Awesome and inspiring All Blacks
2 Aug 2010
MARK KEOHANE, in his weekly Business Day column, says New Zealand deserve credit for their recent Test performances.
South Africans can bury their heads in the sand and mock the All Blacks for supposedly peaking a year before the World Cup, but those who believe this are in denial about the state of Springbok rugby and too accepting of mediocrity.
The All Blacks are playing amazing rugby. Is that too hard to acknowledge? Alternatively is it that too hard to enjoy watching?
The All Blacks a year ago were awful and their selections and performances in the Tri Nations were among their worst since 1998 when the New Zealanders lost five Tests in succession. Then the question was whether there was a next generation of Kiwi who could sustain their historical dominance of world rugby. Now we know there is one good enough.
In a year their coaches have identified players they believe capable of playing total rugby, and in the first three Tests of the 2010 Tri Nations these players have delivered near complete performances on attack and in defence. It has been inspiring stuff and if you haven’t been awed then your love is for a team and not the game of rugby.
Watching the All Blacks in the last month reminded me why rugby union has the greater appeal to rugby league and that there isn’t a more inspiring sight in rugby union than players creating magic with their hands and not simply relying on a kick for points.
There is a place for kicking in any match, but it is when the kick is made that defines the kick. In Melbourne two defensive kicks led to charge downs and tries, but those were the only ordinary kicks in a game dominated by hand speed, passes and a desire by both teams to retain the ball as a form of attack.
Teams will on occasion succeed in countering the way the All Blacks are playing and there will be days when the passes don’t stick and the bounce isn’t favourable, but to dismiss the All Blacks of peaking a year to early is an insult to what they have produced in the last month.
Even if the All Blacks don’t win next year’s World Cup, you can’t take away the genius of the attack in Auckland, Wellington and Melbourne.
Test rugby is supposed to be the ultimate test for a player, which is why it is called Test rugby. The introduction of the World Cup has cheapened Test rugby because so many teams use the tournament, held every four years, as an excuse for indifferent performances between World Cups.
The Boks are taking comfort that they are getting thrashed now and not in the World Cup year. What nonsense. A Test defeat is a defeat and should not be as easily dismissed or forgotten.
Whenever a coach gets his selection wrong he can claim experimentation ahead of the World Cup, and on the odd occasion a team plays scintillating rugby between World Cups the accusation is the team has peaked too soon.
Some coaches say they deliberately want to give away nothing in between World Cups because showing their hands would prejudice their World Cup prospects.
If this is the case and the only matches of significance are those played at the World Cup, then national colours should not be awarded for those 35-odd matches played by the Springboks between World Cups and they certainly should not be called Tests, because that is when players supposedly test their best skills against the best of another nation and spectators are prepared to pay large sums of money to watch the spectacle.
Instead, in this professional age that rewards the mediocre, sensational wins are mocked and embarrassing defeats are cherished as good things because it is not a World Cup year.
That isn’t right. There has to be accountability to every Test and there should never be something as a meaningless exercise if a player represents his country.
I don’t buy into the theory that rather your team loses this year than in a World Cup year. I buy into the theory that says you give your best every time you play for your country and people pay to watch because there is an expectation that this best will bring victory.
And when this skill brings seven tries away from home, it is an achievement worthy of awe and not the ridicule of getting it right in the wrong year.
The All Blacks in Melbourne got it right on the right day; as they did in Auckland and Wellington, and I’d rather that was the case with the Boks this year and every time they play the game they call Test rugby.
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243 Comments
2 Aug 2010, 11:30 am
It’s how rugby SHOULD be played. And the defence is good too.
2 Aug 2010, 11:31 am
Haka Dragons
2 Aug 2010, 11:32 am
How many new players were there in that side, Mark?
2 Aug 2010, 11:39 am
@David(David)-3: which side?
2 Aug 2010, 11:42 am
@keo(keo)-4:
The ABs. Henry reckoned before the first test against the Boks, he’d gone for experience. Other than replacing Ross and including Dagg, it was the same old guys.
2 Aug 2010, 11:44 am
@keo(keo)-4:
Sorry, I missed out Read at 8, instead of last years experiment of swapping Kaino and Rodney around.
2 Aug 2010, 11:45 am
@David(David)-5: Err, David, surely EXPERIENCE means “the same old guys”?
2 Aug 2010, 11:46 am
Waylon Murray is needed in the Bok midfield. I stood next to him in a line at CNA in the Pavilion a few months ago and he is a big strapping lad. He runs a little stooped over which means he’d be difficult to stop on the run. Most South African rugby players run too upright which makes it nice and easy for an opposition player to tackle and push the player back to win ground. Juan de Villiers got badly injured against the Scots because of his body positioning. Bismarck du Plessis and Danie Roussouw also run too upright with ball in hand.
The Boks also lack tall and strong backline players. The wings are particularily vulnerable and it has been a while since South Africa had imposing wings like Ray Mordt who although not tall was stocky, strong on his feet and fast as heck. Habana is caught out by his lack of imposing size and it shows with his poor defensive record. The Ndungane twins as well. Fourie tackles too upright which means the opposition centre still makes vital yards before being brought down.
Leaving out brutually strong and fast players like JP Pietersen is causing a gap in the effectiveness of the backline to penetrate vital yards like we are seeing with the Kiwis and Aussies.
Bottom line, the Boks have let through easy easy tries through defensive ineptitude. Lets get back to winning ways.
2 Aug 2010, 11:47 am
Really enjoy watching the Blacks when they play like they did on Sat.
Its a cut above anythything we’ve produced recently and if anything, I hope it inspires the Boks to improve drastically. That was the way the game of rugby was meant to be played: hard and uncompromising up front and fast and freelowing at the back.
A bit like Hougaards hairstyle at present.
2 Aug 2010, 11:47 am
What has changed is their approach and their combinations. He has settled on Kaino, McCaw and Reid as his loose-trio where last year he wasted so much time with Thomson, as an opensider and closed sider. That has been massive in terms of the All Blacks dominance at the breakdown, which is where they struggled last year. The mix of Donnelly and Thorn also gives them grunt in the second row, which they lacked last year.
Keven Mealamu is far more effective starting and thanks to Andrew Hore’s injury this was made possible. The Franks brothers have quickly taken to Test rugby, while the introduction of Whitelock, Cruden and Dagg makes for a very exciting bench – again something they did not have last year.
Jane also gives them so much more on the wing as he gives the comfort of an extra fullback in attack and defence. It isn’quite as simple as saying he has just gone with the same old guys.
2 Aug 2010, 11:47 am
The Franks are new. Jane is new. Cruden is new. Vito is new. Ranger is new. Donnelly is new.
2 Aug 2010, 11:50 am
@Richie_7(Richie_7)-7:
That was directed at Keo, who was describing the side as the next generation.
2 Aug 2010, 11:55 am
the royalties for hits on this thread are gonna be dynamite keo..
2 Aug 2010, 11:56 am
@keo(keo)-10:
I agree that this side is looking far superior to last years shambles. Having McCaw out didn’t help either. Reid is the only real addition to the loose trio with Kaino moving back to 7. I’m just wondering how many of the older players will still be at their peak by the time the WC starts.
Apart from that I agree that every test should be treated as important and not just a step to the WC. Any knockout tournament is a bad judge of superiority.
2 Aug 2010, 11:57 am
I am looking forward to Helium replying to the games of the Blacks and the Wallabies with some good old fashioned planning and coaching.
This is where old Snor has to step up to the plate and deliver.
Simple as that – or be shown up for the *** that most think he is.
2 Aug 2010, 11:57 am
the start above mean T*I*T
2 Aug 2010, 11:57 am
.
WOW – this is, by far, THE most profound statement Keo has ever published here:-
” It has been inspiring stuff and if you haven’t been awed then your love is for a team and not the game of rugby.”.
2 Aug 2010, 11:58 am
@keo(keo)-4: Sometimes you piss me off keo, you’re quite often correct in your assessments even though i want to believe in the contrary. While i would like to believe that the AB’s strong showing this year as a bad omen for them i still would not like to see the Boks performing so poorly in between world cups, i have yet to see the Boks win at a live game so I’m hoping this turns around at Soccer City, if not all i can hope for is that the same omen applies for us as 2006.
2 Aug 2010, 11:58 am
stars rather ..
2 Aug 2010, 11:59 am
so i heard that pdv said john smit and matfield are coaching the team . but where on earth is **** muir and gary gold in all this ?
2 Aug 2010, 12:00 pm
@klippies101(klippies101)-20: where did you see this in print?
2 Aug 2010, 12:01 pm
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-8: And you reckon Waylon Murray will be the answer?
2 Aug 2010, 12:02 pm
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-8: And you reckon Waylon Murray will be the answer?
Keep in mind that the players tackling him are not midgets either…..
2 Aug 2010, 12:03 pm
Waylon Murray is very average. done and dusted.
2 Aug 2010, 12:04 pm
Why is Keo making such a fuss? All teams need to build and evolve (by testing new combination’s etc) and make way for the next generation. The world cup just helps to identify a time line in which changes should start to be made.
Besides Test rugby is still a big spectacle between word cups.They should rather address the amount of rugby being played. If the Super 15 could have pools like a world cup and be a shorter tournament, there wouldn’t be any excuses to rest players and try new combination. The extra time before the build up to any test should give more than enough time to sort out the best team, with a world cup looming or not.
2 Aug 2010, 12:04 pm
@klippies101(klippies101)-20: Now thats where the problem starts , on heresay. i do not remember him saying that except that he does take advise from old player. i would think Woodward did the same with the likes of Johnson and Henry definately must have listen to what the likes of Umaga had to say. Its only natural.
2 Aug 2010, 12:07 pm
@keo(keo)-10: Versus Spies, Ratel and Smith I rate our chance thank you very much.
We lost because we have 3 of our world class players missing i.e. Ratel, Juan and FDP.
It happened so we should move on also we need a proper fetcher now in the side my loose trio would be Stegman, Juan and Spies and I would play Jano Vermmak at scrummie.
Also play the WP centre together WO is unable to form a partnership with them but he remains a good option from the bench.
2 Aug 2010, 12:07 pm
@klippies101(klippies101)-20: What can either of those coaches teach JS and VM about rugby? hmmmm? One is the best leader in world rugby and the other is the best lock in the world….
2 Aug 2010, 12:08 pm
I reckon the reference to the next generation has all to do with people saying that we are now the dominant force in world rugby and that the AB’s have no depth and are losing their dominance. This year’s group has put paid to that for sure.
Great article, Keo. I also hate this infatuation with World Cups, but I guess money talks.
The AB’s will win the World Cup. In our case, the fact that we were very poor in the seasons leading up to the WC in 07 is foolishly used to soften the reality of how poor we are. Those who do that do so at their peril. We will not have another WC where we will not have to beat the AB’s, the Wallabies and the French in order to win it. Lightning only strikes once.
We are desperately poor tactically in both attack and defense. What amazes me is how the CC teams can play such wonderfully attacking rugby and have such well organized defensive systems, but the Boks are going backwards in these departments.
2 Aug 2010, 12:11 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-27: Dont throw Flouw away just yet, the kid had 2 bad tests, doesnt mean he can improve, he had a brilliant S14, but he needs to be given time in the Bok jersey.
2 Aug 2010, 12:11 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-18:
Better start praying then.
If Boks win their RWC Pool, then they are likely to meet Australia or Ireland in the QterF’s. No need reminding of Irelands run of victories vs SA (3) nor of last time SA met Aus (13-30).
Even the 3rd-ranked team from that Pool, Italy, will be tougher than FIJI !
Should the Boks emerge victorious from that QterF, then its a likely SemiF vs the All Blacks, at home, or France. And if ANY team doesnt fear Eden Park, its France !
So, tougher than Argentina then.
Who needs ‘omens’ when Luck is all you need ?
2 Aug 2010, 12:11 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-28:
Martin Johnston was considered both the best leader and best lock, but he’s an awfull coach when it comes to tactics.
2 Aug 2010, 12:13 pm
.
Any talk of RWCs with 1.5 TriNs still to play, an EOYT and June Tests, is simply FOLLY. Ive lost coulnt of how many times Ive read about who “WILL win the RWC”, and that started 12mths ago, funnily enough……
Deal in the here and now. The TriNs remains the toughest tournament to win, it demands respect in its own right. It has 0% bearing on what will happen at a RWC. It never has had.
Lets not forget all the tangible and intangibles that can alter a teams RWC-chances, within a blink, either positively or negatively:-
- Injuries to key players (Genia, Elsom, Pocock/FdP, M.Steyn, V.Matfield/McCaw, DC, Thorn).
- change of coach
- refereeing decisions
- suspensions
- external legal proceedings against players or administration
- unavailability of players (National Union policy, clubs not releasing, religious beliefs)
- economic or political instability (eg Fiji, Romania)
2 Aug 2010, 12:13 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-30: doesnt mean he CANT improve
2 Aug 2010, 12:14 pm
@Jeez(Jeez)-25: The point is that coaches get away with poor performances between WC’s because they are supposedly building a team. Who are the new guys in our team – what is he building? We have an aggregate of over 700 caps in the team – what is there to build?
@Airwell(Airwell)-27: I am afraid the you will be disappointed; even with those stars back in the team. A rugby team is not made by individual performances. Individual performances are the result of a very clear, simple and strong structure. We are losing our structure and no individuals will make us a better team.
2 Aug 2010, 12:14 pm
There is an enormous similarity between the ABs last year and this years Boks, when it comes to missing key players and trying to find replacement combos, so I don’t see too much to worry about.
2 Aug 2010, 12:17 pm
i feel sorry for people who read business day and rely on mark keohane’s so-called nuanced knowledge of rugby for their information on rugby trends, form, tactics , the doos knows nothing!
Before the tri-nations he convinced them that Henry’s ‘Fall Blacks’ were sh*t and playing like ‘headless chickens’! Now all of a sudden these same all blacks have adapted and the bokke have regressed
hehehe
2 Aug 2010, 12:22 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-31: I still maintain that its the pressure of winning the tournament that will get to the AB’s, its like the Proteas, they have everything required to win the CWC every time it comes around, but they battle with the expectation placed on them, that pressure will be multiplied by 1000 in their own backyard, questions left right and center from home media and fans, nowhere to hide, i can see them being sequestered for the duration of the tournament just to give them a break, it is going to be interesting and i still say its between Boks, France and Aus (Maybe not so much aus after this last game)
2 Aug 2010, 12:22 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-37: Hoezit Meisiekind killer!
2 Aug 2010, 12:24 pm
@David(David)-32: so that should automatically apply to JS and VM??
2 Aug 2010, 12:26 pm
@GI POT(GI POT)-35: Then the lack of change should be criticized, not the excuse that the world cup is coming up. Because if you fail with that amount of caps ,before a world cup, it should tell you more about the team and the coaching than the ability to win a upcoming world cup. And as you said, I don’t think there is much excuses, because we aren’t really building towards a world cup…. therefor world cups give teams and coaches the initiative to build and take tests seriously as the biggest test there is to match your efforts against other teams on the international level. And if you try and take chances on the international level, you might pay dearly or you might gain. And that will never change. My point is a world cups should not be the scape goat, but a reason why risks become necessary to be taken to bring forth change.
2 Aug 2010, 12:29 pm
@David(David)-3: @David(David)-5: quite right david, keo is talking kak as always, here henry all black team from last year
All Blacks — 15 Mils Muliaina, 14 Joe
Rokocoko, 13 Conrad Smith, 12 Ma’a Nonu,
11 Sitiveni Sivivatu, 10 Stephen Donald, 9
Jimmy Cowan, 8 Rodney So ’oialo, 7 Richie
McCaw (c), 6 Jerome Kaino, 5 Isaac Ross, 4
Brad Thorn, 3 Owen Franks, 2 Andrew Hore,
1 Tony Woodcock.
Subs: 16 Keven Mealamu, 17 John Afoa, 18
Jason Eaton, 19 Kieran Read, 20 Piri Weepu,
21 Luke McAlister, 22 Cory Jane.
This entry was posted on Saturday, August
1st, 2009 at 4:00 pm and is filed under Live
Reports, Tr
2 Aug 2010, 12:29 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-31: and also, Ireland beat us on EOYT’s when guys are tired, the boks will never fear Ireland in a big tournament like the RWC, they just do not have the ability to beat the big teams. France are more of a worry, but more so for NZ than us i would say.
and in future dont look at who the Boks had to beat to get to the final, rather look at who the AB, France and Aus did NOT beat you cannot take away what the Boks achieved by saying “well look at who didn’t perform well enough to get there”
2 Aug 2010, 12:32 pm
@GI POT(GI POT)-35: Like the ABs missing Macheat and DC tell me about it. It is all about combos maintaining a structure. We lost because of the lack of established combinations. i.e the 3 loosies from last year. The centre combination and the back 3 combination. We also did not have Fans Steyn in the side. Anothe world class player missing. If your loose trio fires the AB’s can do what they want to they cannot play that game plan against us if you have parity at the breakdown. With our 1st choice loose trio IMO we have get more than that.
2 Aug 2010, 12:35 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-38:
“maybe not so much Aus after this LAST game…..”.
Aus still have, approx, 18 Test matches between now and the start of RWC’11. How dumb can y’get ?
and……Cricket & Rugby – 2 completely different team sports !
Safas love making this ‘Proteas-choking’ analogy, as if it has any relevance whatsoever. It doesnt. Firstly the only cricket team that is good enough to ‘choke’ in a cricket match is NOT SA, I hate to tell you. That would be Australia, especially over the period you are referring to. The Proteas had no more than a ‘good chance….better than others’. But the only team anyone else regarded as near-unbeatable was AUSTRALIA.
Keep kidding yourself, on the back of RWC’07 glory, that SA has proven ‘BMT’ (another chest-beating Safa beauty). The only team that proved they had BMT at RWC’07 was England, which they proved that despite awful form and aging players and a loss of confidence in the coach, they STILL got up and beat their 2 main rivals (in ANY sport), Australia and France. Engl got their BECAUSE of their gnarled veterans, not despite-of. SA will discard their veterans at their own peril.
SA ‘proved’ their BMT by beating 2 teams they’ve never lost to in their entire history.
2 Aug 2010, 12:38 pm
@Transformation(Transformation)-42:
Thanks for that info, Trannie.
2 Aug 2010, 12:39 pm
@Mighty Horua(Mighty Horua)-39: hoezit mighty!
2 Aug 2010, 12:40 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-43:
“when the Boks are tired”.
You mean, “after theyve lost” ?
The Boks played 2-3 LESS Tests on EOYT than either NZ or Aus.
as for “France are more of a worry, but more so for NZ than us i would say.”. NZ cant meet France, again, until the Final. Which would mean others, um, not qualifying by that stage.
2 Aug 2010, 12:43 pm
@David(David)-36:
True that! Rugby changes year after year, wich is why coaches should be given a chance to make necessary changes twiks. Last year it was henry and this year it PDV. The point of peaking too early must be playing on ABs psyche. If we end the year strong then I will be in a happy place because come next year the opposition will have little to work with in planning against us. Right now the way the ABs are so strong , we have all the time in the world to work a game plan against them. If we play well enough at home then it would be better than not running into broblems having a false sense of invincibility closer to to WC. To think that we have only lost 3 in Aus and NZ (The most difficult opposition in the world) and we are acting as if the world is coming to an end.
2 Aug 2010, 12:47 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-45: As much as you would like to rant and try and dismiss my analogy, you know as well as i do that the AB’s are mentally fragile come RWC time, please show me where i am wrong in this observation, the guys had filter into the country one by one and they were offered counselling afterwards, some guys still find themselves in tears years afterwards because of their failure, it all shows the mental weakness which will be amplified playing in front of a seething home crowd poking at ANY apparent deficiency in their AB team
2 Aug 2010, 12:48 pm
The Bok game plan is OK, its the personnel that make the difference.
last year saw dominance over the ABs and Australia primairly because of one factor – a properly balanced back-row.
The Bulls have Potgieter, Stegmann and Spies, the Stormers Vermuelen, Burger and Louw.
Each successful loose trio has a dedicated fetcher, big bruising No7 (No 6 for the Antipodeans) and dynamic No8.
The Boks had Louw who was ordinary in a Test against McCaw. Last year McCaw was outplayed by Brussouw and the Boks started, for the first time since 1906, to be able compete on the ground.
All this years 3N tests have seen the Boks dominated on the ground. The reasons is obvious – no fetcher. A fetcher on the ground, No7 cleaning out over him and No8 playing the ranging game.
(Louw must be given another chance with his front 5 performing, which didn’t happen against the ABs.)
That’s why we see Spies in all his show pony glory in the S14 and 3N last year but not now. The breakdown is treated with contempt by the Boks and it hurts us every time.
What the heck Kankowski was doing as a No7 with Burger in the No6 jersey is beyond me. Stupid selections. Burger should be in the No7 jersey and a genuine fetcher in the No6. Burger has to move to No7 and compete with Juan Smith. At the moment (injured I know) but Stegmann has to be given a chance. He’s fast, clever and low to the ground like Brussouw.
The inability of the coaching staff to comprehend the value of a fetcher is ridiculous. Same reason why JW should never see a Bok coaching role again until he’s really learnt how valuable McCaw, Brussouw or Pocock are.
The loose forward balance is critical. JW never had it and could never take the Boks to the next level with his philosophy. Lets not underestimate what a fortunate draw we had in the RWC 2007. A **** England, Argentina, Tonga and Fiji woooooooo. The 2006 and 3N2007 seasons were indicative of his value as a coach (consistently out-coached after 2004). Hoskins is right on the money with not bringing him back because he will add no value.
PDivvy had it last year but perhaps he’s failed to understand the issue – very bad then. Very bad. Gary Gold must also answer why he cannot appreciate the balance of a backrow.
Small margins make a huge difference in scoreline at Test level. No authority on the ground = fast ball opponents x slow ball Boks = lose every time.
No chance the backline can get into gear and no chance the game plan can be implemented.
Game plan is sound, personnel choice is lacking substantially.
2 Aug 2010, 12:48 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-48: Have to agree with you SA rugby can sometimes be very inconsistent but generally when it counts like in a World Cup we seem to man up and do well. But to right off any of the AB, bokke or wannabies chances in the WC will be stupid. But saying that you guys do choke when it really counts so I hope for your sakes it does not happen again. If everything goes according to plan when will the Bokke and the AB’s meet in the WC?
2 Aug 2010, 12:49 pm
This is my first post here. I have been reading this blog regularly for over a year and have been dissapointed with the garbage some of you throw around. But every now and then a great article, like this one, revives my belief in the REAL spirit that exists between the Tri Nations supporters.
I believe the majority of supporters respect and at times are in awe of the opposition. I am a Kiwi and can tell you the way SA played last year was incredible. It was different to the way the game is played down here, but that did not make it unattractive. It was precise, fearsome and unstopable. It was even graceful. Nobody wants to watch SA try to play like Aus or the AB’s.
We have the best rugby tournament ever to be played showcasing different styles that all can be effective on their day.
Thank you Keo for reminding people that these tests are not merely training outings in preparation for a knockout tournament that has little relevance outside a WC year. I know if a Kiwi wrote this it would be laughed at, but because SA are the current WC holders only a South African could write this.
I love these games. They ARE the best. The moaners who want SA to leave and play with the NH inferior sides have become so one eyed that they have lost perspective. You only get better by playing against the best. You are watching the best rugby competition in the world.
Brad Thorn said he would rather play in the Tri Nations than the World Cup (or something like that). I’m with him. Bring it on.
2 Aug 2010, 12:56 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-50:
Just love the way you want proof on the 1 hand of supposed ‘mental fragility’ and then state “players were in tears years later” as if fact. Oh yes, the whole country ‘went in to mourning’. The last time I read that here, was also a Keo article. 1 week before the TriN started. Guess how that one ended up…..
Show me where a ratio of 1 Bok victory to every 3 ABs (post-isolation) says a Safa can point the choking-finger at a Kiwi ?
You have 2 options. 1. that the Boks choke 70% of time they meet their main rival or 2. the ABs are better.
Even youre smart enough to figure that one out.
Its around about now after a few losses and the TriN gone that SA fans here start talking about the RWC and only the RWC. All this on the back of a mere advantage of ONE over NZ. I wonder why we dont here that prior to SA vs Aus matches….
2 Aug 2010, 12:58 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-52:
see post at 31
SA seeded to meet NZ or France in SemiF at RWC’11
2 Aug 2010, 12:58 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-50: AB supporters are different to SA ones, we have pride in our team regardless…
the way you guys sharpen knives is incredible… note most of the kiwis still backed their team after last years 3 losses?
2 Aug 2010, 13:01 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-51: Have to agree re loose trios. Just think we in SA support our provincial teams players to be in the Bok side instead of looking at combinations. If you play Burger and Flo together then you cannot play Spies in the team. Rather play Potgieter with them that would be a better baqlanced combo. Still think that nobody is better than the Spies, Juan and Ratel combo.
2 Aug 2010, 13:05 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-54: i have read of players saying they were mentally finished and distraught, when i find those articles again i will forward them on to you.
and as much as you kiwi’s bleat on about this percentage and that percentage of wins against this team and that team, the bottom line is it kills you guys that for all the domination you guys have in world rugby you do not fair well in the RWC, that trophy burns a hole in the collective NZ psyche and the only way you can deflect from it is to say “that doesn’t really count for much”, FFS!!!! the NZRU is willing to go into a major financial loss to host the damn tournament just so they have home ground advantage so they might stand a better chance of getting the trophy, so you trying to minimise the RWC’s value to NZ is laughable son.
2 Aug 2010, 13:06 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-56: pops, we are still backing the boks even though the boks have a poorer record vs the ab’s since 2000 or so.
2 Aug 2010, 13:06 pm
Good article I just would like to point out that “The All Blacks a year ago were awful” by their own highest standards and not by common standards.
After all, they were beaten only by then far superior South African side who looked like their best in a decade (0-3 was rather fair reflection of difference that year) and once by France. Ok, Barbarians, too, got their slice, good on them.
That’s it. The remaining top 3 team Australia were beaten 4 times – home, away and on neutral ground, all NH sides were comfortably beaten in their own backyard and France especially tasted the The Blacklash in the end – emphatical KO.
If that was awful ABs side, heaven help the opposition when mediocre comes onto the pitch.
2 Aug 2010, 13:07 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-56: Agree we as Bokke supporters should allways stand with our team. Allthough possibly living in a much more open enviroment like SA as compared to Aus and NZ which lets face it are close to police states we tend to be more passionate about our team when it sucks like it has in the last three games and tend to verbalize these frustrations more openly then you guys do.
2 Aug 2010, 13:07 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-56: Poppa, shhhhh, you talking out your @55 as usual, your unfounded generalizations are boring and predictable
2 Aug 2010, 13:08 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-57:
Spies, Smith, Brussouw is definitely the ideal combo.
Potgieter is similar to Burger so I’d play Stegmann on the openside as a Spies/Burger/Stegmann combo.
Last year, for the first time ever we competed on the ground and we were unstoppable. Do that again and the Boks, using this gamplane, will beat the ABs more often than not.
But we’d rather play Burger and whine about McCaw than select a player to compete directly against him!
Ridiculous isn’t it?
2 Aug 2010, 13:10 pm
NZ’s annus horribilus in 2009 saw three defeats to SA, by losing margins of 9, 11 and 3.
2 Aug 2010, 13:11 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-61: What sort of police state sends all of its frontline police out unarmed?
2 Aug 2010, 13:11 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-63: Agree with that Combo or possibly Spies, Flo and Juan combo could also work. I think Flo is a better fetcher than alot of people think he just needs to be in the right combination.
2 Aug 2010, 13:12 pm
@Gooch(Gooch)-53: Welcome Gooch and well said, wish you many happy blogs here on Keo
2 Aug 2010, 13:13 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-65: One where people tend to be very inwardly focused and have the highest teen suicide rate in the world.
2 Aug 2010, 13:14 pm
@Gooch(Gooch)-53: Welcome and great post.
2 Aug 2010, 13:15 pm
Uhm KEO…the AB’s played against 14 men, at home, against a side that hasn’t beaten them in 8 outings…they also played a poor, jaded, Bok team and had the advantage of playing against 14 men in both games.
They also have 90% of the 50/50 calls go their way while their captain in particular and the rest of their loosies practically got away with murder at the breakdowns (Hey, Richie said it, not me). Now if they hadn’t won thhose games, then surely they could not call themselves the number 1team in the world ^^
I still think its all hot air…This is not a good AB team. They have simply been allowed to play this way by poor refereeing decisions and piss poor Bok team. The Wallabies deserved their two yellows though…
2 Aug 2010, 13:15 pm
Keo, kak article.
“Instead, in this professional age that rewards the mediocre, sensational wins are mocked and embarrassing defeats are cherished as good things because it is not a World Cup year.”
Who is cherishing our losses at this moment? Also YOU have been NZs biggest critic in the last couple of years. Also you’ve told us time and again to watch the Aussies, but the reality IS they aren’t capable of beating the All Blacks, that’s why nobody listens to your rants.
BTW if you believe that running the ball out of your 22 is the right way to go about test rugby, well then maybe you should stick to S14. I don’t want to see 4 trys and the contest over by halftime. Also these tactics aren’t exactly good for winning the WC. I mean finals are generally free-running try fests, aren’t they? I believe this is not the best thing for the NZ team right now. The are gaining confidence in a game-plan that is exposable in the WC.
2 Aug 2010, 13:16 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-56:
Come off it Poppa. You guys back the ABs as a concept rather than a team. If they lose then they’re not a genuine AB side.
2 Aug 2010, 13:17 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-68: dont see the relevance in that chirp, hasn’t got anything to do with rugby and will see this thread go for a ball of 5h!t now
2 Aug 2010, 13:17 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-62: ahhhh old man, give it a rest… your clinging to that extra WC win as though it was all life had to offer…
the ABs were robbed of the opportunity in 07, plain and simple.. the fact you cant acknowledge that speaks volumes..
2 Aug 2010, 13:19 pm
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-64: When last did an All Black side actually WIN a close game?
2 Aug 2010, 13:21 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-58:
Where and who said the “RWC doesnt count for much” ?!
But Im not stupid enough to, conveniently, suddenly, say that its the ‘only trophy that counts’ either.
Are you ?
2 Aug 2010, 13:21 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-74: I told you, i do not blame refs and dont accept it when others do it, forward passes, knockons, hands in, foul play etc are part of any rugby game, yes ANY rugby game, and sometimes they are picked up and sometimes they are not, the AB’s have won games where they have had calls against them as have most other teams so to blame that game on one call, glaringly obvious or not, is a stretch and discredits the AB team.
2 Aug 2010, 13:24 pm
Keo did you ever played rugby? What position? Keo do you think you can Tackle a flying Rococoko from infront?
2 Aug 2010, 13:25 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-77: one call? bwahahaha and therein lies the problem…
you think it revolves around one call? ridiculous…. and shows the bias..
2 Aug 2010, 13:26 pm
@Mighty Horua(Mighty Horua)-78:
Of course he’s played rugby. He’s got a Playstation at home.
2 Aug 2010, 13:26 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-71: Well said Mnr, the guys say the AB are peaking before the RWC, as you say i see them gaining belief in a pattern they THINK might win them the WC where as we are figuring out ways how not to lose the RWC.
2 Aug 2010, 13:26 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-61: What a very strange statement to make re ‘police state’. Have you any sort of credible arguemnt for that comment, or is it just the first insult that came into your mind??
2 Aug 2010, 13:27 pm
@Mighty Horua(Mighty Horua)-78:
He was a police detective once, though – does that count?
2 Aug 2010, 13:28 pm
@Airwell(Airwell)-66: Flouw felt the effects of his front 5 being dominated. He needs another opportunity though.
I still think Stegmann should have been on tour as his back-up. Trying to turn Kankowski into a No7 was just plain stupid against 2 fetching loosies. No surprises we got no ball to work with.
2 Aug 2010, 13:28 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-75: 22nd August 2009. 19-18 vs Australia last year,
Unfortunately, since then there has not been a single Test game to be called as “close one” (apart from close loss in Hamilton to the Boks and maybe – just maybe – 19-6 win at Twickers vs England).
The ABs fault entirely.
2 Aug 2010, 13:29 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-79: oh poppa, we have documented proof that the AB captain says he egts away with murder on the field, he has been pinged more times than any player in this tournament and has yet to get a yellow (5 times in one match says it all), but i still dont use that as a reason why we lost to you guys so dont try and justify your loss to france in the same manner, all THAT shows is your ignorance
2 Aug 2010, 13:32 pm
The ABs are not special right now.
The Boks have been woeful and the Aussies had one big game in them against us.
The Boks need proper selections and this myth of the ABs being awesome will be seriously challenged.
Also, had McCaw been carded the result could have been very different with a Bok win a possibility. The ref did influence the game and so be it but lets not over-estimate this AB side. They are not the class of 2005/2006.
2 Aug 2010, 13:33 pm
Peaking for sure!
2 Aug 2010, 13:33 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-86: documented proof? by saying he makes mistakes ON the rugby field? lol cmon mac, thought you were better then that..
.
2 Aug 2010, 13:33 pm
@David(David)-80: Scoring tries at free will!
2 Aug 2010, 13:35 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-89: if you believe that then your really are dumb
2 Aug 2010, 13:35 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-87: sure, theyve only beaten the team from SA by 8 tries to 2 in 2 games recently… they must be poor..
2 Aug 2010, 13:37 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-91: if you read anything more into it then you are dumb… all opensiders can be called cheats mac
surely you know this? Brussouw was just as guilty.. but keep telling yourself otherwise, hope it helps the hurt..
2 Aug 2010, 13:38 pm
@WP Till I Die(WP-Forever)-83: Detective? Like the e-tv “Cheaters” detectives? So he was the one that got hold of Pdivvies s.ex tape.
2 Aug 2010, 13:40 pm
this is Saurez McCaw’s quote “I made a few mistakes. I think the important thing is to know what you will get away with. But I undoubtedly made mistakes,”
this part is what makes him culpable “important thing is to know what you will get away” it shows that he is trying to get away with stuff instead of playing a fair game, but this is the way NZ has played for years and will always be the case, the Boks will forever be dirty and the AB’s will always be cheats so shuddup, deal with it and enjoy the rugga.
2 Aug 2010, 13:42 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-93: you cant call competeing for the ball and lying on the offside the same thing???? there was a clip of Saurez McCaw shadowing an Aus defender in the offside postion pushing the defender wider and wider giving his attacking player time on the ball, blatant, but he got away with it so good on him
2 Aug 2010, 13:45 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-93:
Richie doesn’t cheat…”he is so fast it only looks like he is lying all over the ball and slowing it down illegally”…it’s an optical illusion I tell you (once again, not my words….)
2 Aug 2010, 13:45 pm
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-95: Here is a straight rugby question. On You Tube there is a SA guy pretending to be a rugby analyst who has assembled a ‘cheat list’ video on one of the Ab vs SA games. At about 5.35min into the video he shows McCaws last 2 penalties, including where all the SA fans say he should have been carded. Look at the video and tell us why McCaw was penalised in each case?
2 Aug 2010, 13:46 pm
@Nils(Nils)-85: Well in the last couple of years, we win the close ones against you guys. So you better hope its not close come the WC.
2 Aug 2010, 13:47 pm
Hi Keo
You were always a guy that called a spade a spade and sometimes you piss@d me off. Recently your post has been very intriging.
There are so many theories why the boks are playing so badly, but no one ever realised that the All Blacks have improved tremendiously.They are playing awesome rugby and are using the New Law Interpretations(NLI)cleverly.
Below is a topic I wrote two weeks ago but never had it published. I would love to have you honest opinion.
THE REAL REASON WHY THE SPRINGBOKS ARE NOT WINNING
Every newspaper I read about the disastrous Australasian leg of the Tri-nations rugby matches by the Springboks, are still carping about the injustices done to the Springboks by the referees and game officials down under. Let’s be brutally honest to ourselves that even if the referee’s calls went the other way, the Springboks would still not have won these games. I truly believe that the new laws and rules in rugby have changed the game more to the advantage of the attacking side than to the defensive side. We all know the strengths of Springbok rugby are kick, chase and play the game in the opposition half. In this manner the Springboks were more than willing to give the ball to the opposition as their near perfect defensive pattern would allow them to squeeze the life out of the opposition in a controlled manner and in this way they would force the errors on the opposition. The Springboks were virtually guaranteed penalties in this manner and the rest was history.
The lawmakers in rugby felt that since the 2007 rugby world cup final, rugby has become boring and they needed to tinker with the laws in order to it make a spectacle. We all can remember how they introduced the Experimental Law Variations (ELVs) in 2008. Instead of making rugby more of a spectacle, the ELVs made it more of a helter-skelter game when some teams tried to run the ball from anywhere on the field. The Springboks stuck to their perfect kicking pattern as running against the well constructed defensive line of the Springboks became virtually suicidal. Other teams had no option but to copy the hugely successful Springbok game plan. This resulted into more kicking in the game with no team taking the risk of running the ball in their own half. The end result was a less free-flowing game, lack of initiative to counter-attack and the ball was much lesser in play. This game pattern suited the Springboks perfectly and we all know the successful season the Springboks had in 2009.
Then the rugby law makers decided to abolish some of the ELVs and in order to allow less kicking, more counter-attacking, fewer penalties, allow the ball in play longer and a more free-flowing game, the New Law Interpretations (NLI) was introduced. Interestingly, as a member of SANZAR, SARU was involved in the implementation of the NLI laws introduced in the Super 14 this year. This is the reason why the Stormers has done so well in the Super 14 this year and the Bulls have always been a side that can play more than one game plan mainly due to the fact they have one man who can read and dictate a game from a crucial position of scrumhalf, which happens to be the link between forwards and backs.
Here are three of the NLIs that I feel the Springboks were slow to adapt to, which is understandable as nobody fiddles with a winning combination:
1. Tackle Ball: The tackler, once hitting the ground in the tackle, must release the ball and the ball carrier. This gives the ball carrier a chance to “play the ball”. This according to the lawmakers will tidy up the tackle-ball area which has previously been weighted towards the tackler. As well, any player involved in helping make the tackle, who is in contact with the ball carrier when he is taken to ground, must then release the ball, before then attempting to contest possession, even if he is on his feet. After this tackle, any player then on his feet, in a position of strength (his side of the tackle) may then contest possession.
The important part here is that the tackle-ball area previously (prior 2010 rugby season) weighted heavily towards the tackler. The tackler was allowed to remain in contact with the ball and ball-carrier after he leaves his feet and stayed on the ball and jumped up and ripped it away. This gave the ball carrier no rights as he could not do anything with the ball and the tackler inevitability gets the penalty. The tackler was allowed to get the ball carrier to the ground and turn him in order for his team to compete the ball on the ground. We know how good a certain Springbok flanker, Heinrich Brussouw was at this last year.
The NLIs does not allow this at all as the tackler must release everything when he goes to ground and not hold on as he gets to his feet.
Here the Springboks found it very difficult to adapt. The Australasian teams were prepared to run at the Springboks in their own quarter as they were willing to chance their arms because they’ve got a much better chance of retaining possession with the NLIs. With all Springboks making the initial tackles, the Australasian teams moved the ball wide at speed and the big and heavy Springboks could not adapt to the pace of the game. A faster impact will always prevail over a slower collision.
With the NLIs allowing more ball in play the Springboks looked tired and off the pace of the game.
The Springboks had every right to complain how the referee policed the tackle ball area in their part of the game, however, their attacks were very telepathic usually via the number one channel and the Australasian teams committed more players to the breakdown as they knew where the Springboks were going to attack. The first Australasian tackler would then stay on the “right side” but do not attack the ball, but stayed strongly over it, exposing it for the next player arriving to have a crack at it, or even blow over. Believe it or not, the NLI allow this and the Australasian teams did their homework hence the referee’s doubt prompted him not to give Richie McCaw (All Black) or David Pocock (Australia) a yellow card for breakdown offences. So the Springbok complains will fall on deaf ears and they will just have to adapt.
2. Players in front of the kicker: Players will be forced to comply with standing still or retiring in relation to being in front of the kicker. This will see referees calling for a player to stop advancing – if he continues to advance, he will be penalized and the players must retire from within 10 meters of the receiver of a kick – otherwise an immediate penalty will be given where these players look to contest the kick.
According to the law-makers, the objective of this is that this will improve the time and space for players to counter attack, when receiving kicks in general play, and reducing some aerial ping pong seeing in rugby ensuring the team receiving the kick have room to counter attack.
We all know that the “Gary Owen” kick was one of the Springbok strengths. They punished the opposition with these perfect kicks which gave them at least 50% chance of gaining possession of the ball. The Springbok scrumhalf, Fourie Du Preez is a master at it and we know the All Blacks in the past just could not handle it.
In the past, this law was never applied correctly as a player was allowed to make forward headway as long as he was outside the 10 meter radius of the receiver.
Also the Springbok fly-half Morne Steyn stands too deep when making the “Gary Owen” kick and with all his fellow players only allowed to advance from behind him after he made the kick, rendered the kick virtually ineffectual and the Australasian teams could counter-attack from it. We all know Rickie January and Ruan Pienaar are not as good as Fourie Du Preez when it comes to kicking from the base of the scrum, however, Fourie Du Preez’s return will give the Springboks a better kicking option and make it a more 50-50 contest and of course it will not be done from deep.
3. Formation of the maul: At the time the maul is formed, players supporting the ball carrier will not be allowed to obstruct the opposition. This is intended to at least make the maul defendable at the setup stage.
Here the Australasian teams did their homework well as they attacked the Springbok maul before it could really start. They seldom contested the lineout of the Springboks which gave them more time to counter the launch of the Springbok maul and made it ineffective.
With the new laws changing the game since the Springboks won the world-cup in 2007, the Springboks have been slow to adapt. All the Springbok strengths have been neutralized by the laws since, with the lawmakers claiming the “anecdotal evidence tells you it’s getting better all the time”. The mere fact that SARU has a representative on this law making committee indicate that the Springboks will have no option but to adapt as there will be no reprieve. This is also understandable of the law makers as they want to make the game more global by making it more “attractive”.
My concern is if the current bunch of Springboks really has the ability to adapt after so long being in the forefront when the laws of the game still worked for them. It will be insane to try and stick to a pattern where the rules no more exist and then complain that it is not applied correctly by the referees. Since the 2007 world-cup all the test playing nations have made huge changes in their playing personnel according to the laws of the game. Some players have moved up the pecking order and others down. The Springbok team has virtually remained the same and it is difficult to teach an old horse new tricks.
Believe me this is a reality the Springbok management will have to urgently address, but then again with so much newspaper reporters quibbling on who should and is running the Springbok team, it might be more difficult than it looks. So sad it might just be too late!
2 Aug 2010, 13:50 pm
@poppa69(poppa69)-92: They aren’t poor, but they aren’t awesome either.
This side is very beatable though. If I was an AB man I wouldn’t get too carried away.
2 Aug 2010, 13:52 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-99: Right. And when lose – then with a bang usually.
2 Aug 2010, 13:52 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-101: Whose getting carried away? Im on this blog as saying that the WC is still over a year away, and that there is still a lot of rugby to be played this year, let alone next year… funny you werent here about a month go, youd have seen carried away..
2 Aug 2010, 13:58 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-101: Of course, we know that each and every top team is capable of beating the other top team. Nobody is invincible. Definitely not those ABs either.
Just at this very point – mid 2010 – others look much poorer comparing to them. It certainly can change in the future, others can (should) raise their game. Until then, ABs are different league.
2 Aug 2010, 13:58 pm
@Momentum(Momentum)-100: I’m afraid I for one don’t agree with your analysis at all, although I am sure many would.
2 Aug 2010, 14:06 pm
@Nils(Nils)-104: They are at the height of their powers in mid-2010? That sounds like peaking to me.
2 Aug 2010, 14:07 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-105:
Just an opinion, as long as we are not in denial. we should make all options part of the solution. i trust you understand.
2 Aug 2010, 14:20 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-106: By saying “height of their powers” you imply they cannot play any better and the only way is down from now on.
Time will tell. The only thing I see, they play better than last year while Wallabies look the same nothing too special and Boks have gone down with a thud.
I do not see any reason why (with a good management policy) ABs cannot play well until the end of next WC and do the business treating each and every play-off game as of ultimate importance.
2 Aug 2010, 14:22 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-106: Meanwhile I am sure South Africa and Australia will (should) be better come next year. They both along with the same usual suspects from the north (plus Argentina) deserve utmost respect when the WC comes.
2 Aug 2010, 14:26 pm
@Momentum(Momentum)-107: For sure.
2 Aug 2010, 14:30 pm
The All Blacks were absolutely awesome in their last 3 games and Saturday against the Aussies were just the cherry on top. McCaw, Carter, Mils, Cory Jane, and the tight five were awesome. Nonu is scary. Their only relative weakness, if you can call it that, is No 9. My only gripe is, what the hell is the Weepu side-show with the Haka all about. It makes the trade mark of AB rugby look like a joke!
2 Aug 2010, 14:35 pm
It will always be like that , some coaches don’t have respect for some players. The player can be how good but if a coach don’t like a player he will not play for him. It’s a pitty our springbok coach is doing the same thing that other coaches did infront of him. Leaving a good player/ players out because he don’t believe in the player. How stupid can that be ? How many good players we have out there that don’t get game time. I been reading the news papers and on the internet this weekend that some players realy deserves to get a place in the bok team. I think it’s time to gamble for the last couple of matches in this years N3. Give the younger guys some ekstra game time. Let them go out there and play the game so that we can see how it goes. What do we have to lose ? Let the older guys have a break from rugby and get them ready for next year.
2 Aug 2010, 14:37 pm
Keo’s opinions seem to change week on week. Personally whilst they’ve been doing the business well, I don’t think NZ have played a good team yet in 2010.
2 Aug 2010, 14:43 pm
@Nils(Nils)-108: Well, you’ve got to keep it in context. SA have lost 3 games away, 2 in NZ and 1 in Brisbane. Hardly easy places for us to play. Not often do we win there, then consider poor discipline cost us a man for 10 minutes in the start of every game and on 2 occasions (2nd NZ test and Aus test), NZ and Aus should have had yellow cards at equally crucial times of the test match.
I believe NZ played their best rugby in Eden Park. I don’t believe they are capable of better, but then even an inferior performance may be enough to win the WC.
2 Aug 2010, 14:44 pm
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-113: even the maori didnt face a decent team either
2 Aug 2010, 14:45 pm
@Beast(Beast)-111:
That “sideshow” happens to be a culture, and no culture in this world is a joke as you believe. We should be more tolarant in diversity. I wonder what you would have said if you saw Buck Shelford do the Haka. To them it is a Moari War Dance
2 Aug 2010, 14:51 pm
@Beast(Beast)-111: Please do not disrespect other’s culture.
2 Aug 2010, 15:00 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-114: As I said, time will tell. Sofar I am reasonably satisfied that ABs have upped their game comparing to last year. Not a complete side (but who is, anyway?) but more confident than last 3N.
I agree that ABs are being made better than they probably are by visibly poorer (comparing to last year) Boks and surprisingly shaky Australia. When they both will fire from all cylinders, we’ll get clearer picture.
2 Aug 2010, 15:08 pm
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-113:
True, and nor have we felt the brunt of the refs like our opposition.
Stoked we are back on top but feet firmly on the ground in heartland New Zealand. We’ve had too many disapointments to not take it seriously. Would like to see a team put us under big pressure in the last ten minutes of a game, we seem to have won well by then = thats obviosly the aim but we all know it will come down to the wire next year…
Surely thou with home a home advantage we would have to be clear favorites wouldnt you say?
Hows England going at the moment? Do they play a game to match us?
2 Aug 2010, 15:11 pm
@Beast(Beast)-111: When all us kiwis see Piri we brim with pride! He’s mean! Does it how a good Ngai Tahu boy should! You should come and watch our Kapa Haka competitions over hear, make the hair stand up on the back of your neck oi
2 Aug 2010, 15:20 pm
@NZMaori(NZMaori)-120:
Yeah Mate
I have just seen some traditional Haka’s on documenteries. It must be awesome to see it in real life. (not including the two traditional All Black Haka,s).
2 Aug 2010, 15:31 pm
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-106: These AB’s are by no means at the height of their powers, but they have found a tight 5 that bullied ours twice. They will only get better and there are some really hungry players waiting in the wings.
However, there is a very fine line between being ordinary and being brilliant. If I recall, we were dominating them until Bakkies received his yellow card in the 1st match. From then on we were on the back foot and they gained momentum.
I do not agree with the assessment that certain individuals, by their mere presence, will make our team better. Ratel needs to prove that he can be as effective as last year under the NLI’s, because not one other fetcher in world rugby has managed to do that.
Frans Steyn will have to prove that he is fit and fast because his primary function will be to attack at pace from the back – secondary will be his big boot.
FDP is class personified, but he will have to prove that he can make a difference with an overweight and unfit captain calling the shots. I understand that Fourie is not one to take kindly to mediocrity and that is what makes him so brilliant.
Juan Smith needs a platform from which to launch his devastating ball carries. I still reckon is the best no 8 that we have in the country. His vision is only rivaled by Schalk. I will have those two and Brussouw/Flo to accompany them. Potgieter waiting in the wings.
All of this is mere speculation because we need to find coaches that can stand up for themselves and take the team forward. We don’t have that at the moment, but as I said, it is a small margin that will get us back to the top.
2 Aug 2010, 15:36 pm
Mils Muliaina is quite simply the best attacking fullback since Cullen.
His running lines,timing of runs,entering line from multiple position of attack creating space/momentum etc he sumthin to behold.And is great finisher to boot.
Class.
2 Aug 2010, 15:37 pm
@NZMaori(NZMaori)-119: With a full team out at home I think we can match NZ, away probably not, the team isn’t quite at the stage of development where they can beat NZ/SA away. There are issues in some positions such as the centres, particularly 12, and loosehead cover (no back-up for Sheridan) but some exciting new blood coming through in the engine room (Lawes/Attwood) and at 9 with Ben Youngs. Will hopefully blend nicely by World Cup time.
I think NZ’s first really big test this year will be SA away, the latter will be up for it. Performance in that game will tell AB fans far more about their team than the games so far.
2 Aug 2010, 15:40 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-123: Plus he outsprinted that Morne “Isuzu KB250″ Steyn
2 Aug 2010, 15:42 pm
The 1998 nightmare run for NZ was hardly a nightmare, back then both the Boks and Aus were in outstanding form why is it when the All Blacks lose they have to claim its becuase they are playing poorly, i watched the 24-23 win against the Blacks in the Tri Nations on youtube the other day and the hunger and ferocity of the Boks back then was unbelievable even at 23-5 down you knew they had it in them to win it, can the same be said of the current Boks?
2 Aug 2010, 15:59 pm
@Mighty Horua(Mighty Horua)-125:
Yeah…He did a number on the Aussies this weekend…Smoked the likes of O’Connor,Ashley-Cooper etc a double try tally,scored more tries vs OZ than any other side(Mils)
2 Aug 2010, 16:17 pm
wrong Keohane, the world cup is all that matters. Test matches are just that, testing for the real thing … and that is to win the RWC.
2 Aug 2010, 16:31 pm
@Beast(Beast)-111: …Weepu is of Maori descent and went to an Anglican Maori Boarding school (Te Aute College) for 4 years or so,so he knows a bit about how to lead a haka…
2 Aug 2010, 16:33 pm
Bring back tours!
The Rugby World Cup is a once-every-four-years sweetener. But real rugby dominance is built by winning, and winning consistently!
I would love to see the old two-month rugby tours returning. Sadly, the professional era has destroyed that.
2 Aug 2010, 17:30 pm
Yip fairplay they currently look the bees knees, but I will be interested in our home game against them particularly if bismarck and beasty in swquad, add in bakkies, brussow, frans, fdp, JP and houggard – and I still the Boks van take them in NZ at full strength
2 Aug 2010, 18:07 pm
@cab(cab)-131: agree cab, I think the Boks should keep faith with their experienced players until guys like Brussow, Bismarck, Botha, JPP etc return to fill in the gaps again. Throwing out the baby with the bathwater isn’t a good course of action.
2 Aug 2010, 18:37 pm
SA Rugby president Oregan Hoskins has labelled Sanzar’s imminent disciplinary hearing related to comments made by Springbok coach Peter de Villiers as “a declaration of war by Australia and New Zealand against South Africa”.
2 Aug 2010, 19:17 pm
Keo I think you’ve missed the boat on this. Yes the all blacks have been brilliant and well done to them. Unfortunately what they and you don’t get is that the world cup is not normal test match rugby. Come q’s, semis and the final you just don’t have many first tackles missed. It just doesn’t happen. The prob for the abs is there game plan doesn’t work at wc’s as amazing as it is to watch during the normal test season. If the boks have brussow, fdp and a reliable kicker like M steyn, I would put my money on sa going all the way again
2 Aug 2010, 19:38 pm
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-51:
They want “big, strong players that can dominate that collions the hardest- that the type of player we looking for…” -PdV.
WETF that’s supposed to mean.
They would prefer our boys to tackle opponents back and get them grounded on the wrong side, or for pure “stopping power”- in their minds. Seriously, the smallest of forwards can do all of this. but it aint just any forward that can execute proper technique in the battle of the BD.
So let’s say your colossus overpowers a fatty and forces an extra movement for placement or to lose his grip on the ball- who’s gonna come in and glean??? That’s where Brussow and Stegmann and to an extent Louw are masters of their trade.
They know when to attempt a pilfer in the first place (if you attempt everything, you’ll spend 15% extra of the game on the ground and useless in other areas); how to position their bodies; where to plant their feet; how to restrict their opposite cleaners’ hands; when to bite down with their heads; when to let go; when to pin the ball for a penalty.
There are only 3 players in SA that are really respectable in those departments. Shame, all that depth in SA’s loosies.
This is largely a fault of coaching I believe, and if the national coaches can’t even get it right…
2 Aug 2010, 20:12 pm
Keo is such a buzzkill. I bet he was the kid that tattled on the kids that smoked cigarettes during school.
2 Aug 2010, 20:16 pm
Rubbish ariticle.
This All Black team doesn’t scare the Boks. The Boks are playing kak, and they know it.
The All Black team of 1996,1999,,2005/6, now they scared me. The Boks played some dam good rugga then and still got thumped.
2 Aug 2010, 20:17 pm
And yes, the RWC does matter, to everyone who has actually won it in the past 20 years.
2 Aug 2010, 20:24 pm
Mark, for I change I find your article worth reading.For the sake of the game we love so much .Credit must be given to the All Blacks.
2 Aug 2010, 20:40 pm
Agree, this highfalutin euphoric melodrama about a once in a foggy blue moon lucky packet roller coaster Russian roulette gimme World cup tinsel town fandango bonanza compared to a consistently comprehensive winning percentage in the tri nations, only idiots can compare.
A World cup sing song romance is actually a pathetically illusory feather in your cap, means little in comparison to being consistently top of the heap.
In September 2007 SA were lying 4th on IRB rankings and one month later after beating Samoa, USA, Tonga, Fiji, Argentina, and England they emerged as No.1 till the tri nations 7 months later where they rescinded the throne once again to the consistent champions of rugby union.
Idiots should get it straight once and for all, World upperty cups are for lucky packet day dreamers, tri nations supremo’s are for realists with real rugby blood flowing through their veins.
2 Aug 2010, 20:41 pm
@CenturionShark (aka LondonShark)(londonshark)-138: Hahaahahah!! Agreed.
2 Aug 2010, 21:00 pm
@skopskiet(yliad)-140: Who let this Aussie in here???? Leave us alone……..
2 Aug 2010, 21:04 pm
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-142: dumb schmuck fool with your dumb schmuck neck deep in the quicksands of your euphoric melodramatic delusions.. catch a wake up poor idiot before its too late.
2 Aug 2010, 21:14 pm
@skopskiet(yliad)-143: Sorry I don’t speak Aussie………”Wakabongalonga shrimp on the barby” is all I know Mr Aussie.
2 Aug 2010, 21:42 pm
@skopskiet(yliad)-140: Yet another stormersader type. A kiwiboetie ab worshipper – the men in black can do know wrong – with a silverfern up your butt.
Kickshot, you keep beating the same drum and singing the same admittedly colourful but predictable kiwi tokoloshe loving song…
Everything in green and gold is evil and everything in black is good. The ezee fella is right – you sound like duplicitous antipodean…
Why dont you just support the abs or Wallabies – save you a lot of angst and spare the fainthearted many slurs. Hold that thought, yes you are an ab supporter/bok hater – why don’t you rechristen yourself poppa soixant-neuf or black panter…
Kickshot, pricksnot – the kiwis will welcome you with open arms – you have as many faces as the average south sea tokoloshe…
2 Aug 2010, 22:03 pm
haha running rugby wont win a world cup final -in the act of good sportsmanship ,i pray god,please may dan carter break an ankle ,the one he kicks with would be ideal ,amen
2 Aug 2010, 22:51 pm
@skopskiet(yliad)-140: Maybe a bit over the top but good point made.
The WC is a special competition but world dominance is better. In my book that means winning the tri nations and then wipping the NH teams at the end of year tour. Let’s be honest, the AB’s have been consistently able to do this and deserve the accolades.
Our basking in the glory of 95 and 2007 have impacted negatively on our rugby. We should have strived for world dominance. But instead administrators have played political games (internal & external), appointed bad coaches, coaches picked wrong players and the Boks were often badly prepared for matches which they should have won. But when we win the WC all is forgotten, without being grateful for the luck involved.
2 Aug 2010, 23:14 pm
@mshiniwami(mshiniwami)-123:
Isn’t it great that even at this point in his career he’s playing some of his best rugga ever!
2 Aug 2010, 23:17 pm
@diewareouboet(diewareouboet)-147: Dude, so you’re telling me you’d be happier if we won the Tri-Nations and beat England and France than be called World Champions?
People with your type of thinking are one of the reasons the Rugby World Cup doesn’t have the stature of FIFA’s World Cup and even Cricket’s World Cup. You think that if a team that doesn’t beat any of the top 3 teams in the IRB rankings can’t be called world Champion, even though some of those teams can’t even get to the final themselves.
If the AB’s can’t get to the World Cup final of a World Cup on their home soil then they don’t deserve to be the IRB’s #1 ranked team.
3 Aug 2010, 00:26 am
Nice article Keo.
RWC is demeaning and devaluing Test Rugby. And, due to its flawed format, its not even a true test of who is the “Champion”. Most of the best teams don’t even play each other. How the hell can one side be called CHAMPION in that scenario. Here’s the dictionary definition of Champion:
–noun
1.
a person who has defeated all opponents in a competition or series of competitions, so as to hold first place:
In terms of this definition, how can the winner of the RWC be called the CHAMPION of all the world’s rugby teams. They can only rightfully be called: Winner of the 20xx Rugby World Cup Tournament.
The ethos of the All Blacks is that EVERY game is important, and should be won. There’s too much history and pride gone before to do less than your best – that would be letting too many generations of players and supporters down. I would have thought that the Springboks had a similar history and ethos. From the drivel that comes from some of the punters here, that’s obviously not the case any more. The older Bokke players must be turning in their graves.
FFS, some of the Okes here are so desperate to get a win, it doesn’t matter what the quality of the opposition is. They even want to run away and play in the dross that passes for rugby up in the Northern Hemisphere. Don’t focus on and fix the core issues – just find easier opponents so that we can get that nice winning feeling again.
Personally, I’ll take the sort of rugby that the AB’s are playing now day-on-day for most of 4 years, even if it means we don’t win the RWC. I’d rather eat Fillet Steak 9 nights out of 10, and Mince on the other, than having to eat Mince most of the time.
3 Aug 2010, 00:35 am
149 EZEE-23(EZEE-23)
Well written couldn’t disagree with you W/cup but lets wait for that hurdle when it comes!! what has the bokee got to offer in the next game other than bring their discipline into line you saw your South Africa referee lay the law down in Melbourne.
3 Aug 2010, 00:58 am
@Airwell(Airwell)-68: Teens who top themselves aren’t taken out by the unarmed police, pilgrim.
3 Aug 2010, 01:19 am
Common Mark you’re going over the top a little. Yes the AB’s are playing great rugby and yes it is awesome to watch but facts are facts a true gauge on performance under pressure is the WC. The WC hasn’t cheapened int. Rugger the tri nations has and to expect the same group of players to win year in and year out is unrealistic. There is a hell of a difference between tri nations champions and WC champs and evedance of that is that even though we are the current tri nation champs commentators still call us the works champs. So yes coaches have to position themselves to perform correctly at the correct time.
3 Aug 2010, 01:30 am
@Airwell(Airwell)-68: You are an embarrasment to this forum and to your countrymen in general. Please add, by one, to the RSA suicide statistics.
3 Aug 2010, 01:37 am
@Ratel Brussow(Morne Steyn is under-rated)-75:
“When last did an All Black side actually WIN a close game?” – RB
Haven’t needed to recently because such s.h.i.t teams have been put in front of us.
3 Aug 2010, 01:39 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-150: You’re lying to yourself.
3 Aug 2010, 01:40 am
@zoo cleaner(zoo cleaner)-87:
“The ABs are not special right now.
The Boks have been woeful and the Aussies had one big game in them against us.
The Boks need proper selections and this myth of the ABs being awesome will be seriously challenged.
Also, had McCaw been carded the result could have been very different with a Bok win a possibility. The ref did influence the game and so be it but lets not over-estimate this AB side. They are not the class of 2005/2006.” – Poop scooper.
Pathetic, sour grapes, shut up!
3 Aug 2010, 01:43 am
@Cannon(Cannon)-153:
To be the best, you have to beat the best. Simple.
Under the current RWC format, that doesn’t necessarily happen. Yes – you can only play the format that is there, and can only play the teams the format throws up. But that doesn’t necessarily mean you are the best of all the teams. It just means that you have won that particular tournament.
Its like Tennis – the Wimbledon Winner, or the US Open Winner does not call himself the “World Champion”. He just says “I won the Open – I won a Grand Slam Tournament”. That’s all.
The Soccer World Cup is flawed in the same way that the RWC is.
Cricket is the game that has got it closest to right – with their Super Sixes stage – where all qualifying teams out of pools play each other before the knock-out semi/final matches.
3 Aug 2010, 01:45 am
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-156:
No mate – I’m not.
3 Aug 2010, 01:50 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-159:
What’s it like enduring 3 years of painful performances to get that one little win?
Did you enjoy your team’s performance in the Northern Tour last year? The Boks losing to Club Teams! Losing to teams that have not beaten the AB’s for 50 years or ever! Losing 3-zip in the month just gone – and playing k*k rugby. Must be be-yoo-tiful and highly satifying to watch.
Be honest with yourself mate.
3 Aug 2010, 02:03 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-157:
Quite an arrogant f u k arn’t you?
3 Aug 2010, 02:17 am
@baw(maxed)-146: what a sad case you are… didnt make it at clown school huh?
to pray an opposition player gets injured isnt very sporting at all.. Bakkies prayed, and he finally got justice 4 himself didnt he?
3 Aug 2010, 02:22 am
Biltong I hear what you saying brother but that’s the nature of South African rugby we are the most physical team on the planet that’s how we play our rugged always have and always will. Unfortuately that physicallity is not sustainable hens the odd bad result. The blacks are the Brazil of rugby theY play the beautiful game. Unfortunatly it’s also a high risk game because like Keo says there are days when the ball won’t stick and the bounce won’t go your way. Which is normally in a WC year for the AB’s.
3 Aug 2010, 02:24 am
@whatever(whatever)-161: That’s rich! Just speaking the language of some of the more infantile Japie posters here – you one too, Trevor?
3 Aug 2010, 02:26 am
so much emphasis on the world cup on this blog lately… its still a year away and there is so much other rugby still to be played..
I guess its normal though, what with the 3Ns trophy leavimg the cabinet shortly…
3 Aug 2010, 02:30 am
@baw(maxed)-146:
“haha running rugby wont win a world cup final -in the act of good sportsmanship ,i pray god,please may dan carter break an ankle ,the one he kicks with would be ideal ,amen”
Is that like saying “I hope FdP gets cancer”?
3 Aug 2010, 02:35 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-157: “McCaw been carded the result could have been very different with a Bok win a possibility”
thanks a joke of a statement, the boks would have never won that match regardless. I would agree that the abs aren’t awesome at the moment because I don’t want to start sounding like those boks fans who said before the tri nations that the boks will dominate again and they expect 15+ wins every match. What I would say is that the abs are at the moment a very good side that is building nicely for the WC. With the introductions of youngsters like Cruden, Whitelock, vito, dagg the abs are building much need depth and experience. This year we are seeing young players like Read, O Franks, Jane, Donnelly (may not be young in age but young in terms of international experience) gaining more and more experience as well as confidence. Also the old guns McCaw, mils, woodcock, thorn, joe, Carter, Nonu, Smith all lifting their games and really looking hungry for that wc spot. So if they continue with this form its should be a great wc.
3 Aug 2010, 03:02 am
@MacToogie(MacToogie)-43:
Arrogance is why the Boks are losing at the moment. Keo is giving respect where respect is due, and many of you are cutting him down for it.
Arrogance form the Bok players that said they WILL win in NZ b4 the games because God was on their side, likening the AB side to a bunch of heathens because their beliefs were just and right, despite there being many devout Christian AB players.
Arrogance from the bok captain who said after the game in AK that it wasn’t because the ABs were good, just that they were bad.
Arrogance form a coach who refuses to move with the times because his way is the right way but and the ABs must be cheating because we are losing.
Arrogance from one eyed fans who say Keo is a goose for giving respect where respect is deserved, the ABs are in the zone at the moment and deserve credit for that, well said Keo, excellent comment, just like the boks supporters of old.
The boks were a far better team than NZ last year and thoroughly deserved to win, they were simply much better and deserved kudos for it. They deserved all respect, because they adapted best to the rules and were a far better team. Why cant many of you offer the same respect in return?
In my eyes, all is not well in Bok land. As soon as you guys stop throwing mud, but most importantly start looking inwards you will fix all the problems and move forward again.
3 Aug 2010, 03:19 am
@Gooch(Gooch)-53:
Spot on, well said
3 Aug 2010, 03:46 am
I feel sick.
Post after post after post after post of MCaws a cheat, the refs are biased, the only reason we lost is because we were robbed.
I hope your coaches believe this drivel and keep the status quo, cause it just makes the ABs job so much easier.
Maybe it’s just me, I must be a freak or something, cause as a mad ABs supporter, I want nothing more than to play the best team the boks can field, I desperately want to win, but as long as the ABs give 100% on the field and we are beaten by the boks, I see honour I that. I have never accused the boks of cheating, but I do abhor foul play that too often rears it’s ugly head, and I always give credit where credit is due.
Boks have been our best opponent for 100 years, I love it when the boks are strong, bring it on, I want us to be tested against the best, and that’s the Boks.
I most be old fashioned and out of date, seems the new breed of fan cant see passed the end of their poisoned pens, and there’s plenty on both sides, sad.
3 Aug 2010, 04:24 am
@Cannon(Cannon)-153: Totally agree with Keo and totally disagree with you. The world cup is a mirage and something that we all look to four years in the future. In the now, we have reality and history will tell you how good the winners are and what sort of real champions the winners of the WC really are. New Zealand has been the only team who have won a WC that has not fallen in a heap along the way but has continually set the standards and kept the bar raised enough to maintain the Number One ranking in the World for nearly a continual period except losing it briefly to SA after the last WC. Australia has risen from the ashes a couple of times, particularly under the tempered and respectful guidance of John Eales but they as a national team have never even come close to emulating the feats of the AB’s. England, the one hit wonders who won and then lost everything They lost face and credit for not only falling in a heap after the WC (they won) but went on to become a side ridiculed for never even looking like a team that could or should have won the WC. There was as much amazement as Buster Douglas knocking out Tyson in Japan ( who the hell is Buster Douglas) and he, Buster, got creamed in his next fight by someone even worse.
Prior to the last WC, the Boks had not really done anything great, no tri-nations that I can recall off the top of my head, I think their tours were ordinary and if I remember correctly so was their S14 campaign.
Here is why the WC is really a raffle. The Boks only had to play England who in all fairness got through their assigned work load shutting down an average australian team with a pack of grumpy old men up front, but win they did. SA had only to contain them and Voila, the cup was theirs. The next couple of years belonged to the Boks in a sense, but not nearly as convincingly as how the AB’s have shaped their footy.
Even the best wins the Boks have ever had over the AB’s have only ever equalled our worst wins we have had over them.
Keo is saying what is glaringly obvious to any one who has two eyes and some objectivity,the Boks are just not as good as what some people believe. If this was the case, other teams would be trying to imitate their style as the French and Aussies are doing now in relation to the AB’s.
For me , the prize is in the here and now, the Tri-Nations, the Bledisloe, the EOYT, the continual No 1 ranking, the team that is on everyones lips and in the news. The team with players that the rest of the world love to hate and to know, without a doubt that even in the darkest recesses of the most avid ‘enemy’ supporter, they begrudgingly acknowledge we are No 1 with or without the WC.
We get called chokers as an easy biscuit, but at the end of the day we have the pleasure of seeing the Boks and Aussies choke nearly every time we play them and that my friend is what it is all about for us, not the raffle at the end of four years.
3 Aug 2010, 04:33 am
@Black Magic(Black Magic)-170:
No freak BM, I would also love to have the best team the Boks can field and if I may, also coach by the best coach we can have…
For the rest, I see a large number of people on this blog that need to realise denial in not a very long river in Egypt!
3 Aug 2010, 04:36 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-171:
Captain Fanny, it does not matter how you piant it and no matter if I agree or disagree but in the professional era the World Cup is seen as the Holy Grail by the majority of Rugby lovers…
3 Aug 2010, 04:39 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-173: Just as how the majority of German voters in 1932 saw Hitler as the right person to save Germany from ruin.
3 Aug 2010, 04:41 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-174:
Except you comparing one country with the rest of the world…but nice try.
3 Aug 2010, 04:46 am
…or are you saying that just like the majority of Germans were wrong the majority of Kiwis are also wrong?
3 Aug 2010, 04:51 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-160: As long as that little gold trophy remains in Hoskins office after 2011 then everything is gravy.
The Boks are 2 time World Champions, when John Smit tells his grandkids about his rugby playing years he’s gonna be able to show them a World Cup medal or two, what will McCaw show his grandkids?
3 Aug 2010, 05:00 am
@TheTackler(TheTackler)-174:
What world are you living in? All the rugby talk in NZ at the moment is about the WC. How to win it, have the AB’s peaked, is GH the right man, where will party central be?, who’s paying for Eden Park, is NZ too expensive for WC tourists? blah blah blah………..if you actualy believe that not to be so then you are….
a) Not reading your daily newspaper
b) Not actualy residing in NZ, the moon maybe?
c) Have your head in the sand
d) Pulling the p iss
e) All of the above
Get real dude!
3 Aug 2010, 05:05 am
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-177:
Life’s so simple when you limit it like that, isn’t it.
If you want to accept 2nd best for 75% of the time – that’s your privilege I guess.
BTW:
I refer you back to my post 158. Why does’t the Wimbledon Winner, or the US Open Winner himself the “World Champion”. He just says “I won the Open – I won a Grand Slam Tournament”. That’s all.
By the logic of the RWC, he should be able to call himself “World Champion”.
3 Aug 2010, 05:17 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-179:
Best option is to win the WC AND the games inbetween………not in my lifetime I’m guessing
3 Aug 2010, 05:19 am
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-177: AB’s let the Boks win the ’95 one and you know it.
3 Aug 2010, 05:20 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-179:
Sort of a silly analogy there, the simple answer is because there is no WC in tennis. There is however an Olympics every 4 years and since tennis was re-introduced we always hear the phrase…Piet Pompies is the current Olympic champion/gold medal winner…
This carries on for 4 years until the next Olympics…
3 Aug 2010, 05:22 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-181:
Go troll elsewhere dude……
3 Aug 2010, 05:23 am
@BillTong(BillTong)-179: That’s tennis dude. The logic behind the World Cup is that at the end of the tournament a World Champion is crowned.
3 Aug 2010, 05:25 am
The Boks scored the only try in the ’95 WC final, and everyone knows it……including you!
3 Aug 2010, 05:26 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-181: It still hurts you doesn’t it.
3 Aug 2010, 05:26 am
@whatever(whatever)-180:
Yeah. well I’d take that too
3 Aug 2010, 05:27 am
I would not swap the ABs’ series win in South Africa in 1996 for every world title there has been. That was something I never thought an ABs team would achieve. I thought I would die without seeing it. A far greater accomplishment than winning the world cup. That was the greatest victory by any NZ rugby team, ever, in over 100 years. I would love to see those Boks-ABs series come back. Four tests in NZ one year, four in SA say two years later. The world cup just could not rate with it as a rugby contest. Boks-NZ series is the ultimate.
3 Aug 2010, 05:29 am
@whatever(whatever)-183: Now, why are some allowed to make inflammatory statements (troll) and others are not?
3 Aug 2010, 05:31 am
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-186: Not as much as you are hurting now.
3 Aug 2010, 05:33 am
@Monty15(Monty15)-188: That’s your problem right there. You think the AB’s and Boks have exclusive rights to the #1 spot in world Rugby…….. England, Australia and France are just as good on their best day. get your head out of your a*sshole.
3 Aug 2010, 05:36 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-190: At least I’m admitting it. Sure the Boks being beaten is **** but we haven’t peaked yet and I know we can get better.
3 Aug 2010, 05:40 am
191. Ezee-23(Ezee-23)
Their best days are extremely rare, though. It’s like they’ve won the lottery when it happens. And if you believe it’s easier to beat the Boks in a four-match series than it is to win the world cup then clearly you’re the one with his cranium lodged a remarkable distance up his back passage.
3 Aug 2010, 05:42 am
@Monty15(Monty15)-193:
Dude, if you like *** porn, then head elsewhere………
3 Aug 2010, 05:46 am
194. whatever(whatever)
What a strange comment, that doesn’t even make sense. What are you on about?
3 Aug 2010, 05:50 am
@Ezee-23(Ezee-23)-192: you sure? players have yet to return from serious injuries, that can hamper an aging player to the point his only alternative is to enroll in the clown academy..
oh wait…
3 Aug 2010, 05:53 am
keo will do well to revisit his own articles from about a month ago! He is the one looking like unadulterated doos!
He predicted all sort of implosion and psychological babble if the all blacks don!t wing in auckland and now that they’ve done more than that and smashed the boks, can he atleast revisit his own thinking for the sake of all the Business Day readers that listened and believed his kak!
D-Day for grumpy Graham’s Fall
Blacks
The Springboks will know more important
days than Saturday. For New Zealand ’s All
Blacks it does not get bigger than having to
beat the Boks in Auckland, writes Keo in his
Business Day newspaper weekly column.
One semi-final and the final of Rugby’s
2011 World Cup will be played at Auckland’s
Eden Park. The All Blacks have not lost there
since France ’s dramatic last minute victory
in 1994. In this time they have won 21 Test
matches and locals rightly call it a fortress.
But the All Blacks know they are up against
a team of history makers and heart
breakers. The Springboks in 2008 were the
first team to beat the All Blacks in Dunedin in
100 years of Test rugby. A year later France
went south and did the same thing. Once
one has done it, others tend to follow.
There has been a gradual stripping away of
the All Blacks mystique and aura.
Among the
reasons are that the Springboks play them
three times a year, play against the same
players in Super rugby and annually visit
New Zealand more than any other rugby-
playing nation, be it for Super or Test rugby.
What was once an unknown is very much a
place of comfort.
South Africans now enjoy playing in a
country the original post isolation
generation feared. Familiarity has replaced
fear and without fear the All Blacks have
become just another opponent.
Never since South Africa’s international
return in 1992 was an All Blacks side so
easily dispatched, as was the case in South
Africa last year.
On two successive
weekends the world champions made a
meal of New Zealand ’s number one world
ranking. The All Blacks are once again
ranked number one, but as their coach says
it is hard to believe the ranking when the
side they play on Saturday are the Tri
Nations champions, the World Cup
champions and the winners of the last three
matches between the two sides.
The pressure on Saturday’s is all New
Zealand’s. In the context of the tournament
the Boks have to win one of their three tour
matches in New Zealand and Australia to set
up a successful Tri Nations defence. Two
victories will make it near impossible to lose
the title, assuming the Boks are true to
home form and don ’t lose in South Africa.
If the Boks lose in Auckland, there is
Wellington the next week and Australia in
Brisbane a week later. If the All Blacks lose, it
is greater than being beaten in a Test match.
The hosts stand to lose so much more. Gone
will be the unbeaten run, but more
significantly they will also lose the
psychological edge that they don ’t lose at
the venue that hosts the World Cup final.
The All Blacks have to beat the Springboks
two-nil at home to balance the scales
between the world ’s two strongest teams. If
the Boks leave one-a-piece it will be a good
return. If they get out of Wellington with a
series win New Zealand may as well send
their soccer team to front at next year ’s
World Cup because the fragile All Blacks
won ’t recover.
Outside of Rugby World Cup play-off
matches, Saturday is the most important
day the All Blacks have experienced for a
few decades. The consequence of defeat is
monumental and whereas they have always
enjoyed the luxury of a team selection with
no obvious weaknesses, this is an All Black
side that could possibly win. In the past it
would probably win.
The Springboks arrived in New Zealand in
two groups and have just five days before
Saturday ’s Tri Nations opener. The travel
disadvantage cannot be disputed and any
team in the tournament is most vulnerable
in the first week away from home.
The Springboks have the players capable of
)
winning, despite all the obvious hurdles, but
have New Zealand built a team capable of
causing South Africans to doubt the
Springboks for the first time since 2007? I
am not convinced they have the team, and
if the hosts get a win in Auckland it will be
down to the Boks having traveled, and they
won ’t get a second one in Wellington a
week later.
– (are you convinced now Keo?
The Springboks respect the All Blacks, but
they don ’t fear them. It is an important
distinction and if you want to know why
they don ’t fear them, look at Richie McCaw’s
record. He has lost just five times in 45 Tests
as captain of the All Blacks, but in the last 12
months – as a Crusader and All Black –
McCaw has lost seven successive times to
the Bulls, Springboks and the British
Barbarians, which included half the
successful Springbok team of 2009.
This entry was posted on Monday, July 5th,
2010
3 Aug 2010, 06:00 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-197: instead of ridiculing the hurt saffa fans who can onlt console themselves by suggesting the new zealand has again peaked early, can Keo tell us what is now the “psychological effect” on the boks of losing like that at Eden Park (the venue of the final) and again going to Brisbane ad still succumbing against their history in that stadium?
Come on Keo, revisit your won theories before attacking wonded bok fans!
3 Aug 2010, 06:19 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-197: Ouch!
3 Aug 2010, 06:59 am
Hahaha keo must be regreting ever writing that cr@p.
3 Aug 2010, 07:01 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-199:
Take a hike Troll. Your comments are boring and childish.
3 Aug 2010, 07:08 am
The All Blacks are deserved leaders and in all propability winners of this years Tri-Nations…
They are playing very good rugby.
Were there some “strange” desicions by refs, sure – but they take nothing away from the great rugby by the All Blacks.
Do we need to panick ? NO – some influential players are currently out for the Boks and WILL change the picture when they return.
Only bad thing about the All Blacks winning is that TheTackler surfaces again, seeing he is never here when they lose…
3 Aug 2010, 07:12 am
@Muttonbird(Muttonbird)-164: Feel free to visit your regular porn sites and leave the rugby punters alone
3 Aug 2010, 07:19 am
After whacking the Boks at altitude at Soccer City, the ABs will be able to claim that stadium as their “hoodoo ground” as they will never have lost any test there!
Won’t that be amusing?
3 Aug 2010, 07:20 am
That, and the instant 3-0 riposte to the Boks’ lucky streak in 2009.
3 Aug 2010, 07:58 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-201: @JL1(JL1)-203: Why are you guys being such cry-babies?
3 Aug 2010, 08:00 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-124: Soccer city was destined to be ABs toughest game of the year from the outset – away to its toughest opponent at altitude.
As to England – while any side can have its day, it’s pure support from the heart and not head to suggest a Twickenham win/draw would be on the cards with the current strongest sides. England last beat the ABs in London in 2002 and before that 1993. The 2002 side was great – putting two consecutive wins up for the only time in history between the teams. Currently England sit on 8 consecutive losses since 2004, a record. With 6 wins in 105 years it surely needs a great side like the 2003 RWC winners to be able to make that statement in all seriousness.
Ironically you argue England is on track for 2011 – just the attitude Keo is heavily critical of in the piece which begins this blog.
3 Aug 2010, 08:03 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-197:
Good post. Keo write such rubbish sometimes, and then does a 180…..
It’s slightly annoying that journo’s don’t actually have to have rugby knowledge, just a way with words.
3 Aug 2010, 08:09 am
Nothing’s changed here, I see.
3 Aug 2010, 08:20 am
“The Springboks in 2008 were the first team to beat the All Blacks in Dunedin in 100 years of Test rugby. A year later France went south and did the same thing. Once one has done it, others tend to follow.”
I’m pretty sure that honour belongs to the great John Eales’ team in 2001 – stats they can be so dangerous in the wrong hands can’t they!
3 Aug 2010, 08:21 am
@Dawn(Dawn)-209: what’s new with you Dawn? Any fresh insights on the tri-nations, currie cup?
3 Aug 2010, 08:25 am
Has that Whitelock dude surpass the record of Wynand Olivier’s test try feat? Or is he equal?
3 Aug 2010, 08:31 am
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-173: Sure I fully understand that, but it reminds me of the Aussie ice skater who o won at the Olympics because everyone better( who he was trailing) fell over and he cruised to the finish line..he won gold and good on him…best in the world, not a f’n chance.
The best in the world are those who win have the highest win rate, stay at the top or get as low as number two and then come back and hang on to the lead while everyone try’s to figure out how to beat them and when they finally do beat them they cant maintain that edge, the true champs re gather and blitz ‘em. The history shows it time and again.
We may well fall over again at the WC, but so might you and Australia…maybe one of the Pacific Islands may have a dream run. Tonga very nearly spoiled the Boks party a few years ago and it can happen again. NZ could well win everything between now and the WC and then have one bad game like we did against a France or Australia, but does that mean we arent the best in the World, nope but if the Boks are to fall in a heap well alot of people wont be very surprised in their present form. Its tough at the top mate and only the best have prolonged periods there.
3 Aug 2010, 08:44 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-213:
But you see, right there is the problem! Steve Bradbury will forever be remembered for his gold medal because he won the Olympics. Same with a World Cup, the winning team will always be remembered.
Does it make him or the world champs the best in the world, not by default but for whatever reason they managed to win the one people remember.
You can carry on about your proud record and proud you should be but I bet you a $1k that the day your team wins the WC will forever be edged in your mind and no matter what will happen after will rank as one of the best sporting moments you have EVER experienced.
3 Aug 2010, 08:48 am
WTF is this Mutton head character..if he’s a Kiwi I apologise on behalf of my countrymen and women and can only say he must come from the drug rehab on Great Barrier Is. Best to ignore him and he will be like a pimple and disappear slowly.
3 Aug 2010, 08:48 am
@Great White Shark(Predawn)-201:
Youre possibly the worst ‘troll’ on this entire site so why the fark would anyone take notice of you ?! Your comments have been ‘boring and childish’ for years but you still seem to be around…
3 Aug 2010, 09:18 am
Why the surprise re the ABs? This is why the crowing from our lot not so long ago was so clearly moronic. YES, the boks CAN and SHOULD be the equal and on occasion the better of them as we were last year, but until we actually try to understand WHY the ABs are so consistent over the years we will more often than not be on the losing side.
The KEY, Let me repeat that – the KEYYYYY – is to simply play rugby like it wa meant to be played. That means: wait for it..
GET FORWARDS WHO CAN GET QUALITY BALL TO BACKS WHO CAN USE IT. STOP THE OTHER SIDE FROM DOING THAT TOO. That is all the ABs work towards.
Think about it. That’s it. Now consider the sides who we put out over the last month and ask yourself if we ever really had a chance of doing that. Did we realise that that was what we needed to do?
3 Aug 2010, 09:21 am
@Monty15(Monty15)-188:
HEAR HEAR
Not in a million years would I swap it either. They can have all the twinkly gold cups that they like; a Series victory on the veldt against the RWC Champions, in the face of history……it does NOT get better than that !
3 Aug 2010, 09:34 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-215: Do not apologise for me you cheeky bugger. Your posts are so long-winded and dull it’s a struggle to get through them, which I don’t. Have you not heard of economy of speech or are you addicted to the sight of your own rantings and, hey, what’s this B.S. justification for not winning the Webb-Ellis trophy for 23 years? “We are number 1 so it doesn’t matter”. You’re mad are you not?
3 Aug 2010, 10:59 am
This has to be one of the most enjoyable reads from Keo in a long time. Keo unlike someguys on here respects the game of rugby. Every test is a test and should be played to win,not this oh well RWC next year.
Thank you Keo for saying this,i only wish i had said it.
3 Aug 2010, 11:02 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-220:
Its not the first Keo article you’ve read, is it ?
3 Aug 2010, 11:05 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-220: dont let keo fool you, he was stating earlier this year the demise of AB rugby, now hes changed tact? lol careful with that word “respect” and keo in the same sentence
3 Aug 2010, 11:26 am
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-221:
Why?
@poppa69(poppa69)-222:
I gave him the respect call as i to believe that every test should be played to win,unlike some of these clowns that actually disrespect the game of rugby and saying the sport only means anything every four years.
3 Aug 2010, 11:43 am
@Hurricane(Hurricane)-223:
1 thing today
Another thing tomorrow.
Thing 1 and Thing Too.
3 Aug 2010, 12:09 pm
@Slartibartfast(Slartibartfast)-214: Well right there is what it is all about for me the fan. I dont care how we ( the AB’s) will be remembered, but it is about the now for me and we are winning and winning so well and so often against current WC’s and leaving heads spinning all over the rugby planet, how we will be remembered is that when people talk rugby, they know first and foremost that rugby and champions and number one get rolled up into one team All Blacks. Yes we may be remembered, as others will as “oh that team won the WC a couple of times” but when the word rugby is mentioned we all know whose team will be remembered, if it is that important, as the team no World Champion was ever really able to ‘champion’.
3 Aug 2010, 14:38 pm
@Monty15(Monty15)-188</a@Monty15(Monty15)-188:
Second that.
3 Aug 2010, 15:05 pm
If only the WC was important and the yardstick to measure performance and merit, would we ever have legends?
3 Aug 2010, 15:16 pm
Is it only me, but I find that the 1995 WC springboks are afforded more marvel status than the 2007 WC springboks. Why? Besides the heartwarming external factors, the opposition or the difficult road to the final must have played a roll. Makes one think hey.
3 Aug 2010, 15:28 pm
@Momentum(Momentum)-228: One reason- because you beat the AB’s and with Nelson Mandelas presence it was a monumental day and win…with very worthy opponents to play, not a win over a pack of old handbags like in 2007.
3 Aug 2010, 15:36 pm
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-229:
Makes sense. Just a pity the present AB’s are not afforded the signifigance they deserve by some of us as they bring so much to the game.
3 Aug 2010, 16:08 pm
@Momentum(Momentum)-230: Yeah dead right..alotof the knockers do not want to admit who the real leaders are. this is a piece cut and pasted from somewhere which really tells us how good they are and continually strive to be:
But to suggest that rugby union is now stuck in a permanent four year cycle wholly designed around the World Cup is something of an insult to the game.
When Graham Henry and his All Blacks returned from the 2007 Rugby World Cup, there was naturally disappointment and shock that the side had been eliminated, despite entering the tournament with more form and results than any other nation.
The simple fact that while the loss to France in Cardiff hurt, nay had many All Blacks fans walking around in numb shock, their record leading up to the tournament was unequalled.
The 20-18 defeat was only the sixth since 2004, and over that time the All Blacks won 42 of 48 test matches (87.5%), thumped the British and Irish Lions 3-0, won three consecutive Investec Tri-Nations, recorded a touring Grand Slam, and maintained an iron grip on the Bledisloe Cup.
Are the All Blacks peaking too soon again?
Perhaps.
But for now the side is on a 12 match winning streak and untouched as the International Rugby Board’s number one team, is unbeaten in 2010, is but one victory from securing a 10th Tri-Nations title in 15 years, an eighth Bledisloe Cup and record equally ninth straight Wallabies victory.
The question of peaking and other such theories will only be answered in the months of September and October next year.
For now, let us just enjoy the brand of rugby this All Blacks side is exhibiting and the results they are compiling.
3 Aug 2010, 16:09 pm
..the last sentence is what it is all about..the now!!
3 Aug 2010, 17:29 pm
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-232:
Sorry captain, was on my way homefrom work.
I must agree the AB’s are leading the way at the moment with scintillating rugby. What is scary is if other teams are not in awe and remain in denial by finding all sorts of unconstructive reasons for not performing on par or better will leave us stuck in the past whilst the NLI’s are evolving rugby.
3 Aug 2010, 20:27 pm
If the ABs retain the form they are currently in, then the other nations must fall back on the bent referee option.
Worked last time…..
3 Aug 2010, 23:50 pm
@Auntie Mavis(Auntie Mavis)-234:
lol
4 Aug 2010, 00:20 am
@captain fantail(captain fantail)-231: ‘But to suggest that rugby union is now stuck in a permanent four year cycle wholly designed around the World Cup is something of an insult to the game.’
but for most nations it is true. England, France and Argentina all work on a 4 year cycle and Australia are heading that way too. I think even NZ and SA, two nations who value every test are beginning to take this outlook too. Many nations in pro rugby just aren’t set up to be competitive in every test, the physical demands of club rugby are increasing all the time.
4 Aug 2010, 04:59 am
Losing, to the New Zealand and South African rugby public is not an option. We admired the Boks last year because no one could touch them, it’s the AB’s turn… but things can change so quickly?
Aussie just aren’t world-class material yet? They’ve unearthed some great talent in Pocock, Cooper and Genia, the rest of the world teams dont strike fear into their opposition like the AB’s and the Boks do so they tend to focus on the big show.
4 Aug 2010, 08:44 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-236:
tis cr@p and you know it.
The UK teams focus as much on 6N glory as the ABs do on TriN glory.
The only teams that start talking RWC are those that have lost matches and therefore out of the 6N picture.
4 Aug 2010, 17:01 pm
gotta love a bok-supporter forum…last year your boks were “awesome” against all comers…this year its not that the ABs are any good, just that “aussie and Boks are so poor”….hahaha
…..well with that logic, your ’07 WC title was a fckn joke – knock out stages were, wait for it….FIJI, Argentina and then england….now thats a case for poor opposition (and a lucky tournament draw)…
credit, where credit due…and in turn, the rest of the rugby world may even start to like you one day
4 Aug 2010, 17:11 pm
@Black Panther(Black Panther)-238: Scotland, Ireland, Italy and Wales focus on the 6N in the knowledge their chances of winning Bill are slim at best. France most certainly look to the World Cup, they fielded kids for two years straight and they seem to be coming good right on time and MJ knows his job hinges on WC performance. Argentina aim for the WC because they don’t have a tournament in which to play and Robbie Deans has made his feelings clear this week that he’s looking at the long game. To be honest NZ and SA are the only two teams who expect to win every test, but I think that approach is getting less and less realistic in the pro era for the reason stated in my last post.
5 Aug 2010, 00:31 am
@Big Hit(Big Hit)-240:
If only-RWC matches matter these days, then why do Engl fans spank on (and on) so much about beating NZ in Wellington in 2003 ? The 13-man scrum is the story MJ gets asked most about….
Cmon, your RWC-theory is as convenient as your ‘injuries’ or ‘too tired at end/start of season’ ones you wheel out every year.
5 Aug 2010, 03:33 am
I agree as an English fan the “ we are aiming for the WC” is just a excuse for poor results and coaching, with the faint hope by some coaches that there underperforming team may get lucky at the WC and reach the semis and then they can justify there comments and past 4 years of rubbish rugby.
In all honesty the Abs , boks and the aussies have always been at the top of rugby and consistently beaten the teams below them, hence it’s a great reason for the 6 nations teams to always pull the rebuilding for the world cup dross excuse!!
As an English fan I have had to sit through 7 years of very average rugby some terrible with the odd victory over Aus and a usual 3rd or 4th place in the six nations
We always hear the injury excuse and building for WC from our coaches and fans but to me it’s all a reason for poor performance. Can you imagine how certain English fans on this blog would be reacting if they had won 13 games straight including thrashing the Boks by 20 , putting 49 points on Aus, 37 on France (in France), 66 on Ireland , 42 on Wales , we would be over the moon and I don’t think we would be pulling out the building for the cup excuse.
Sure the Abs may lose the cup it’s a one of tournament, however at least there fans get treated to a few years of brilliant rugby and results in between, we could possibly be out on the quarter finals and oh great another 4 years of rebuilding to the next WC and 3srd placing in the six nations
6 Aug 2010, 23:31 pm
@west(west)-242:
tremendous post.
BH, did you read this ?!!!!!!
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