PdV still in the dark over Butch
1 Sep 2010
GRANT BALL writes that Peter de Villiers’ refusal to hand Butch James a decent amount of game-time in his preferred position defeated the point of picking him.
James was ruled out of the Boks’ final Tri-Nations fixture with a shoulder injury, but it’s not clear how long he’ll be out for. That concludes an international season where there was little planning for the Bath flyhalf, who started his only Test of the year at inside centre and was used sparingly at No 10.
De Villiers may not have been sure of how to use him effectively off the bench – also a trend with other players throughout the De Villiers tenure – but some senior players wanted him in the squad, with reports suggesting they pushed for James to start ahead of Morne Steyn at Loftus.
That was all on the back of a season where he was in the Bok 22 in seven Tests, but started just one – in his unfavoured position of inside centre. He played a total of 138 minutes out of a possible 560, 52 of which were at No 12 against Italy in Witbank. He played just 49 minutes out of a possible 400 in the Tri-Nations in three cameos off the bench, while he wasn’t used off the wood in Wellington and at Soccer City.
These figures could be understandable if Steyn was on similar match-winning form as last year, but De Villiers didn’t have the courage or conviction to make any brave calls regarding James and Steyn. If James was so highly valued to be one of just a few overseas-based Boks in the squad, why not give him a chance to start in a Tri-Nations Test? That would have provided some evidence to finding out whether James still has it in him to start in a World Cup fixture in a year.
With the Tri-Nations title lost by the time the Boks returned home, the opportunity was there to experiment and rest over-played individuals, one of whom is Steyn. That never occurred and De Villiers said James understood the situation, but what else was the player supposed to say. Earlier in the international window during the Italian series, De Villiers already said Steyn needed a rest, but then continued to play him.
When James did get a chance to play at flyhalf, the Boks immediately looked more dangerous with ball in hand (think of the eight minutes he and Jean de Villiers formed the 10-12 combination in Auckland). He also showed his defensive ability in the closing stages at Loftus, and while he’s a vastly different alternative to Steyn, he can add value to a Bok squad.
As is the case with Frans Steyn – but for different reasons – there hasn’t been a 2010 plan with James, and therefore his potential hasn’t been maximised.
The question is what does the future hold for James? De Villiers has no grounds, barring injury, not to select him for the Grand Slam tour as he hasn’t done anything wrong, and neither has he had sufficient time to excel.
De Villiers said after the Loftus win that Steyn had been grossly over-played already this year. Selecting him for the year-end tour would be counter-productive, especially when De Villiers has players such as James and Pat Lambie at his disposal.
Whether James is good enough – and I believe he is – to be in the national squad should have been answered by now. But with De Villiers not granting him decent opportunities, the topic is still up for debate.
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88 Comments
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1 Sep 2010, 05:28 am
I’ve never quite understood the point of picking Butch, per se!
Giving him minimal game time would, I think, be a feather (one of the very few) in PdV’s cap…
1 Sep 2010, 05:29 am
Steyn’s right foot must be getting sore as he’s not used anyhing else (including his brain).
Butch gets the backline going and can defend his channel.
Yes, there’s a difference, James is moe or less the complete F/H, Steyn a one boot trick. It has been shown up in Jame’s brief time on the field.
The senior players know this. Ditto STeyn, which s why the wanted them o preven them looking supid.
But we knew these things Frodo.
Also it seems that ‘The two great SA teams’ – W and NTvL are picking the squad anyway – and it shows by the losses.
1 Sep 2010, 05:31 am
@OCO(OCO)-2:
Sorry should be “WP and NTvL.”
1 Sep 2010, 05:42 am
Steyn is improving. He is not a leader kind of flyhalf like Butch and tends play better when the scrum half dictates play.
Butch is a great player, great at intimidating chickens like Carter but he is a walking red card.
Its great we have improved allthough this has come about at better reffing.
Pdiddy made a huge mistake by not playing Butch more or selecting a future prospect like FBrummer or Ebersholm.
1 Sep 2010, 05:43 am
@OCO(OCO)-2:
Western and Northern Transvaal?
1 Sep 2010, 05:50 am
@Slartifartfast(Slartifartfast)-5:
Frikkin Laptop Keys.
1 Sep 2010, 06:00 am
Butch is perfectly armless.
1 Sep 2010, 06:38 am
butch is a sicknote! Always injured, plays 3 games or a 15minutes where he tackles hard and *poof* goes the shoulder! Leave butch at bath and draft in jaque louis potgieter already!
1 Sep 2010, 06:41 am
The only intimidation factor with butch kevinrack is when does he ever not tackle around the neck? Renowned headhunter, and you guys wonder why you’re labelled thugs?
Perhaps someone should teach him how to tackle legally. You yourself mention he’s a walking card…
1 Sep 2010, 06:48 am
Steyn has composure with the boot. But he lacks imagination.
Look at the world’s best FHs. They all have imagination. They ooze creativity. Steyn is possibly the least creative FH in the top 10 at the moment. He is utterly predictable. His lines are never imaginative. And his opposition read him like a comic book with extra big font. Which makes playing at 12 particularly difficult.
Butch is way more valuable. As is Lambie. As is F Steyn (and I don’t like him at 10), as is R Pienaar. As is Naas Olivier, as is Bjorn Basson, as is Peter Grant , as is Willem De Waal.
Fact is that we have 10′s that are better than Steyn.
Problem is we still don’t have a Carter or a Cooper.
1 Sep 2010, 06:51 am
@rugbypedia(rugbypedia)-10: is bjorn basson a flyhalf?
1 Sep 2010, 06:57 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-11: No, he is a wing and FB. But I wanted a wild card there to exaggerate my point. Should have put him last in the list.
1 Sep 2010, 07:00 am
Butch was good, but too injury prone now and the game has changed. We accept Morne is a little one dimensional but the forwards have been cr*p this 3N – no front foot ball to work with. So what do you expect ??
As we all keep saying the coaching staff are stuck in 09 mode and dont have the brains or skills to adapt a more complete game plan for the Boks. They seem to live off the work of the S14 coaches to me ..
Keep Morne and develop another FH who can do both, maybe FH if FdP comes back ?? Just an idea the kid seem to be able to play anywhere.
1 Sep 2010, 07:00 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-11: And anyone who scores 4 tries on a weekend deserves a crack at it
1 Sep 2010, 07:01 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-11: all “pedia’s” are know for their high error rate.
1 Sep 2010, 07:06 am
@RedLion is born again(RL)-15: Perhaps. But never quite as many errors as the average Red Lion.
1 Sep 2010, 07:13 am
Grant and his agenda’s
refusal is such a STRONG word
missed opportunity yes but PdV has been quite consistent with sticking with the same players
we all know tht much
so whats new Grant?
1 Sep 2010, 07:21 am
SORRY TO SAY BUT THE ARCTICLE IS SPOT ON.
tHE MAN MANAGEMENT HAS BEEN ABYSMAL….bUTCH SHOULD HAVE ,at the very least, started in Brisbane and the home leg.
MS has andalways will be a 1 trick pony, and the pony loses that trick away from Loftus.
Butch a far ,far better option.
Without P Grant, i would stick with Butch and let Morne play for Bulls.
1 Sep 2010, 07:23 am
Yeah, and creativity is SOOOO important in a world cup, right?
After all, it’s not like you can expect tight, defensive games in the World cup play offs… Who needs a drop goal specialist to bring that web ellis trophy home. No, much more useful will be a no arms high tackler who is a walking yellow card waiting to happen.
Steyn has won 2 Super 14 trophies, multiple Currie Cups, the British Lions series and a Tri Nations trophy at flyhalf, and he is still only 26. I reckon he has proved by now that he can handle pressure at the highest level.
i don’t understand this obsession with replacing him with Butch Coathanger James.
1 Sep 2010, 07:24 am
Div: Too late for Bismarck
2010-08-31 22:36Email | Print
Bismarck du Plessis (Gallo Images)
Hendrik Cronjé
Bloemfontein – Hooker Bismarck du Plessis will only know after the Springboks’ tour to Europe at the end of this year where exactly he ranks in respect of the national selectors.
Coach Peter de Villiers said that there was no truth in Du Plessis being third in the pecking order following the neck operation that effectively ruled him out of the Tri-Nations.
“If we look back scrumhalf Fourie du Preez was once in a similar position to the one Bismarck finds himself in now. He (Du Preez) only played about three games for the Blue Bulls while we played in the Tri-Nations,” said De Villiers.
“I think it’s just a little too late to bring in Bismarck. He needs game time and it won’t help our cause to give him 30 or 40 minutes at a time.
“We will enter a conditioning phase after Saturday’s match (against the Wallabies). It’s just good to keep him on the field, give him the 80 minutes that he needs and then condition him with the rest of the team as part of a unit. We will then re-examine the situation at the end of the year.
1 Sep 2010, 07:30 am
well butch does head hunt a bit but when he does tackle well he hits hard remember the hit on mortlock in the tri nations
1 Sep 2010, 07:42 am
@grant10(grant10)-18: I promise myself that I will not make snotty remarks to stupid comments today, but you’re making it very difficult.
P.Grant??? Really???? Without being sarcastic, I think that Rose is a better FH than Grant!
1 Sep 2010, 07:47 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-19: Well said!!!
MS was the best thing sice sliced bread when he slotted that penalty against the BI Lions. He is not spectacular, but does hi job very well. The gameplan revolves around him and FdP. If the loosies do their jobs by turning the ball over, we’re unstoppable. See 2009.
If Brussouw comes back, and is in good form, there is NO way this Bok team will not retain the Webb Ellis trophy.
1 Sep 2010, 07:56 am
Morne (Jannie de Beer) Steyn…..yaaawn. How come SA can produce so many quality loosies but ZERO quality all round no10s? Maybe with Jantjies and Lambie coming thru we may have that soon. Lets hope.
1 Sep 2010, 08:04 am
@Victor4CAPTAIN(UnbeataBULL)-22:
1 Sep 2010, 08:16 am
Butch and Lambie for EOYT.
1 Sep 2010, 08:18 am
Lambie will gain valuable experience from Butch on the EOYT.
1 Sep 2010, 08:19 am
19. Tacitus— WOW you are a nob must have blue blinkers on ..take them off now before it’s to late
Please remind us who was our World cup winning flyhalf ? who held it together in tight games ? (there’s no bigger game then the WC FINAL )??? think hard before you write kak !!
Besides we have Frans he can do all thr drop kicks anyway !!
1 Sep 2010, 08:37 am
@RedLion is born again(RL)-25: Proving my point re: P.Grant
1 Sep 2010, 08:39 am
@gman(gman)-28: His success rate with those drops leaves alot to be desired.
1 Sep 2010, 08:44 am
@Victor4CAPTAIN(UnbeataBULL)-23: “He is not spectacular, but does hi job very well.” That’s about the best you can say about the guy. He is good, and a great kicker and there is a place for that. Butch however does bring something extra to the party. He can be a walking sicknote and prone to the odd penalty, but this was an opportunity to see what he is still capable of. What little we have seen of him suggests that these is still some gas left in the tank.
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-19: Sometimes it is. You still have to spark the backline every once in a while, which, if you look at Butch’s play in the WC, he did do.
All WC flyhalf/Kickers were points machines, BUT they were also very creative. Think of the winners in the past, players like:
Wilkinson
Larkham
Lynagh
James
They were great creative flyhalfs. And judging by James’kicking on Saturday, somewhat of a points machine when required too.
1 Sep 2010, 08:47 am
Why Grant?
We know exactly what we have in Butch. And I have no doubt he will feature strongly on the EOYT.
1 Sep 2010, 08:52 am
Butch and Grant need to go with to the World Cup. We need the Maritzburg College Voodoo to work its magic.
1 Sep 2010, 08:54 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-19: butch has won a WC
MS away from Loftus is like a goldfish on the lounge floor…..good for mothing.
1 Sep 2010, 08:58 am
@Tacitus(Tacitus)-19:
I have no obsession with replacing him with Butch per se. Any other S14 number 10 would do…
Steyn has done well for himself. But he is no Carter. He is no Cooper. Can you imagine how those two would perform behind F du Preez or Hougie? Steyn has been very lucky to play alongside quality 9s. And when he hasn’t he has not exactly shone. I reckon Butch, Pienaar, Lambie etc would all be slotting drop goals left right and centre behind the right 9, if that is what was asked of them. Steyn is not special.
As for winning on drop goals. Just two world cups from 6 have been won this way. I don’t believe it is the way today’s rugby is being played. The others were won as follows
1987 NZ 29-9 FRA – Not won on a drop goal
1991 AU 12-6 ENG – Not won on a drop goal
1999 AU 35-12 FRA – Not won on a drop goal
2007 SA 15-6 ENG – Not won on a drop goal
How many Super 14 finals were won on drop goals?
How many Currie Cup finals have been won on drop goals?
Finally, read 28. GMAN(GMAN) – he makes a very valid point. Who was our #10 in the last world cup?
1 Sep 2010, 09:01 am
Butch
A physio’s wet dream…
1 Sep 2010, 09:06 am
@gunther(gunther)-36: I thought that was Deysel….
1 Sep 2010, 09:07 am
@Victor4CAPTAIN(UnbeataBULL)-23: we know what we have in morne ( a one-dimensional kicking machine) but we need more in a flyhalf! If we are to be a dynamic team that can change tack during a game and shift momentum we need players who are adept at decision making and morne is not one of those…
Teams down under are not scared of morne with ball-in-hand, they know whatever he does is pre-meditated. We need more!
1 Sep 2010, 09:09 am
Elton “rocketman” Jantjes..
1 Sep 2010, 09:12 am
@gunther(gunther)-39: I’m looking froward to seeing what he can do this weekend against Province. He certainly shows potential. IMO more than Lambie at 10 at this stage.
1 Sep 2010, 09:13 am
@stormersboy(stormersboy)-37: definitely that *’showpony’ Deysel..
* JustRugby spotted and pin-pointed it last year already.
1 Sep 2010, 09:15 am
These idiots who go on and on about James being a walking card need to stop living in 2001.
James has had one yellow card this season for a careless tackle. As did JdV. As did Jaque Fourie. As did Quade Cooper. As did Owen Franks. As did Drew Mitchell.
When last was James suspended for dangerous play?
I’m guessing it was YEARS back.
1 Sep 2010, 09:15 am
@Transformation(Transformation)-41: He’s a bit of a moster when he’s fit, but only plays half a season, so that’s to be expected I guess….
1 Sep 2010, 09:16 am
@Kietzphat(Kietzphat)-42:
now
he’s
just a
walking
injury
1 Sep 2010, 09:17 am
Stormersgoy…
In my mind lambie is more a 12 or 15…
However nothing wrong with a couple of options.
Jantjes has lots of time on the ball. Like all gifted sportsmen.
1 Sep 2010, 09:20 am
@gunther(gunther)-45: I agree. He’s a great talent, but like a few youngsters coming through strong this year, we’ll see if he makes it in the long run.
1 Sep 2010, 09:21 am
@gunther(gunther)-45:
racist
1 Sep 2010, 09:22 am
Slade named in All Blacks squad
9:07 AM Wednesday Sep 1, 2010 Twitter
Colin Slade comes into the All Blacks squad, replacing Dan Carter.
Uncapped Canterbury first five-eighth Colin Slade has been included in the All Blacks squad named today for the final Tri-Nations test against Australia in Sydney.
There are no surprises in the 26-man squad unveiled by coach Graham Henry, with the only question mark in the leadup surrounding who would be included as the backup first five-eighth to Aaron Cruden.
That role falls to Slade, 22, ahead of two other likely contenders – Canterbury teammate Stephen Brett and North Harbour’s Luke McAlister.
The versatile Slade was drafted into the All Blacks squad as injury cover last year and has been a regular starter for the Crusaders in a variety of positions over the past two seasons.
His form for Canterbury in recent rounds of the national provincial championship appear to have won him the nod and he is likely to be named on the reserve bench for the test.
Cruden is set to make his first test start in the test on September 11, replacing Daniel Carter, who is recuperating from ankle surgery.
Henry has stayed true to the core of his team who are unbeaten this year, including five-from-five Tri-Nations wins to seal that competition a month before its completion.
Australia have won one from four Tri-Nations tests and face South Africa in Bloemfontein this weekend before returning home for the finale.
The All Blacks gather in Auckland on Sunday and cross the Tasman that day.
All Blacks squad:
Forwards: John Afoa, Anthony Boric, Tom Donnelly, Corey Flynn, Ben Franks, Owen Franks, Jerome Kaino, Richie McCaw, Keven Mealamu, Kieran Read, Brad Thorn, Victor Vito, Samuel Whitelock and Tony Woodcock.
Backs: Jimmy Cowan, Aaron Cruden, Israel Dagg, Cory Jane, Mils Muliaina, Ma’a Nonu, Rene Ranger, Josevata Rokocoko, Colin Slade, Conrad Smith, Benson Stanley and Piri Weepu.
- NZPA
1 Sep 2010, 09:22 am
@gunther(gunther)-45:
jus
because
he’s not
part
of the
tribe
?
1 Sep 2010, 09:26 am
Porra
No racist would be if I said you were a fat smelly greengrocer who sold “overripe” fruit…
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