of kicks to run is different.
30 Jul 2010, 17:28 pm
Nah this kickchase has Bern **** from the word go, the reason we were successful in 2009 was a pack that took the game to a different level on terms of commitment and frenetc blitzkrieg- had buggerall to do with the stupid kicking
30 Jul 2010, 19:38 pm
Brenden Nel
Johannesburg – Springbok coach Peter de Villiers has come out strongly to tell the country that he – and nobody else – is the coach of the national team.
After several articles which suggest that De Villiers was not in control of the World Champions but it was either run by senior players, or by the assistant coaches, the Bok mentor moved swiftly to dispel any doubts about who is in charge.
De Villiers faced up to fans questions in SA Rugby’s Bokzine – the email newsletter for Springbok fans – and was forthright when asked who is in charge of the team.
“I’ve heard this so many times – and not just in New Zealand – that it’s obvious that those with fixed opinions won’t change their minds whatever I say,” De Villiers wrote.
“I am the coach but I do listen to players who have played in close to 100 Tests and won every trophy there is to win in rugby. It has brought us success and I don’t recall this being a criticism last year. I am not threatened by this talk – after all, I went to France to fetch John (Smit) back.
When confronted by the question of bringing in young talent and the suggestion that some of the senior players have past their prime, the Bok coach pointed out that experience was a telling factor when it came to the World Cup.
“One of the key questions that we spend a long time debating in selection and this year you’ve seen that we have brought through young players like Francois Louw, Juan de Jongh, Flip van der Merwe and others,” De Villiers explained.
“But the history of World Cups is that they’re won by experience – the Bok and England teams that won the last two were the most experienced in either teams’ rugby history! All but three of Jake’s team won in 2007 had made their debuts at or before the previous World Cup, so experience can’t be a bad thing.”
De Villiers added that utility back Frans Steyn’s cannon boot was very much still in the Bok plans, but suggested his commitments to his French club Racing Metro were hindering him from playing for the national team.
“In answer, Frans is very much still in our thinking and we would like him in the team – we just have to balance the demands of club and country so that he can perform his best for the Springboks,” De Villiers said.
30 Jul 2010, 19:41 pm
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-206: Just read that now.
Gold often uses stats to back up everything he says on his blog…but im only interested in the most important stat…the Scoreboard
30 Jul 2010, 19:46 pm
‘“But the history of World Cups is that they’re won by experience – the Bok and England teams that won the last two were the most experienced in either teams’ rugby history! All but three of Jake’s team won in 2007 had made their debuts at or before the previous World Cup, so experience can’t be a bad thing.”’
well said PDV
30 Jul 2010, 22:56 pm
Peter Fitzsimons, former Wallaby prop, Sydney Morning Herald columnist and author of several books, has given 10 reasons why Australia will beat NZ in Melbourne. See what you think…
(Peter FitzSimons has the distinction of being the only Wallaby ever sent off against the All Blacks – something of which he is absurdly and tragically proud. Here, he tells us why Australia will topple New Zealand at Etihad Stadium in Melbourne tonight.)
1 It’s about bloody time. The Wallabies are too good a side, with too good a coach, to lose against the All Blacks EIGHT times in a row. It is against the natural order of things for a group of New Zealanders to beat a group of Australians at anything even once, and when it comes to losing at rugby that many times, surely the heavens themselves will revolt, the seas will rise, the sky fall in, before it will happen.
2 The Wallabies are rising fast. George Bernard Shaw once said: “Wagner has some wonderful moments … but some terrible half hours!” and the same may be said of the Wallabies in the latter part of last year, and a couple of their early Tests this year. But on their last outing, against the Springboks last week, the Wallabies had a couple of wonderful half hours and only a few terrible moments. They’re on the run-in to the World Cup now, and it was always going to be around now that it all started coming together. The signs are that it is happening!
3 The All Blacks are starting to fall away. How do I know that? Because there is no way they can possibly play better, ever, than they did against the Springboks in their past two Tests. Yes, of course they were completely devastating in those matches: rolling thunder in the forwards, lightning in the backs, all put together making a perfect storm that blew the South Africans away. But think of it mathematically. This year the All Blacks were always going to play “X” minutes of absolutely stupendous rugby. Now, we meet them at a time when there is only ”X less 320” minutes of perfect rugby left in them! There has to be some dud rugby ahead from them!
4 Our forward pack is getting better. And I know that from similar reasoning to that above. It was not so long ago that with a collapsing scrum and a dud lineout, they simply couldn’t get any worse, meaning the only way was up – and so it has proved. In the past two Tests, particularly, the Wallabies forwards have not only been competent, they have very nearly been bloody good!
5 Our depth. What does it say to you when we lose a player like Quade Cooper at five-eighth, and you not only have a genius the calibre of Matt Giteau to move into that position, but you get a refreshed Berrick Barnes coming off the bench?
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6 Will Genia. The halfback was a revelation for Queensland this year, the heart and soul of the side, and he was sorely missed by the Wallabies when absent through injury at the start of the season. But he’s baaaaaaaack! He demonstrated last week just how good he is and, with that run under his belt, this week he can make a statement to take his place on the Rugby Rushmore of the Halfback Greats, beside the likes of Ken Catchpole, Nick Farr-Jones and George Gregan.
7 We have their plans! After that photo of the piece of paper with a couple of the All Blacks moves on it was published, Robbie Deans has been no doubt up all night all week with a magnifying glass decoding the whole thing, before distributing it to the Wallabies. We’ll know what they’re going to do before they do! (Not really. That whole notion is absurd. But the more we play it up big, the more it plays with their minds.)
8 With victory, the Wallabies will be ”moving Australia forward” and ”taking real action” all in one, so you know it’s a good idea!
9 David Bloody Pocock. He belted the bejeesus out of the Springboks’ back row last weekend up in Brisbane and now it is the All Blacks’ turn to get their medicine. Hold still, Richie, this won’t hurt a bit. Not much, anyway.
10 It’s simple. We’re Australians. They’re Kiwis. We’re better than they are!
30 Jul 2010, 23:39 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-216: We all know Peter Fitzsimons is a sensationalist and this piece is nothing more than comedy, tongue-in-cheek, and he admits as much himself. Funny.
30 Jul 2010, 23:46 pm
Superb ! Fitzsimons is one of my very favourite sports journos. Very clever, witty. His books are excellent, smart guy.
This match can go either way. Blacks still developing, Boks were so bad that they made them look better than they are. Wallabies still developing too but have home ground advantage and Deans will have tricks up his sleeve, fer sure. ABs hold psychological advan with 7 straight wins, but theyre not good enough to expect any away victory in Aus. Great to get the African easybeats out of the way, let them return to Currie Cup and lick their wounds and egos. Soccer City can wait for another day.
kia KAHA !
30 Jul 2010, 23:46 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-161:
“Mind you, the Cavaliers side that toured in 1986 was basically an All Black team – I think 28 of the 30 who toured with the Cavaliers were All Blacks before that.” – WP
Wrong. They were the worst of scum for breaking the sanctions and “playing” a team that represented an illegal regime. 28 of 30 were AB’s before but how many after?
30 Jul 2010, 23:54 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-218: Interesting preview BP but I think if we’re honest NZ are going to win. Deans’s record v NZ is something like 6-1 and I’m not convinced the Wallabies bringing anything new to the table in 2010.
30 Jul 2010, 23:55 pm
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-219:
The 1986 Cavaliers were selected on the form at the end of 1984. They were already geriatrics hanging on just to make 1984 (Ashworth, Axle Knight etc) so 2 years later they were completely knackered. They were, in no shape or form, representative of what an ‘All Black’ team would have been if selected instead in 1986. Less than HALF made the RWC squad the following year.
Safas are so desperate for results again NZ. Let them believe what they want. The record since post-isolation stands at a win/loss ration of 3:1 in NZs favour. If it seems like only 3 weeks since that we were being told that at “3-0″ every year it would take only a few minutes to even up again, then thats because it was.
31 Jul 2010, 00:00 am
@Panzer Chief(cane)-184: Disgusting!
31 Jul 2010, 00:02 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-219:
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-221:
a tad bitter ‘n twisted chaps?
chat later
cheers
31 Jul 2010, 00:02 am
@BULLET(BULLET)-197:
“Well at least the Boks cannot loose this weekend.”
Those in losing CC games can. Poor b*rstards.
31 Jul 2010, 00:06 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-43:
“The most boring thread on keo to date.” – GWS
It’s reached five pages so some people aren’t bored.
31 Jul 2010, 00:08 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-224: Loose? Lose?
31 Jul 2010, 00:10 am
@charo(charo)-223: 2nd blackest time in New Zealand rugby history.
31 Jul 2010, 00:10 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-220: It’s 8-1. That bad.
31 Jul 2010, 00:23 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-226: Heard you had a habit of doing that.
31 Jul 2010, 00:36 am
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-221: Half of the 1986 Cavaliers were hanging on for the one last unfulfilled ambition to hurrah off their career — a tour of SA against the Boks. And so, mission accomplished, they retired after coming home and that’s why they weren’t in the 87 RWC squad — they weren’t even contending for a place in it. They’d quit.
Only two current 1985 ABs refused to tour with the Cavaliers — Graham Mourie and John Kirwan.
The Cavaliers were indeed as close to a full-strength AB team as makes no difference, no doubt about it.
No point in pretending otherwise.
And, as the Gleneagles Agreement had forbidden OFFICIAL tours, the South Africans (who weren’t consulted or signatories of that agreement) went the unofficial route as it was the only one available to them.
Nothing wrong with that. One hardly expects a turkey to slit its own throat. SARU (or, rather, its forerunner, SARB) had a duty to advance Springbok rugby, and not a duty to worry about any other countries’ sporting interests.
So they did what they deemed best in 1986. And they did it well, following it up with a “World Invitation” two-test tour in 1989.
31 Jul 2010, 00:47 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-230:
John Kirwan and David Kirk
The ABs best player
and
The RWC winning Captain.
31 Jul 2010, 01:04 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-220:
Consistently the best open-rugby matchup on the Planet, bar none. 2 teams running it all day, hammer and tongs, having a go, mate.
You Tube the ‘Cannon punch’ on Mealamu* and tell me Bledisloe Cups are boring and mean nothing !
Kevvie takes a great one right on the snoz and comes back for more……..yyyyyyyyyyyyyEAH baby !
31 Jul 2010, 01:27 am
Agree some the greatest showdowns of all time have been Aus / NZ Bledisloe encounters where no quarters are given, asked, nor taken. Tomorrow promises to be right up there with some others of recent memory. None of this boring as f’ng heinous garbage that the likes of JW and his crony disciples drone out year after dumb f’ck year. kicking and chasing and seeking out intercepts and long range drop goals to eternity, play without the ball, cower into the laager and kick your self to sleep kind of nonentity game plan.
At least when NZ meets Aus, they play rugby, they recognize exactly what the object of the exercise is about, like crossing the opposition try line, that is prima strategy nomero uno, cross the opposition try line with whatever means at your disposal, not hope and pray that after you up n under for the umpteenth time somebody over yonder gonna drop the ball and hand you another lucky packet win like WC 2007.
31 Jul 2010, 01:30 am
@skopskiet(yliad)-233:
we do a strange thing in NZ (many, actually) when we wish to show ‘respect’.
We bow down and do The Messiah.
31 Jul 2010, 01:44 am
What? No bokke this wend, 7s rugby toss it about, battle of the cheats. Is their amy decent NH rugby on?
31 Jul 2010, 01:51 am
Q:- What do you call the match for 3rd place in the TriN ?
A:- The Currie Cup; its always a Sth African team.
31 Jul 2010, 01:59 am
cab just canna wait for the annual England-Italy monstrous melodrama of mammoth proportions, puts NZ – Aus rivalry in the shade, 2 huffing and puffing menopausal monstrosity power packs hefferlumping their way to oblivion in inches and falling over each others pompous Romulus rumps in the modder.
Don’t bother turning on the telly in the morning catchacrabbertjie its just a boring little encounter between two juggernauts of the running game who gonna go hammer and tongs at each other, rather you sleep in late, catch up your snoozy double deluxe twinky two little winks, and store up that energy for when England or Scotland meet up with megalith Italy instead.
31 Jul 2010, 02:04 am
How on earth can 60% of the KEO poll participants think that the Wallabies will win by more than 15 points? That’s fairly jaw-dropping.
31 Jul 2010, 02:05 am
That’s more like it- bit of crash bash bang – like those old mountain rams battering koppe – like the first scrims of old – crunch. Instead what we going to get treated too, a score of 98-96 with no big hits, no vokmaarvoort and no testing of the tightplay – might ad well call it basketball – the sheep ranglers vs Ozzie and skippy show
31 Jul 2010, 02:06 am
wishful thinking, thats how
31 Jul 2010, 02:14 am
Right think I will listen to a bit of Florence and the machine, beats old bob the beatnik whisperer hands down
night night
31 Jul 2010, 02:16 am
crash bash mash mush smooch smother schlep schlop flop over each other, thats NH rugby in its hay hoe glory, bit like saffa JW rugby reverting to our immaculate emaciated strengths
Aus – NZ rugby showdowns are the benchmarks of where this game should be at, unlike that 15-6, 5 kicks to 2 adulation of our glorious grandeur nonentity snooze party where if you had to blink you might just have missed the game entirely.
31 Jul 2010, 02:23 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-216: He knows they are screwed before they start. He has not stated one cold fact or made one relative statement in his (tongue in cheek)summary of the case. A lawyer whose client is looking at the ‘chair’ and he is trying to squash DNA, finger prints and eye witness with rhetoric and conjecture.@skopskiet(yliad)-237: LMFAO Skop, keep it up!It brings a picture to mind of a Hippo trying to mount a Rhino on a muddy field and cant get its footing
I really and respectively think the Wallabies really need a name change….it just doesnt seem to cut it and the Wallaby is an even smaller and more timid creature than the kangaroo..
like the ‘Rose’ what were they thinking of a punch of petals?
No we should open a big debate and help the Wallys find something with some Grit and character, a name of sterner meaning.
I mean OZ has Croc’s and some of the worlds deadliest creatures both on land and in the waterways and oceans, insects like the spiders and a massive history of the Aboriginal culture to draw on. Buffalo and Tasmanian tigers etc and some bright spark comes up with wallaby..?
Look at some of the names of the league teams..Cronulla Sharks, St George Dragons, Broncos, Raiders etc…NZ Warriors, Titans and Eagles. Even the state teams are better placed to some degree in the naming stakes, even the Brumbys give more of an image of something wild and strong( historically it ties in with the man from snowy river). Even the Q’land Reds Koala looks more ferocious than the how the Wallaby is presented!!
31 Jul 2010, 02:40 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-243: He’s pulling your leg, pilgrim.
31 Jul 2010, 02:54 am
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-231: David Kirk wasn’t an All Black when the Cavaliers were picked. He was still “up and coming”. Kirwan was an AB, and a great winger. But wingers really have very little influence on the overall brilliance of any team. Lomu wasn’t the key reason why the 1996 ABs beat the world champion Boks. The players that have the greatest influence on the excellence of a team wear number 10 and below.
31 Jul 2010, 02:55 am
@funkyzoo(funkyzoo)-238: There’s some sort of virus in that poll system.
31 Jul 2010, 04:13 am
Stegmann moet (moes) daar wees. Hy het in die S14 vir Brussouw ore aangesit.
Ja, refs like hom nie. Maar hy is on par met die beste fetchers – ons sou the BIL verloor het, want Supersnor wou nie Brussouw kies nie, gelukkig het die noodlot ons gehelp,
Frankensteyn ook, maar die laaitie en PdV se ego’s bots.
Regardless, ons grootste probleme is… – Coaches
(Unrelated:
Nadat Gary Gold gewaai het by die WP/Stormers, het hulle skrum baie verbeter.
Os doen nou ons skrum afrigting.
Wat presies is jou job description as jy forwards coach is, maar jy kan nie eers jou skrums fix nie?
Gary Gold is ‘n quota coach, en die manier wat hy die afgelope tyd gatgabbas raak met die joernaliste spreek boekdele.
**** Muir word ge-expose vir wie hy is – die Sharks se sukses is as gevolg van Plumtree)
Kry Heyneke in vir forwards coach, Slaptjip vir Backline coach, en gooi Allister Coetzee in vir good measure.
31 Jul 2010, 04:22 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-244: ..Hence the ‘tongue in cheek comment’…pilgrim.
31 Jul 2010, 04:33 am
So, if you know it’s TIC, you mustn’t let Fitz wind you up so much, pilgrim. Bad for the blood pressure and all.
31 Jul 2010, 04:36 am
Watch the video how Mcaw cheats and watch the refs duplicity
http: //www.youtube com/watch?v=pdr-W775hk4&feature= player_embedded
We now Pdiddy for his comments but this is shocking. Its destroying the integrity of rugby.
31 Jul 2010, 05:38 am
@KevinRack(KevinRack)-250: Bah humbug! McCaw sizes up ALL the refs from all over the world and he quickly reads where there limits are and what each one will let him get away with, and he adjusts his game accordingly. He doesn’t only have one ref whom he can exploit to maximum advantage.
That’s precisely why he’s the best rugby player on earth. Lesser players ought to watch and learn from this master of his craft.
31 Jul 2010, 05:39 am
their, not there… pardon. (line 2 post 251)
31 Jul 2010, 05:39 am
How easily the Kiwis get riled up. So much for First World education, that one can’t see a stitch up telegraphing itself from five miles away..
Should see even refereeing decisions today as the bullying Boers aren’t playing so the game should be even keeled, safe and predictably boring, as is the norm with ALL Australasian rivalries.
Prepare to break out the ‘Stay awake’ tablets.
31 Jul 2010, 05:42 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-253: Everyone saw the leg-pull, pilgrim. Well, almost everyone.
31 Jul 2010, 05:58 am
That clip certainly shows the AB’s getting away with some illegal play. Would be interesting to see the same ‘analysis’ (not sure if I should dignify it with that name) done on the Boks for the entire match as well? Even one of those ‘anti-AB’ clips shows a Bok player driving over the top of a ruck, going off his feet and then using his hands to slow the AB ball. Would other clips show similar?
I am not sure how the ‘commentator’ of that clip was applying the rules, but below are the actual rules. Apply these to some (I agree not all)of the ‘illegal’ play by RM etc and suddenly it doesn’t look so illegal. Take the penalty given against RM near the AB try line. He tackled Roussow around the legs, released him, got to his feet, and reached for the ball. When he was pushed off his feet he released the ball. What is illegal about that? It just looks bad because he is so quick the Bok forwards arrived so slowly. In fact it was interesting watching those clips to see how often there were twice as many black shirts as green shirts!
As for some of the clip ‘commentators’ other comments, he either didn’t watch his own clip or just chose to misrepresent some of the actions.
15.4 THE TACKLER
(a) When a player tackles an opponent and they both go to ground, the tackler must immediately release the tackled player.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(b) The tackler must immediately get up or move away from the tackled player and from the ball at once.
Sanction: Penalty kick
(c) The tackler must get up before playing the ball and then may play the ball from any direction.
Sanction: Penalty kick
31 Jul 2010, 06:21 am
It’s an Aussie video preparing for today’s game! Same tactics 2?games in a row
The Aussies employed exactly the same game plan using the no3 as the guardian/obsrtucter
I think PDiddy might be smarter than we think cos now as SANZOO has charged him he can use video in his defence
This kinda play is as disgraceful as eye gouging and destroys the integrity of the game
31 Jul 2010, 06:25 am
Watch the video how Mcaw cheats and watch the refs duplicity
http: //www.youtube com/watch?v=pdr-W775hk4&feature= player_embedded
31 Jul 2010, 07:04 am
@KevinRack(KevinRack)-256: “This kinda play is as disgraceful as eye gouging”
and people accuse me of whinging, you havent stopped since Kevin..
eye gouging CAN maim for life.. guess thats alright though in the bully boys handbook to thuggery?
what a joke…
31 Jul 2010, 07:21 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-253: stay awake tablets prespawn??
bwahahaha only when watching a team incorporate the kick chase game plan year after year…as exciting as watching grown men wearing armbands to blindly lead their sheepish supporters..
“justice 4″ the bokke because everyone picks on them, its a conspiracy..
31 Jul 2010, 09:06 am
The sad thing Poppa is this is SARU’s job to highlight these isses! here we have the ausssies who are very smart highlighting the isssues before the game!
ARU might not have the worlds best players but they know how to play smart rugby on and off the field
Something we can learn from both SANZAR partners
31 Jul 2010, 09:33 am
@aliboy(aliboy)-255: It’s not illegal unless and until the ref rules it so. The ref is the sole judge of fact. Says so in the law-book.
That’s a fact.
31 Jul 2010, 09:44 am
.
PAH ! what would those ex-players know anyway……
“Does this man get away with murder?
New Zealand captain Richie McCaw.
PHIL WAUGH and Rod Kafer have weighed into the debate surrounding Richie McCaw’s activities at the breakdown, but far from branding the All Blacks skipper a repeat transgressor have urged the Wallabies to follow his ‘’smart” style of play.
As Robbie Deans’s men prepare to face the seemingly unstoppable All Blacks at Etihad Stadium next Saturday, Waugh said the Wallabies shouldn’t read much into comments by Springboks coach Pieter de Villiers that referees are turning a blind eye to McCaw’s foul play.
”It’s about responding to how the referees interpret the breakdown during the game – and obviously all referees are different,” Waugh said. ”And the quicker you get the interpretations right for the game the better you’re going to perform in the game.
”Richie’s a very astute and smart rugby player who picks that up very early in the game, which allows him to push the limits. And that’s what he’s out there to do.
”He’s obviously been a real leader in the game ever since he came on to the scene in 2001 and he’s very good at it. He’s probably had times and moments during the past few years where he hasn’t got away with it as much as he would have liked. But in any circumstance, people in our position push the limits and he’s obviously one of the best at getting on the right side of that fine line.
”It’s about being influential in the game and he’s getting back to where he was three or four years ago of being a real influence on the game and good luck to him. You’ve got to push the game to the limit.”
Expert commentator Kafer agreed with Waugh and said the Wallabies could do worse than try to imitate aspects of the All Blacks’ game. ”It’s pretty obvious the Springboks are playing last year’s rugby and the All Blacks are playing next year’s rugby – I think Australia’s stuck somewhere in between,” he said. ”That’s probably the difference for the All Blacks.”
Kafer urged Australia to play an expansive game next Saturday or risk the same fate as the Springboks, who suffered consecutive losses to New Zealand in the first two matches of the 2010 Tri Nations series.
”Richie has changed his game quite significantly. The way he plays he’s become much more of a link player,” he said. ”But for a variety of reasons against the Springboks it suited him to go back to the old-school Richie McCaw of being a real factor at the breakdown. The Springboks played it very tight and that played into Richie’s hands.
”If you play it tight then he’s always somewhere in and around the breakdown. If you play anything close you’re going to run into him. And that’s dangerous.”
While Kafer has no issue with McCaw’s tactics at the breakdown he did suggest his stature in the game has some effect on how McCaw is treated by referees.
”Every player tries to make the most of the breakdown and Richie McCaw’s got the slight advantage of being captain – he commands a little bit more respect from the referees from time to time, I think,” he said. ”But I’m happy for him to do the same thing against Australia. I don’t think it’s illegal whatsoever.”.
What was that again, Rod ?
“I don’t think it’s illegal whatsoever.”.
31 Jul 2010, 09:53 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-245:
um, “thanks, Pilgrim”, you can let a real Kiwi take over from here.
David Kirk started his AB career in 1983 and by 1985 had toured UK and Aus with the ABs and played 4 Tests in 1985. By that time he was the no1 no9.
And here’s a little something extracted from the History books, pilgrim:-
“David Kirk’s smile and boyish features were often described as New Zealand rugby’s best public relations tools, especially in the turbulent and momentous years of 1986 and 1987. In the first year there was the turmoil caused by the Cavaliers’ unauthorised tour of South Africa, and in the second, the World Cup triumph. Kirk had a central role in both.
But in view of the favourable image that he left, as a university-educated medical doctor and academic it was surprising that, if not always of his own making, his career was embroiled in so much controversy.
Kirk’s late withdrawal from the Cavaliers’ tour irked many of that side’s senior players and organisers and that resentment was increased later in 1986 when he was made captain of the so-called Baby Blacks that played tests against France and Australia.”.
As for your assessment of JK, well you clearly didnt live in NZ by then. He was the biggest name in the ABs, bar none.
31 Jul 2010, 09:58 am
looking forward to the abs choking under the aussie ambush tonight as usual. the ref has probably got his eye on mccheat this time and im also looking forward watching him get man handled by pocock
31 Jul 2010, 10:02 am
the new zealand pretenders are nothing but a bad stain on the underpants of society.
31 Jul 2010, 10:56 am
@Wayne Barnes No.1 Ref(sipher)-265: Touch of class there Wayne
31 Jul 2010, 11:18 am
@Wayne Barnes No.1 Ref(sipher)-265: The “NZ Pretenders” put eight tries and sixty points past the “world champions” in 160 minutes. Pretty convincing pretending, to be 2-0 up with only one more to play! Just as well they didn’t stop pretending and started taking it seriously then?
31 Jul 2010, 11:18 am
@goyougoodthing2(goyougoodthing2)-144: Interesting perspective… Maybe more than some truth there
31 Jul 2010, 11:21 am
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-263: 4 tests is the mark of a greenhorn and a back-up. JK is a winger and wingers are never crucial kingpins in any rugby team — not even Lomu.
31 Jul 2010, 11:31 am
@KevinRack(KevinRack)-256:
Pathetic
Cheating is as bad as eye gouging?? Is that what you said.
You name one player in rugby that hasnt been penalised?
If you are penalised,you have cheated somewhere along the line,isnt that right?
31 Jul 2010, 11:34 am
The Cavaliers were a full-strength AB team. Kirk and JK really wouldn’t have made a blind bit of difference and to give that out as the main excuse why the Cavaliers lost the series is pretty lame, really. Certainly, none of those players used it.
31 Jul 2010, 11:34 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-269:
.
Nice version of “I was wrong” there, Tickler.
Captain Kirk started all of his 4 Tests in 1985 including the crucial Test vs Aus where he commanded Eden Park.
Goldie grew up wanting to be JK. Do you remember Goldie, Tickler ?
or perhaps you can remember an injured, old age pensioner, also by the name of Kirwan who – 6 years later in 1992 – scored the winning try vs the Boks in Sth Africa in 1992 ?
man up, Pilgrim.
31 Jul 2010, 11:34 am
@Wayne Barnes No.1 Ref(sipher)-264:
Cool name. But even the South Africans think your a cr@p ref,goodnight
31 Jul 2010, 11:37 am
@KevinRack(KevinRack)-260: I agree Kevin, you guys need another Doc Craven at the helm…
31 Jul 2010, 11:44 am
laugh at the Polls.
Ozzie by 15+,but hey it could happen.
But i think it just shows how hated the ABs are in SA by a few people.
31 Jul 2010, 11:46 am
Goldie, the over-rated over-emotional Otago winger who was so memorably utterly undone over the try-line by Gregan? Hard to forget him, if only for that. Goldie would surely have had a soulmate in the emotionally-unstable JK who ran the length of the field to score one of a bagful of tries against the 1987 rugby super-power of Italy.
Wingers are just the flash-harry glory-hound finishers, pilgrim. They score tries and hog the limelight, but the REAL difference-makers wear the single-digit jerseys in any test team. Lots of small boys are dazzled by flashy twinkletoed wingers and want to be like them. What little boy wants to be a Carl Hayman or a Brad Thorn or any of those big grubby cauliflower-eared grunts toiling deep in the engine room? Not a lot.
But they’re the real match-winners.
31 Jul 2010, 11:47 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-275: I agree totally mate… so funny, wonder how many are repeat votes..
31 Jul 2010, 11:50 am
The Cavaliers lost because they got smashed by the Green Machine. The Boks were super motivated for the Kiwis and the public demanded a win at all costs.
Some of those Cavaliers players still wake up screaming at the intensity and brutality of the tests. Going back to play Australia was like taking a slumber in comparison.
31 Jul 2010, 11:57 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-278:
Yeah,few came back with bite marks and sore eyes etc.
Wasnt it reffed by South African refs?
Anyway at that time Ozzie were the NZs hardest team to play against.Looks like not much has changed.
I think only 5-6 players from the Cavaliers were amongst the 22 odd players that made the RWC in 1987
31 Jul 2010, 12:03 pm
Lets see the game bru.
31 Jul 2010, 22:24 pm
here comes another train wreck next week!!!!!!!
31 Jul 2010, 22:50 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-276:
Th reference was to the value of wingers in SA, as if Jonah was not the only one to be kept tryless vs SA.
The ABs of 1996 achieved immortality at Loftus Versfeld when they recorded that magnificent Series victory over the RWChampions on their own turf. This victory owed much to the Golden boy of Southland, who raced in for not 1 but 2 magnificent solo efforts down the sideline. Given the late comeback from the Boks that threatened to steal victory from the jaws of defeat, it would be agreed that it was the wingers brace that proved to be the difference.
31 Jul 2010, 22:52 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-272:
[hide]
v • d • e
New Zealand Cavaliers 1986 squad
Forwards
Anderson · Ashworth · Dalton (c) · Earl · Haden · Hobbs · Knight · McDowell · Mexted · Mills · Pierce · Reid · Shaw · Shelford, F · Shelford, W · Whetton, A · Whetton, G
Backs
Clamp · Crowley · Deans · Donald · Fraser · Fox · Green · Loveridge · Osborne · Pokere · Robins · Smith · Simpson · Taylor
Coach
Meads
1987 final team
John Gallagher; John Kirwan, Warwick Taylor, Joe Stanley, Craig Green; Grant Fox, David Kirk; John Drake, Sean Fitzpatrick, Steven McDowell; Murray Pierce, Gary Whetton; Michael Jones, Alan Whetton, Buck Shelford
Seem if you compare notes they still picked many Cavaliers
Talk about a lucky packet RWC trophy
Playing Scotland in the quarters and Wales in the semi and France in the final
31 Jul 2010, 22:56 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-276: got to agree there tackler, the rest of the team is obviously important but winning is all about numbers 1-5 dominating the collisions and providing front foot ball.
Bakkies and Thorn would be my lock combo, Tom Croft at blindside to handle the lineout.
1 Aug 2010, 00:31 am
@JL1(JL1)-283:
Only 4 of those Cavaliers were regular starters in the 4 Invitation International matches in SA, that then ended up in the RWC Final team. The team were, partic in the pack, geriatrics before the tour was delayed by 18mths, they had no chance of making the RWC.
Scotland were lead by Big Gav and were the strongest British team. They were full of Lions starting players. In 1986 they were 2nd in the 5 Nations having beaten France, the eventual winners. France turned up in NZ as Grand Slam winners’87.
That was the QuarterFinal. A bit tougher than Fiji then.
1 Aug 2010, 05:32 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-284: The tight five are important, but really it comes down to the front row. If they are kuk you can’t win…see Eddie Andrews and Jon Smit as props. The next most important thing is the breakdowns; without a classy scavenger you can’t retain or win possession after the scrum.
And the loss of Fourie at number 9 has just exposed SA’s lack of depth..or selection problems!
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